How efficiently does South Africa use electricity?

[Piepalook]

Apologies, you are correct. But then merely change the context of my question. Why bother load shedding in residential areas if the power which these households use is of so little consequence?

I think we are the victims.(soft targets)

 

[Moederloos]

Apologies, you are correct. But then merely change the context of my question. Why bother load shedding in residential areas if the power which these households use is of so little consequence?

I answered already.

I think we are the victims.(soft targets)

They are victimising us simply to push through the increases.


The more I look at that article, the more it stinks of error or blatant fudging.

Economic output produced per unit of electricity

As mentioned above, measuring electricity consumption per person does not really provide any direct insight into how efficiently electricity is being used. Consequently, it is necessary to calculate the value of economic output (GDP) produced for every unit of electricity consumed.

Sigh..... All it shows is the guavamint is more interested in promoting low paid jobs in power intensive industry, rather than focusing on turning SA into a information and service orientated economy. It shows nothing about power consumption or potential saving.
Just because a smelter may produce very little of value per KWh, compared to say Googles Googleplex, does not mean we can save power!

However, even adjusting for these high usage activities, it would still appear that South Africa is a very inefficient user of electricity and that saving 10% to 15% of current electricity consumed seems very possible on a sustained basis without impacting materially on the growth of the economy.

How about showing us then? How did he arrive at this figure he so much wanted to have?

Using a weight of evidence approach, all indicators reviewed in the above discussion (the low cost of electricity coupled with the high usage per person, together with the extremely low GDP per unit of electricity consumed) would suggest that South Africa should be in a position to save at least 10% to 15% of electricity consumed in South Africa without having a material impact on economic performance. The question is how best to do this and how to make sure that this is done on a sustained basis without any significant disruption to the economy.

No - the question is how you sucked that out your thumb - I see nothing to indicate that.
China is fast approaching world super power status, but has a lower GDP per KWH than our struggling economy. I fail to see how those figures mean anything. Surely China, with all her remarkable economic power, would be able to save more power then? Or are we to believe they are growing because of slovenly control?

 

[Moederloos]

I have dug around a bit more:

http://www.orielwind.com/faq.html says this of Ireland:

An average household uses about 10,655 kilowatt-hours (kWh) of electricity each year.

That is 29KW per day.

http://www.botany.uwc.ac.za/Inforeep/energy2.htm says this of SA :

Typical mid-income households spend R 150 to R 200 per month on electricity -- 500 to 800 kilowatt-hours (kWh). Most households could save 20 - 30 % of this easily.

A quick calc says R200 is 450KWh a month, or 15 a day.


Hmmm, SA uses LESS power per household than Ireland then?
So *we* are not wasteful? It is government policy that is.

It is the fact we export power at below cost.
It is that we import power from one place, only to export power back to that place - and lose on the transport.
It is that we spend more effort on getting someone to build another smelter, rather than encourage a service based economy.

I stand my ground - that report is nothing more than an attempt to serve some form of political agenda. It is far from the real story.

 

[LancelotSA]

I have dug around a bit more:

http://www.orielwind.com/faq.html says this of Ireland:

That is 29KW per day.

http://www.botany.uwc.ac.za/Inforeep/energy2.htm says this of SA :


A quick calc says R200 is 450KWh a month, or 15 a day.


Hmmm, SA uses LESS power per household than Ireland then?
So *we* are not wasteful? It is government policy that is.

It is the fact we export power at below cost.
It is that we import power from one place, only to export power back to that place - and lose on the transport.
It is that we spend more effort on getting someone to build another smelter, rather than encourage a service based economy.

I stand my ground - that report is nothing more than an attempt to serve some form of political agenda. It is far from the real story.

Now you compare two radically different figures and I am meant to bow at your feet and accept what you say, but figures submitted by a respected economist at South Africa's top domestic asset management company (Raging Bull awards) are pure garbage?

Without even bothering to look into your figures in much detail I am concerned that your figures for South Africa's "typical mid income" usage comes from a webpage for which I am battling to find many references. They also use those very figures you quote to state that households should be saving 20-30%.... more than the article I quoted! So thanks!

Your quoted Irish figures seem to take into account a different demographic as they quote an "average household"... quite a vague term.

 

[Moederloos]

Now you compare two radically different figures and I am meant to bow at your feet and accept what you say, but figures submitted by a respected economist at South Africa's top domestic asset management company (Raging Bull awards) are pure garbage?

Without even bothering to look into your figures in much detail I am concerned that your figures for South Africa's "typical mid income" usage comes from a webpage for which I am battling to find many references. They also use those very figures you quote to state that households should be saving 20-30%.... more than the article I quoted! So thanks!

Your quoted Irish figures seem to take into account a different demographic as they quote an "average household"... quite a vague term.

And your illustrious economist fails to show how we can achieve these savings with no economic impact.
He begins with:

SA should be in a position to save at least 10% to 15% of electricity consumed without having a material impact on economic performance.

goes on to spew a heap of comparisons, and never once mentions how it is to be achieved.

A complete waste of time.


As to your "quite a vague term" - how on earth is it any vaguer than quoting China as a whole?


You seem hell bent on proving SA to be worthwhile - despite any and all evidence to the contrary.

 

[Piepalook]

And your illustrious economist fails to show how we can achieve these savings with no economic impact.
He begins with:

goes on to spew a heap of comparisons, and never once mentions how it is to be achieved.

A complete waste of time.


As to your "quite a vague term" - how on earth is it any vaguer than quoting China as a whole?


You seem hell bent on proving SA to be worthwhile - despite any and all evidence to the contrary.

Some people on this forum are so positive about South Africa they can't see the forrest for the trees.
On another thread on this same forum is an article on bussiness confidence.
Not positive at all.
Seems that distortion of the truth is contagious.
All you have to do is say exactly the opposite of what is going on and everybody is happy.
Unfortunately this only happens in the never ending story.
This is real life.

 

[chiskop]

If you have enough energy to respond then please at least have enough to read everything.... it makes responses pretty pointless if you haven't. But I will not be so rude as to ignore what you posted....

Without even bothering to look into your figures in much detail I am concerned that your figures for South Africa's "typical mid income" usage comes from a webpage for which I am battling to find many references.

 

[LancelotSA]

Smart ar_e!

If you bothered reading things properly you will see that I said nothing about not reading his post. I read it. I just did not have the time to do research into the figures he was quoting and answered on the face value of what he quoted.

PS Well done on another post to add to your count for a mere rolling eyes smiley!

 

[Moederloos]

PS Well done on another post to add to your count for a mere rolling eyes smiley!

 

[LancelotSA]

Ditto! (Hey I can get in on this too!)

PS How long does the packing take?