How many people can the earth support?

[Techne]

Of course the WWF thinks that. They think people are the problem, which is why they hate humanity.

Yeah well, one has to wonder why people take the WWF seriously these days...

 

[Arthur]

Yeah well, one has to wonder why people take the WWF seriously these days...

There's a long and a short answer. Short: people see that people are messing up rather badly and so conclude that people are the problem. The fallacy is they think that limiting people will limit the problems. But the problem is not one of numbers or quanta. It's a moral problem, and only sound morality can address it. And for many, especially in the fat, lazy, effete West, that's a price too high. We're morally confused because we are philosphically confused and we stumble about saying "whose morality?" They are of course being selected out.

 

[elf_lord_ZC5]

Either to damn many, or not enough, depending on your point of view/polarity whatever ...

 

[Nerfherder]

It's a moral problem, and only sound morality can address it.

I don't think you have picked the correct word. Who's morals are you going to pick ?

Because it sounds like you are referring to Christian morals and you want target sins like greed and lust.
Remember then that phrases like "Go forth and multiply" and "God will provide" also come out of that same bible, and those two phrases are the real cause of our problems.

The fallacy is they think that limiting people will limit the problems.

Rubbish... its not a fallacy its just simplistic and partly impractical.
Limiting the amount of people on the planet is a long term solution to a problem that needs immediate attention.
There is no "nice" or diplomatic way to solve this problem immediately.

 

[Elimentals]

My tweet from a couple of days ago should be relevant to where we heading:

Science: So you can learn how to clone a T-Rex.
Philosophy: So you can learn that its a bad idea.
Religion: So you can pretend they did not exist in the 1st place.

 

[Techne]

There's a long and a short answer. Short: people see that people are messing up rather badly and so conclude that people are the problem. The fallacy is they think that limiting people will limit the problems. But the problem is not one of numbers or quanta. It's a moral problem, and only sound morality can address it. And for many, especially in the fat, lazy, effete West, that's a price too high. We're morally confused because we are philosphically confused and we stumble about saying "whose morality?"

I agree, meta-ethical moral relativism in all its guises cannot be good for any society. And you know the story, people are morally confused because they fall for all kinds of anti-intellectual philosophies e.g. mechanism, atomism, materialism, naturalism and various combinations of the above... People need to read more about Aristotle and his followers regarding natural law ethics...

They are of course being selected out.

Gosh, by K-selected individuals....?

 

[noxibox]

There's no reason to think we cannot support a lot more people with better technology.

I believe the entire world's population can fit into a land mass the size of Australia

So it's true, we are all going to burn in hell.

Philosophical Answer:
I think when it comes to human minds we went over the population limit back in the early 1800/1900's. The side effects of adding more than what is seen as perfect balance causes problems like crime and violence.

No-one who has ever read anything about what life was like in those days would say that.

I agree, meta-ethical moral relativism in all its guises cannot be good for any society. And you know the story, people are morally confused because they fall for all kinds of anti-intellectual philosophies e.g. mechanism, atomism, materialism, naturalism and various combinations of the above... People need to read more about Aristotle and his followers regarding natural law ethics...

It's a bit silly to complain about rethinking and reworking morals, then fall back on some guy who thought up some moral ideas long ago.

 

[Techne]

It's a bit silly to complain about rethinking and reworking morals, then fall back on some guy who thought up some moral ideas long ago.

Who complained about rethinking and reworking morals? That is for people who think morality is an empirical issue.

 

[Devill]

With more challenges comes more invention.

Vertical farms are changing the outlook of space needed for crops.

New ways of water purifiction and energy "production" is only becoming more commercial.

It will come down to the tech we have.

 

[empirex]

Greed and territorial disputes will always put earth's resources (including land) under pressure no matter the size or scale.
Geographical "borders" as defined by sovereign states are the problem, not space itself; as many are out of proportion to their population size, and/or fail to utilise the land effectively.

 

[empirex]

Of course the WWF thinks that. They think people are the problem, which is why they hate humanity.

You mean the World Wildlife Fundamentalists

Only global poverty can save the planet, insists WWF
Extremist green campaigning group WWF - endorsed by no less a body than the European Space Agency - has stated that economic growth should be abandoned, that citizens of the world's wealthy nations should prepare for poverty and that all the human race's energy should be produced as renewable electricity within 38 years from now.

Most astonishingly of all, the green hardliners demand that the enormous numbers of wind farms, tidal barriers and solar powerplants required under their plans should somehow be built while at the same time severely rationing supplies of concrete, steel, copper and glass. more

 

[killadoob]

Of course the WWF thinks that. They think people are the problem, which is why they hate humanity.

By 2030 we will be in trouble, they are right humanity, we are a virus sucking the life out of this planet. We are consuming far more than we need to and we do not care how we go about it.

WWF is right about humanity but mother earth will put us in our place at some point.

 

[empirex]

By 2030 we will be in trouble, they are right humanity, we are a virus sucking the life out of this planet. We are consuming far more than we need to and we do not care how we go about it.

WWF is right about humanity but mother earth will put us in our place at some point.

That makes no sense? The Happening was a movie, not reality.

 

[Geriatrix]

That makes no sense? The Happening was a movie, not reality.

I think what he means is that our population would only be sustained as far as naturally possible.

 

[Arthur]

we are a virus sucking the life out of this planet

C'mon Killa. You know better than that. Life is beautiful. The more we have the better. It's not something we suck out of mama erf.

 

[empirex]

I think what he means is that our population would only be sustained as far as naturally possible.

Ah ok, yeah that makes sense.
So no retribution Avatar-style

 

[Geriatrix]

Ah ok, yeah that makes sense.
So no retribution Avatar-style

No. Unless you take copious amounts of mushrooms.

 

[killadoob]

I think what he means is that our population would only be sustained as far as naturally possible.

In a way yes but i find the earth tries to keep a balance, we are not keeping a balance which means we must go. I know it sounds crazy but i think the earth at some point will get rid of the imbalance. Disease will come, massive disasters will become a daily thing because the cleansing has begun. Hahaha i know i sound crazy but we have gone beyond what we need and the earth cannot sustain us for much longer.

We are ignoring the signs, we just carry on like we are not doing anything wrong. I hope i am wrong but we are destroying forests, polluting rivers, oceans and so on, not to mention we treat life like rubbish. Buckle up.

 

[Geriatrix]

In a way yes but i find the earth tries to keep a balance, we are not keeping a balance which means we must go. I know it sounds crazy but i think the earth at some point will get rid of the imbalance. Disease will come, massive disasters will become a daily thing because the cleansing has begun. Hahaha i know i sound crazy but we have gone beyond what we need and the earth cannot sustain us for much longer.

We are ignoring the signs, we just carry on like we are not doing anything wrong. I hope i am wrong but we are destroying forests, polluting rivers, oceans and so on, not to mention we treat life like rubbish. Buckle up.

Ah so you did mean Avatar style. Oh well, either way, our population would only be sustained as far as natural conditions allow for it.

 

[killadoob]

Ah so you did mean Avatar style. Oh well, either way, our population would only be sustained as far as natural conditions allow for it.

In a way yes, i believe earth sets out to provide a balance so all life can thrive. Now the human race is so advanced that the balance is no longer there, we are destroying life and plantation at an incredible rate plus we are polluting something crazy. The balance has shifted and life can longer thrive while we are around and it's rapidly getting worse.

While we think we are amazing and we think we can do what we like the planet will not allow a species to carry on like we are. We may be able to cure sickness and we may be advanced in medicine but there is nothing we can do about the weather and earth quakes and at some point the planet is going to turn on us because the balance is no longer there and to get back to that place the planet needs to remove us and it has happened in the past. It sounds like i am some crazy that believes the planet is living breathing thing that will destroy us which i could be but there is way to more to this planet than just some random thing sitting somewhere in space. The way everything seemed so balanced doesn't seem random to me but it could be.

The planet is get angrier though and we could start to understand that very shortly if we do not start to clean up our act but we are to far gone to recover so there is really only one answer for us, that is mother earth deciding our species has gone long on enough .

/crazy out.