Inaccurate Fuel Pumps

[LCBXX]

That wouldn’t matter though, it’s already been measured at the pump and the numbers would simply go up if it dribbled.

And then it would have gone over R450.

What's so important about the R450...?

 

[SauRoNZA]

I also use Fuelly and I have had two occasions were it was out by a cent or two but it was always in my favour.

I have been tracking my fuel since 2015.

Yeah we don’t regard single cents in our economy at all any more so that adds up.

 

[SauRoNZA]

What's so important about the R450...?

No no, it could be any value was just sticking to your example where a cut off was added to the metering.

I wouldn’t be surprised if there is a delay being compensated for when using a preset limit and hence this problem coming up.

It protects them from running over and needing to ask you for more money which is going to cause way more kak.

Would be interesting to hear from the fuel station if you get anything back. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if this is covered in T&C’s somewhere if you choose to use a metered limit.

 

[Neuk_]

Pumps should be calibrated as part of regular maintenance. The garage should have a certificate of when the last time the pumps were calibrated. It's not done very regularly. Maybe the rules have changed since I left the industry. But if you ask the manager or owner, they should be able to tell you.
Edit: if I remember correctly there is about a 0.5% to 1% margin for error. It's been a long time so don't quote me on this

Margin for Error of what exactly? I would imagine the amount pumped as there can be very little margin of error for a simple mathematics calculation to get the cost.

 

[SauRoNZA]

Margin for Error of what exactly? I would imagine the amount pumped as there can be very little margin of error for a simple mathematics calculation to get the cost.

The pump stopping/starting quickly enough.

This isn’t a problem of calculating the cost so much as stopping the pump in a timely manner.

Not an issue when you are filling up, but a bigger problem when there is a value preset.

So you put a margin of error in favouring the fuel station, otherwise you have customers losing their mind if they now need to pay R451 which they didn’t ask for and don’t have on them.

 

[Forum Reader]

Yeah 40odd kilograms isn’t going to change anything meaningful.

200kg maybe…a very big maybe.

Pointless either way if you lose all those savings driving to the garage again and waiting in the queue.

The time is lost every time no matter the difference of 0.001% in economy gained.

Would be interesting to see if it addresses your accuracy problem though.

There's a rough rule. A 5% reduction in weight gets you about 2% better fuel economy.

40kg of the average car weight of 1500kg (with people inside) is 2.7%. So this results in about 1.1% better fuel economy. So if you spend R1000 you save R11 but have to make twice as many trips.

Yep it's not worth it do ever do half tanks.

 

[LCBXX]

Margin for Error of what exactly? I would imagine the amount pumped as there can be very little margin of error for a simple mathematics calculation to get the cost.

For me the point is that you'll be fscked if you pay 7c short after getting fuel dispensed.

Why should it be OK for be short-fuelled?

Regulated petrol price must equate accurate petrol dispensing.

 

[SauRoNZA]

Thinking about it this would be more likely to happen if the pump jockey is putting the pump on full lock and letting it stop itself at the hard limit of R450, rather than doing it by hand and easing off the last R5 or so and trickling it into the tank as there would be much less chance of overrun.

So could you remember if that was the case when it was inaccurate @LCBXX?

 

[SauRoNZA]

For me the point is that you'll be fscked if you pay 7c short after getting fuel dispensed.

Why should it be OK for be short-fuelled?

Regulated petrol price must equate accurate petrol dispensing.

Would you be more okay being asked for R1 more which you don’t have on you? Since you insisted on R450 exactly.

Which is going to be more problematic for the Fuel Station you think?

 

[LCBXX]

Thinking about it this would be more likely to happen if the pump jockey is putting the pump on full lock and letting it stop itself at the hard limit of R450, rather than doing it by hand and easing off the last R5 or so and trickling it into the tank as there would be much less chance of overrun.

So could you remember if that was the case when it was inaccurate @LCBXX?

No I didn't watch while the process was happening, I was fiddling with Fuelly. It was when I put in the price/litre and then the total liters dispensed, according to the pump, that Fuelly showed R443.13 instead of R450.

 

[LCBXX]

Would you be more okay being asked for R1 more which you don’t have on you? Since you insisted on R450 exactly.

Which is going to be more problematic for the Fuel Station you think?

I'b be okay if I get the correct amount of litres of petrol when I pay R450/R700/R1000.

 

[Pak Fa Fui]

Only reason I can think would be a delay in the cut off or some such to make sure it doesn’t run over. They’ll have a lot more issues when it goes over R450 and the person only has R450 etc.

But I mentioned it more as a difference between how we fill up and the anomaly that could be the difference.

Ergo, it’s the one thing he does differently and he is the one reporting inaccurate measures.

By his calculations the a R7 difference, that’s a 300ml/ish difference in quantity that he claims has been miscalculated. Assuming he is correct. This deficit would have happened anyway with such a large difference in calibration. If he filled up the difference could be more than R7.

you are projecting on how you live your life is irrelevant to the discussion. There a thousands of people that fill up with a monetary value, everyone that chooses not to fill the tank will choose a monetary value. That’s not the topic, the topic is also not about you.

 

[The_Ogre]

On this topic.

Many years ago , a guy I used to know worked as a petrol attendant. He told me on weekends they used to coin it with drunk people. If they're done with one car, they don't reset the pump, instead, they took the nozzle out of one car and moered it straight into the next. Especially if the drunk guy went to go take a piss.

If both paid cash, they made double the amount. If one pays cash and the other by card, they pocket the cash amount. if both paid by card, they wait until they get cash victims and pocket the cash amount equivalent to the amount above.

 

[HumanShield]

Margin for Error of what exactly? I would imagine the amount pumped as there can be very little margin of error for a simple mathematics calculation to get the cost.

The pump may show you that you've dispensed 1L, for example, but there is still quite a bit of fuel in the hose.

 

[The_Ogre]

No no, it could be any value was just sticking to your example where a cut off was added to the metering.

I wouldn’t be surprised if there is a delay being compensated for when using a preset limit and hence this problem coming up.

It protects them from running over and needing to ask you for more money which is going to cause way more kak.

Would be interesting to hear from the fuel station if you get anything back. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if this is covered in T&C’s somewhere if you choose to use a metered limit.

This isn't the 60's. With modern pumps, they enter the amount in Rands or Litres and go clean your windscreen or something. The software will stop the flow of fuel once it reaches the required amount.

 

[The_Ogre]

The pump may show you that you've dispensed 1L, for example, but there is still quite a bit of fuel in the hose.

It evens out, because when you got to the pump, they previous guy's fuel was in the hose and is now inside your tank.

 

[SauRoNZA]

By his calculations the a R7 difference, that’s a 300ml/ish difference in quantity that he claims has been miscalculated. Assuming he is correct. This deficit would have happened anyway with such a large difference in calibration. If he filled up the difference could be more than R7.

you are projecting on how you live your life is irrelevant to the discussion. There a thousands of people that fill up with a monetary value, everyone that chooses not to fill the tank will choose a monetary value. That’s not the topic, the topic is also not about you.

You are the one making every topic about me buddy, it’s all in your own head. Projection on your part I’m afraid, if you don’t like it there’s an ignore button just for you.

Everyone else is having a perfectly normal discussion while you have your little victim complex in the middle. Get over it.

I’m simply illustrating why this method would be more prone to a calculation problem over simply filling it up.

 

[SauRoNZA]

This isn't the 60's. With modern pumps, they enter the amount in Rands or Litres and go clean your windscreen or something. The software will stop the flow of fuel once it reaches the required amount.

And that is what would account for the margin of error we were discussing and favour it towards the petrol station.

These things pump an insane amount of litres per second at full tilt, it would make a lot of sense that there is some overage.

 

[Neuk_]

I've been recording my petrol fill-ups for a year or so and on the odd occasion, the cost of the fuel and the litres dispensed are not accurate, with every inaccuracy being less fuel dispensed.

For the most part, the fuel dispensed is accurate.

An example was just now at an Engen: I asked for R450 @ R21.51/L, which should amount to 20.92-litres being dispensed. The reading on the pump showed 20.601-litres. Sure, it's only R7 and an error of 1.5%, for me, but another person filling a 80-litre tank will get fscked out of a lot more than R7.

Anyone else noticing this?

I have reread this, if the pump showed 20.601l dispensed then you should have only paid R443.13, if I understand you correctly?

 

[TheChamp]

For me the point is that you'll be fscked if you pay 7c short after getting fuel dispensed.

Why should it be OK for be short-fuelled?

Regulated petrol price must equate accurate petrol dispensing.

My guy at my local filling station never adds the extra cents even when the reading goes over, so there are times when I get 5 to 10 cents extra of fuel mahala.