IS / SAIX - Comments from BudgetADSL

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WickedWeasel

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Before I get accused of anything, I own ODS and BudgetADSL.

I have been testing accounts as we want to implement the best solution for our clients.

1. Saix ADSL (3gb Local and International Capped)

- All International via fiber (Sat3)
- Skype works
- Lower latency
- Local sites are not very fast
- International very fast

2. IS ADSL (3gb on International, 30 gb International)

- International via satellite
- No Skype
- No Voip
- Good local speeds to IS / Datapro / UUnet
- International a bit slow
- unreliable at the moment

So you guys tell me what you prefer ? PM me
 
Erm right, what kind of testing did you do and this does deserve a "bit of flaming" cause its based on some arb stats?

1.) Skype on IS compared to SAIX, SAIX 0 IS 10
2.) VOIP on IS compared to SAIX, same score SAIX 0 IS 10
3.) IS seem to be having some problems atm, how many problems have SAIX been having recently?
3.) SAIX hardcap, IS softcap.. up to 30gig local, not international as you state.

Seriously, I dont think you did any decent testing by simply looking at your skype/voip feedback about IS.
 
Clipse, I have tested this from the following,

1. A normal ping test (10 pings, two diffrent hosts)

2. Traceroutes to 5 sites

3. I run 4 SIP servers for local and International Calling Tests from the SIP servers indicate Saix is working better than IS at the moment,

4. Based on the following SAT3 give latency of 200-300 ms while satelite give you 600-700, so Voip would work on saix a little better.

I am not flamming, I am offering both to clients, I just want to know what other peoples results are.
 
WickedWeasel said:
4. Based on the following SAT3 give latency of 200-300 ms while satelite give you 600-700, so Voip would work on saix a little better.
Click to expand...

Clearly your talking crap right there, 200-300ms over shaped adsl? Even unshaped get lowest 260ms.

Are you comparing shaped saix with IS? or unshaped saix with IS?
 
WickedWeasel said:
4. Based on the following SAT3 give latency of 200-300 ms while satelite give you 600-700, so Voip would work on saix a little better.
Click to expand...

Clearly your talking crap right there, 200-300ms over shaped adsl? Even unshaped get lowest 260ms.

Are you comparing shaped saix with IS? or unshaped saix with IS?

Please show me ur shaped SAIX 200-300ms, Ill lick your boots :)
 
I am comparing Shapped and Unshapped, on the latency unshapped, in addtion our vpn server which we link to London with get ping times of no more than 200 ms so add 40ms for local adsl and you got 240ms to london.

I will send you a traceroute if you want, but I am not here to argue, I just want to know what people feel ?
 
Please send me a traceroute, or I will argue, because I simply dont believe you atm :)

Its a bold latency statement you have made here, and remember the latency you talk about, each adsl user should get. Clearly if you talk about SAIX unshaped, your sort of within bound of your currently latency stats, but everyone will not look at unshaped saix accounts.

From a shaped saix perspective, your comparisons is very flawed.
 
I agree, these are based on unshapped, as I think thats the only fair way to compare to IS ?


Tracing route to www.l.google.com [64.233.161.99]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 53 ms 50 ms 67 ms 209.203.7.137
2 54 ms 75 ms 82 ms 209.203.52.1
3 59 ms 34 ms 97 ms 209.203.57.225
4 55 ms 76 ms 50 ms 209.203.46.249
5 54 ms 63 ms 66 ms 196.41.30.18
6 56 ms 42 ms 98 ms 196.41.30.1
7 264 ms 249 ms 246 ms 196.41.24.233
8 245 ms 272 ms 253 ms 213.248.100.145
9 293 ms 302 ms 283 ms 213.248.100.221
10 261 ms 270 ms 247 ms 213.248.74.1
11 1128 ms 1148 ms 1119 ms 213.248.65.150
12 268 ms 261 ms 270 ms 213.248.64.158
13 275 ms 250 ms 271 ms 80.231.80.9
14 325 ms 347 ms 370 ms 80.231.80.2
15 522 ms 415 ms 387 ms 195.219.196.1
16 329 ms 327 ms 323 ms 195.219.196.18
17 344 ms 324 ms 328 ms 216.6.63.22
18 333 ms 358 ms 334 ms 209.58.27.130
19 * 345 ms 352 ms 216.239.47.153
20 329 ms 320 ms 364 ms 216.239.49.246
21 325 ms 320 ms 334 ms 64.233.161.99

Trace complete.

Over a shapped account into a VPN
 
Last edited:
Unshaped dedicated fibre link compared to IS shaped adsl account?

I kinda do not see the fair comparison here?

How about comparison the dedicated unshaped fibre hosting with saix unshaped fibre hosting.

Now we are talking apples vs apples, and $$$$ vs $$$$

To do a adsl comparison, use ADSL vs ADSL, and please I would really want to see your traceroute that you suggested you would show me.
 
From My unshapped VPN BOX.

core.rtr.jhb.za.ods#traceroute www.google.com

Type escape sequence to abort.
Tracing the route to www.l.google.com (66.102.9.104)

1 209.203.57.225 4 msec 4 msec 4 msec
2 209.203.46.249 16 msec 12 msec 12 msec
3 196.41.30.18 12 msec 12 msec 16 msec
4 rtr-g0-2.jhb-wav.net.datapro.co.za (196.41.30.1) 20 msec 12 msec 12 msec
5 jhb-wav-t1--ldn-tci-t1.net.datapro.co.za (196.41.24.233) 196 msec 184 msec 1 80 msec
6 ldn-b2-geth10-0-206.telia.net (213.248.100.145) 220 msec 288 msec 184 msec
7 ldn-b2-geth4-0.telia.net (213.248.100.221) 188 msec 184 msec 184 msec
8 ldn-b1-pos9-1.telia.net (213.248.74.38) 184 msec 184 msec 188 msec
9 google-104716-ldn-b1.c.telia.net (213.248.74.194) 192 msec 196 msec 224 msec
10 72.14.238.246 192 msec 72.14.238.242 192 msec 192 msec
11 216.239.43.91 196 msec 192 msec 216.239.49.254 216 msec
12 216.239.48.146 216 msec 64.233.174.42 260 msec 216.239.48.146 216 msec
13 64.233.174.112 224 msec 64.233.174.14 208 msec 208 msec
14 www.l.google.com (66.102.9.104) 204 msec 204 msec 204 msec
core.rtr.jhb.za.ods#

Now thats fast enough add 40 ms to that and ?
 
IS is congested between SAIX/IS during the day, same as UUNET. At night they're fine tho.
 
Sigh wickedweasel, that 200ms is not an unshaped ADSL account.. second of all your 325ms is shaped adsl.

Now where does your 200-300ms come in play, shaped adsl doesnt offer 325ms odd via voip/skype because once data is transmitted it gets shaped.

ICMP is not shaped, your still not doing any apples vs apples comparison.

The truth is, even tho shaped saix get 325ms via ICMP(ie unshaped) as soon as you hit any data streams internationally, it gets shaped to well over 1000ms with loss of packets.

Any saix shaped users want to comment on it, feel free.
 
I concur with clipse on this pinging means nothing because shaping rules don't get applied to it. The best way to test out saix ping times is by using a mmorpg that informs the user of their ping like world of warcraft.

Last time I logged onto world of warcraft with my shapped saix account the ping times fluxuated between 2000 and 28000.
 
WickedWeasel said:
From My unshapped VPN BOX.

core.rtr.jhb.za.ods#traceroute www.google.com

Type escape sequence to abort.
Tracing the route to www.l.google.com (66.102.9.104)

1 209.203.57.225 4 msec 4 msec 4 msec
2 209.203.46.249 16 msec 12 msec 12 msec
3 196.41.30.18 12 msec 12 msec 16 msec
4 rtr-g0-2.jhb-wav.net.datapro.co.za (196.41.30.1) 20 msec 12 msec 12 msec
5 jhb-wav-t1--ldn-tci-t1.net.datapro.co.za (196.41.24.233) 196 msec 184 msec 1 80 msec
6 ldn-b2-geth10-0-206.telia.net (213.248.100.145) 220 msec 288 msec 184 msec
7 ldn-b2-geth4-0.telia.net (213.248.100.221) 188 msec 184 msec 184 msec
8 ldn-b1-pos9-1.telia.net (213.248.74.38) 184 msec 184 msec 188 msec
9 google-104716-ldn-b1.c.telia.net (213.248.74.194) 192 msec 196 msec 224 msec
10 72.14.238.246 192 msec 72.14.238.242 192 msec 192 msec
11 216.239.43.91 196 msec 192 msec 216.239.49.254 216 msec
12 216.239.48.146 216 msec 64.233.174.42 260 msec 216.239.48.146 216 msec
13 64.233.174.112 224 msec 64.233.174.14 208 msec 208 msec
14 www.l.google.com (66.102.9.104) 204 msec 204 msec 204 msec
core.rtr.jhb.za.ods#

Now thats fast enough add 40 ms to that and ?
Click to expand...

Ok seriously something in this traceroute doesnt make sense.. hop12 you get 260msec and then at hop14 you get 204ms..

Can you please show traceroute with the result statistics at the bottom..
 
fake or real

please tell me ppl
12 216.239.48.146 216 msec 64.233.174.42 260 msec 216.239.48.146 216 msec

how the hell does it go up then down
that doesnt work at all

The average is the diff between the lowest and highest
but yet your ave is exactly the same as you lowest......
wickedweasel did you fake this ?????

DUDE
 
Its direct from my router will paste it from a bigger telenet session as I think it word wraps,

core.rtr.jhb.za.ods#traceroute
Protocol [ip]:
Target IP address: 66.102.9.99
Source address: 209.203.52.1
Numeric display [n]: y
Timeout in seconds [3]:
Probe count [3]:
Minimum Time to Live [1]:
Maximum Time to Live [30]:
Port Number [33434]:
Loose, Strict, Record, Timestamp, Verbose[none]:
Type escape sequence to abort.
Tracing the route to 66.102.9.99

1 209.203.57.225 4 msec
2 209.203.46.249 52 msec
3 196.41.30.18 12 msec
4 196.41.30.1 12 msec
5 196.41.24.233 184 msec
6 213.248.100.145 188 msec
7 213.248.100.221 188 msec
8 213.248.74.38 184 msec
9 213.248.74.194 224 msec
10 72.14.238.242 196 msec
11 216.239.43.91 196 msec
12 64.233.174.42 204 msec
13 64.233.174.22 284 msec
14 66.102.9.99 280 msec
core.rtr.jhb.za.ods#

From Linux Box

linus-jhb1:~# traceroute www.google.com
traceroute: Warning: www.google.com has multiple addresses; using 66.102.9.147
traceroute to www.l.google.com (66.102.9.147), 30 hops max, 38 byte packets
1 209-203-52-1.network.ods.co.za (209.203.52.1) 1.872 ms 1.514 ms 1.289 ms
2 209.203.57.225 (209.203.57.225) 3.052 ms 2.724 ms 2.297 ms
3 209.203.46.249 (209.203.46.249) 51.506 ms 21.722 ms 10.832 ms
4 196.41.30.18 (196.41.30.18) 12.617 ms 9.947 ms 11.199 ms
5 rtr-g0-2.jhb-wav.net.datapro.co.za (196.41.30.1) 12.845 ms 12.469 ms 12.748 ms
6 jhb-wav-t1--ldn-tci-t1.net.datapro.co.za (196.41.24.233) 183.748 ms 219.076 ms 198.134 ms
7 ldn-b2-geth10-0-206.telia.net (213.248.100.145) 250.827 ms 208.518 ms 205.771 ms
8 ldn-b2-geth4-0.telia.net (213.248.100.221) 185.849 ms 187.358 ms 182.640 ms
9 ldn-b1-pos9-1.telia.net (213.248.74.38) 184.989 ms 182.092 ms 182.335 ms
10 google-104716-ldn-b1.c.telia.net (213.248.74.194) 193.675 ms 193.912 ms 203.905 ms
11 72.14.238.242 (72.14.238.242) 191.659 ms 72.14.238.246 (72.14.238.246) 192.002 ms 192.986 ms
12 216.239.49.254 (216.239.49.254) 214.565 ms 215.670 ms 212.323 ms
13 66.249.95.167 (66.249.95.167) 214.349 ms 212.041 ms 214.139 ms
14 64.233.174.18 (64.233.174.18) 204.890 ms 64.233.174.22 (64.233.174.22) 205.959 ms 202.337 ms
15 66.102.9.147 (66.102.9.147) 203.487 ms 202.559 ms 203.457 ms
linus-jhb1:~#
 
Last edited:
If you are trying to promote ADSL stats then you should realy paste pings/tracerts that originate from your adsl connection :rolleyes:

The same shaping rules are not applied to dedicated lines/hosts
 
Weasel what is the overlapping stats, the bottom one show 203ms and the upper one 280ms..

These stats aint to clear, so it would help knowing which is pinging what.
 
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