Is there a future for applicaion development?

[MveloWalaza]

The reason I'm asking is that almost everyone is going the web route these days... Even when one looks at job sites, you hardly see any core application development positions (J2SE).

Do you guys think there is still a future for us application developers out there? Or should we start upskilling ourselves and learning web development (J2EE)?

:wtf:

regards,

 

[icyrus]

There will always be a market for native applications. The platforms may change though.

 

[guest2013-1]

Upskill. Why would you want to stagnate in just one technology and just one language?

I've done a broad spectrum of languages and technologies over the years going from Windows to Linux to web etc. Busy with BI type stuff now and I'm trying my hand at mobile dev now too.

 

[rorz0r]

I saw quite a few android dev jobs for about 600kpa on pnet. Could always "migrate" your java skills there.

 

[stricken]

There will always be a market for native applications. The platforms may change though.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. As an example we see next years Snapdragon's following the new ARM reference release which include a hardware based javascript interpreter. Think "The Firefox Phone (Boot to Gecko)" and your running javascript right on the hardware...

Why javascript? A. Its the only language the web natively understands. B. A change in your code is by definition an automatic update on the client.

Except for niche applications, native code will be dead in 5 years. The OP is a reflection of this already happening.

/my 2c worth.

 

[ozziej]

Yup, don't stagnate. Desktop Java development is pretty much dead (unless you count Android ;-) If you are looking to make a move or get into a position where you will be secure for sometime, look at J2EE (Web) and mobile. Focus on iOS (objective c) and Android (Java) I wouldn't even bother with anything else.

 

[Ancalagon]

Depends on whether they android jobs are java, native or web. You can develop Android apps in all three ways or a combination thereof. I have a feeling Java would be the most popular Android development platform. Native is probably only really useful for games.

As an example we see next years Snapdragon's following the new ARM reference release which include a hardware based javascript interpreter

Got a link for that? That sounds interesting.

 

[stricken]

Got a link for that? That sounds interesting.

Unfortunately not. A rumour it is. A rumour that will eventually become true either way. ; )

 

[xumwun]

Java is used on the web as well in the form of jsp.

 

[icyrus]

I wouldn't be so sure about that. As an example we see next years Snapdragon's following the new ARM reference release which include a hardware based javascript interpreter. Think "The Firefox Phone (Boot to Gecko)" and your running javascript right on the hardware...

Why javascript? A. Its the only language the web natively understands. B. A change in your code is by definition an automatic update on the client.

Except for niche applications, native code will be dead in 5 years. The OP is a reflection of this already happening.

/my 2c worth.

And Facebook's mobile problems recently indicate the opposite.

The best user experience will always be through native code, that doesn't mean it is always the best option though.

 

[xumwun]

Depends on whether they android jobs are java, native or web. You can develop Android apps in all three ways or a combination thereof. I have a feeling Java would be the most popular Android development platform. Native is probably only really useful for games.



Got a link for that? That sounds interesting.

Not really.
A lot of the phone/tablets functions can only be used by native apps, native apps can also work offline.

 

[debonair]

I agree it wouldnt hurt to learn J2EE

 

[Turbo_Aspiration]

I don't agree with notion that Java SE = desktop app and Java EE = web app.

Jave EE is really just an extended set of APIs (including the SE APIs) to aid in "Enterprise" type concerns - persistance, messaging,web services, etc.

'Learning Java EE' would come down to being familar with this extended toolkit and the Application Server environment.

These concepts are something you need to come to grips with if you want to develop in an enterprise environment. Whether you get this from Java EE (recommended?) or another tool set (look at Spring for eg), it doesn't REALLY matter.

 

[stevenv]

Desktop Java development is pretty much dead

Oh really? Are you including enterprise server applications, written in Java, in this basket?

 

[stevenv]

Except for niche applications, native code will be dead in 5 years

What would those niche applications be?

 

[_kabal_]

Oh really? Are you including enterprise server applications, written in Java, in this basket?

I am sure he means Swing applications and the like

 

[zippy]

Cobol is still being used

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/...ll-a-preferred-language-in-the-business-world

There is massive risk in changing technologies. If it aint broke, dont fix it

Crap systems aren't crap because of the technology, They are crap because of combination of bad systems design, bad coding, bad testing and bad implementation.

I liked this comment:

None of these languages offer what Cobol does -- fast, efficient processing large batches of data. It doesn't need graphics, it doesn't need bit-twiddling, it doesn't need to be internet-aware, it just needs to do what it does well -- accounting mostly.

FWIW, C++ is an abomination. C was an ok substitute for people too lazy to learn assembler, but tacking C++ on was just silly. That is the easiest language in the world to shot yourself in the foot with. Do you want your 401k balance dependent upon someone kids ability to remember the difference between "." "->" and "*"?

Java is good, save, and workable. And on IBM mainframes, Java and Cobol interoperate very nicely. But some things that are easy to do in Cobol are very hard to do in Java, and the converse is true. They are complementing each other, not replacing each other.

Python? After 40 years of headaches with programs/shells/compilers puking all over the difference between spaces, tabs and end of lines some retard decides to make a language that delimits scope based on spaces, tabs and end of lines? WTF? That will never be a serious candidate for the enterprise where dozens of file transfer packages over dozens of hardware platforms in dozens of countries with dozens of different character sets operate. Here is a nickel kid -- go buy yourself some brackets.

PS, im not a Cobol developer

 

[Gnome]

I don't agree with notion that Java SE = desktop app and Java EE = web app.

Jave EE is really just an extended set of APIs (including the SE APIs) to aid in "Enterprise" type concerns - persistance, messaging,web services, etc.

'Learning Java EE' would come down to being familar with this extended toolkit and the Application Server environment.

These concepts are something you need to come to grips with if you want to develop in an enterprise environment. Whether you get this from Java EE (recommended?) or another tool set (look at Spring for eg), it doesn't REALLY matter.

What he said ^

You need to know JSE to learn JEE.

Java as a whole relies on the fact that they lay down a standard. Then any company can create an implementation of that standard.

Eg. Java Persistence API: Tells you how to do persistence, gives you everything except the actual implementation. The popular JPA provider is Hibernate for example.

My advice:

Spring Framework rules the roost in most companies now (at least those with sense ), but to use Spring you need to know your sh$t with JSE and JEE.

Having used just about every feature of Spring, I can tell you now it saves months/years of development.

 

[MagicDude4Eva]

native apps should be dead long time ago already. there is nothing you can not do via HTML5 on mobile device (at least one which is not older than 12-18 months).

Forgot to mention - there are hardly any good JEE developers around. Most are nowadays "solution architects" (= purchase some expensive middleware and spend years making it work). The remaining few are either "only developing front-end" or "only developing back-end". I have never understood this, but then again those EJB developers have absolutely no clue in developing a good front-end and are better off working with JMS and JDBC. Same can be said about front-end devs who are incapable of developing a responsive front-end design.

Most of the guys who have their Sun-cert's under the belt have not moved on and are now in the same category as those extinct Cobol developers ;-)

 

[icyrus]

native apps should be dead long time ago already. there is nothing you can not do via HTML5 on mobile device (at least one which is not older than 12-18 months).

That is most certainly not true.