Is your cellphone SIM registered?

Sounds like the 18 months deadline to register is 31 December 2010. Imagine the rush on New Year's Eve when all the procrastinators, me included, rush to the stores to register. I see the deadline being extended...and again.
/thinks back to the new driver's license fiasco
 
3G-Spot said:
This just means if you are planning some criminal activity - don't call anyone, but if do need to call...use a Telkom pay-phone or if you can, use skype, gmail, etc. I must say, this is not a brilliant idea to fight crime, sooo many ways around it and implementing this WILL cost the tax-payer millions, as usual.
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Didn't the networks say that they will not transfer the cost of this to the customer?
 
Lazy said:
I'm not sure I understand your point.

Say I buy a phone in Zimbabwe and I come use it in SA, how will Vodacom or MTN know who I am based on my phone?
With this, to use it here they either have to be a roaming customer or use a sim card that was issued locally. IF the locally issued sim card was a prepaid, then there will be someone who used their proof of identity to buy it. Thus, there will be someone to tie to the account, be it directly or indirectly...
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No, you're at the wrong end of the stolen phone process.

1. I walk to the cell-phone service provider's shop, and report my phone stolen.
2. I prove that I own the sim card with my blue-card (you get that with the sim card) or last 5 calls call-history, which I retrieve from the website.

Now, the cell-phone network provider has all the information required to do something about my stolen phone.
Nothing else is required.
It was simple, and effortless, and does not require the management of a huge database at magnificent cost to us.
 
davemc said:
No, you're at the wrong end of the stolen phone process.

1. I walk to the cell-phone service provider's shop, and report my phone stolen.
2. I prove that I own the sim card with my blue-card (you get that with the sim card) or last 5 calls call-history, which I retrieve from the website.

Now, the cell-phone network provider has all the information required to do something about my stolen phone.
Nothing else is required.
It was simple, and effortless, and does not require the management of a huge database at magnificent cost to us.
Click to expand...

I'm with you on that. But what if my Zim phone scenario is the start of a crime being committed, other than just theft of a phone. Lets use a kidnapping as an example. The kidnapper can't use a prepaid sim card to make the 'demands' phone call because the sim will be linked to someone.
(And they have been using prepaid sim's until this point, amongst others obviously)

Ok, so the flipside of the coin is that the kidnapper could use a payphone etc and I'm aware of that. But at least this makes it that little bit harder for the criminal (in my view at least).

I am not saying this is fool proof, but then again neither are finger prints and that is used to solve crime every day.
 
Lazy said:
Ok, so the flipside of the coin is that the kidnapper could use a payphone etc and I'm aware of that. But at least this makes it that little bit harder for the criminal (in my view at least).
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A kidnapping is a complicated affair, at least one for ransom. You have to find a target with family rich enough to buy him out, plan the affair, run surveillance and co-ordinate a number of different actions to acquire the individual. Normally, well organised, motivated and skilled people are involved, they would surely be using a stolen or a fraudulently verified sim card. Obtaining that would be the easiest step.

I gather this would help against harassment (anonymous smses or calls) and
very basic fraud (eg using the cell number to broker a scam) - ie very basic crimes. It won't help against armed robberies, bank or cash in transit heists and other organised crime affairs although it will hamper these people a little more.
 
@Lazy, yea and all, but, my point of view makes still this statement a Lie:
This week MTN claimed to be positively eager to toe the line. “MTN is looking forward to the implementation of Rica, particularly that it would deal with the issue of stolen cellphones, which consumers have been raising,” said executive Zolisa Masiza.
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Now, lets take a look at the other side of the problem of this MASSIVE database:
Q1 : WHO GETS ACCESS TO THIS DATABASE?
Q2 : HOW?
Q3 : AND WHO PAYS FOR THE ACCESS?
Q4 : WHO'S PROBLEM IS IT IF THE INFORMATION IS INCORRECT?

If Q3 and Q4's answer is : The customer, then I don't want it.
 
ajax said:
Sounds like the 18 months deadline to register is 31 December 2010. Imagine the rush on New Year's Eve when all the procrastinators, me included, rush to the stores to register. I see the deadline being extended...and again.
/thinks back to the new driver's license fiasco
Click to expand...

I was talking to a colleague about this, we both use PP Sims for our 3G. He said that he would wait until his is cut off, then register when he has to buy a new one. Quite frankly, I will probably do the same.

B
 
if you don't register you will be cut off. if you need to get a new SIM (i.e. new contract) they will not activate the SIM until you are RICA'ed. You need to be RICA'ed per SIM.

Worst part is that if I live in an informal settlement/rural area, I only need to provide my ID (which I bought) and a letter/address of a local church etc. RICA will only catch the dumb criminals. The smart ones will buy the SIM's outside of SA and rather pay the higher roaming fees to disappear off the radar (eventually our not-so-smart criminals will just buy handsets off people who don't know better).
 
if you don't register you will be cut off. if you need to get a new SIM (i.e. new contract) they will not activate the SIM until you are RICA'ed. You need to be RICA'ed per SIM.

Worst part is that if I live in an informal settlement/rural area, I only need to provide my ID (which I bought) and a letter/address of a local church etc. RICA will only catch the dumb criminals. The smart ones will buy the SIM's outside of SA and rather pay the higher roaming fees to disappear off the radar (eventually our not-so-smart criminals will just buy handsets off people who don't know better).
 
Just wondering how this RICA dance will pan out, for starters you need to (Contract and Prepaid) do the following;
1) The User of the SIM needs to present the physical SIM ( If it belongs to a Corporate Account,the USER has to RICA).
2) The USERS ID document.
3) The usual requirements as for the FICA for the USER.

Another interesting fact dated today 2 July 2009 is that the Vodacom Franshisee's like Vodashops nor Vodam4Me will and cannot help you to RICA as they do not have the application on their system yet and do not know when they will receive this application.
 
not true - all Vodacom outlets have RICA capabilities since 17th June. all outlets are registered agents.
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
Worst part is that if I live in an informal settlement/rural area, I only need to provide my ID (which I bought) and a letter/address of a local church etc.
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I mean, WTF??? I got the legislation the other day and its a joke. Sure in theory its to try catch criminals...but that is just ridiculous! If you are in an informal settlement you just have to provide your nearest cops station or church...That is like when the judge told the prosecution in my grandmothers murder trial, that the accused (who were caught using her stolen Cellphone) can have bail. His reasoning was that even though they don’t have a perm residence, they can’t just crawl under a rock and disappear. Guess what…they got bail and disappeared! Typical government run by uneducated retards, waste of our tax money and time.
 
Privacy

Well there will be a brand new avenue for personal info to be had by who ever pays enough.

Maybe some one can print (on paper and/or electronically) a telehone number book for cell numbers ?????? They can use that excuse to lower public resistance to this monster law. I think losta people would like their cell number listed somewhere. There are many of us clever enough to make such a publication work. Mine is listed in the Telkom directory and it is a nightmare!! but others might want it??

As for the criminals, they are NOT to be had by this law they are clever!!!
 
RICA se m03r

I won't be registering either. Rather wait for the whole thing to be blown out by the courts. Other countries have equally silly laws but at least in Australia, for example, you can do the registration online. Otherwise, I'll just be forwarding my SIP VoIP number to a roaming SIM card with free incoming calls in 50 countries (including SA - these exist). I am sure you will also have to provide your "race" when you register. Now, where have I seen that before?
 
gregmcc said:
I highly doubt its going to make any difference!
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Just as we do not have the brightest politician we don't have the brightest criminals. Even they will get lax, unattentive nd greedy.
How often do they catch vans transporting dagga from the Easter Cape when the easiest thing would be to have spotter car driving 10km ahead and notify the load carrying vehicle when they hit a roadblock?
 
PeterCH said:
A kidnapping is a complicated affair, at least one for ransom. You have to find a target with family rich enough to buy him out, plan the affair, run surveillance and co-ordinate a number of different actions to acquire the individual. Normally, well organised, motivated and skilled people are involved, they would surely be using a stolen or a fraudulently verified sim card. Obtaining that would be the easiest step.
Click to expand...

I used kidnapping as an example only because it was by far the easiest and quickest to explain. When (and I say WHEN here) they are caught, identified and investigated, there will be some sort of trail leading back to their sim's. In this case it's sort of the reverse order of what was probably intended, but, the fraudulent steps taken might have some actual implications for the individuals in the background who assisted. Which in turn could lead to some more scum to sit behind bars. Also, if they used stolen/false ID's to obtain the sims then it has a role to play here too.

I think the important thing here is that very often crime is more about opportunity than actual planning. Take the idiotic Dirk Prinsloo. He is an advocate, yet he tried to rob a bank with a toy gun. I am not saying that there aren't pro's out there and that there aren't ways to bypass this, but I fail to believe that this won't have any sort of impact if it is done right. It is a step in the right direction.

PeterCH said:
I gather this would help against harassment (anonymous smses or calls) and
very basic fraud (eg using the cell number to broker a scam) - ie very basic crimes. It won't help against armed robberies, bank or cash in transit heists and other organised crime affairs although it will hamper these people a little more.
Click to expand...

One of the big problems with crime is that it's more difficult to tie suspects together than you think. So they catch one guy, but his 2 mates are more difficult to track down [or identify]. So unless everyone involved use fruadulent means to obtains sims and assuming that he has his [fraudulent] sim with him when he is arrested (which you can safely assume I guess) then tying him to some phone calls and identifying the individuals on the other side of the call would definately help.

This is not a crime preventative measure, it's a tool to assist after the fact. Anyone who's ever been affected by crime can tell you that the police need all the help they can get. This is help, or an attempt to help at least.
 
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