Java Cafe / Viva Computers Warning

  • Thread starter Thread starter me
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Well in honesty, SA never had alot of useful engineers to begin with. Sure they did exist and those contributed to the entire world, but you could count those and today its stil the same.

Its just that its more obvious these days.

Even if we started by making calculators, that would be better than nothing like now.
Also, Learning institutes this side don't interact with the industry, so all learnign is done in a vacume.
eg MS DX9/DX10 SDK is a free download and has been for years so is GLSlang, RTSL, and the like but yet they don't have them. Why?

GOVT is rubbish as its always been, but GOVT can't force institutes to download and work on SDKs. Its embarrasing that there are 17yr olds in the east and even in the US that can run circles around our professors this side. Not because we'e incapable but because we just couldn't be bothered.
 
Look, anyone can be trained to solder together some bits of electronics.
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Then why are we not doing it?

See, WatchDog this is what you don't know. From making replicas, you learn something. You learn how to tweak processes, fix errors and the like and eventually you make your own product. Its free R&D and believe it or not, many large electronics companies went through this.

Military hardware is hardly at the cutting edge of development. SA makes or rather duplicates a lot of military hardware but we're useless in computing entirely. So one has nothing to do with the other.

You don't have to buy anything Chinese at all, but that is because you just don't want to and that's fine. Do not make excuses for this. They may not be the best or even at the top but their getting there. SA is not even going sideways let alone to the top.
 
Hehe my original comment was just on the mobo software that probably isn't even developed in China... I just think the 3D bevelling and sound effects should go.

WatchDog's point is interesting though; the Far East (not just China) tends to perfect and mass produce stuff originally designed / invented elsewhere. Even in Japan where there are loads of very bright engineers designing cameras, robots, mobos, whatever else, most of the stuff we use in the West was actually invented here... except the tamagotchi and one or 2 other things I guess.
 
me said:
Hehe my original comment was just on the mobo software that probably isn't even developed in China... I just think the 3D bevelling and sound effects should go.

WatchDog's point is interesting though; the Far East (not just China) tends to perfect and mass produce stuff originally designed / invented elsewhere. Even in Japan where there are loads of very bright engineers designing cameras, robots, mobos, whatever else, most of the stuff we use in the West was actually invented here... except the tamagotchi and one or 2 other things I guess.
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The key here is CHEAP labour. Forced labour and oppression is rife there, what I read? and the PPL is to happy to work for daily bread!
 
Don't know if you been to the Valley, but there are more Asian people than than anyone else.
The US has money, so they bring the engineers and programmers from the east to work in the West.
The PR faces you see are Western because that's what people are used to seeing and feel comfortable with unfortunately.
How many times have you seen nVidia's President? But you have seen David Kirk, Brian Burke, Richard Huddy (when he was still at nVidia) etc...
 
pupa said:
First the comment about schooling and Engineers is no more, it is disappearing fast. Stuffed up by the GVT as so many other things. We will see in future. Remember the British nurses disaster exercise? There is a few others but that's beyond the point! Any way IMHO the GVT should invest in building infrastructure to use our own resources. Why export our minerals cheap and then import final product at a huge cost if it should be cheaper to manufacture locally and export! We can manufacture mother boards locally IMHO. The problem is the cost of labour but surely that is offset by the gains of employment and business that will develop around such a industry! What happened to our own Silicon valley, that was mentioned at an stage!
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You mean the engineers are disappearing fast. I wise I could get you the statistics of the poeple working at Microsoft, a lot of South African people. Same with a lot of companies in a lot of countries. People are literally fleeing the country.
 
me said:
Hehe my original comment was just on the mobo software that probably isn't even developed in China... I just think the 3D bevelling and sound effects should go.

WatchDog's point is interesting though; the Far East (not just China) tends to perfect and mass produce stuff originally designed / invented elsewhere. Even in Japan where there are loads of very bright engineers designing cameras, robots, mobos, whatever else, most of the stuff we use in the West was actually invented here... except the tamagotchi and one or 2 other things I guess.
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Reminds me of the time the Chinese navy copied a British Destroyer a few decades ago. They copied it PERFECTLY, right down to the patch on the boiler!!
 
In both cases the total resistance across the supply lines is extremely high and the current flow insignificant. So the current consumption should be negligible. But here enters reality. The first point is that any current flowing into a load connected at an output will be added to the normal current consumption. The second point is that a pulse of current gets consumed each time an output changes state. One transistor gets turned on to a significant degree before the other switches off properly. This brief short circuit between the two supply lines is what causes most of the current to be consumed and it's at this stage where most of the heat is produced. The faster the circuit operates at the more short circuits is produced and the more heat gets generated. It's also this ultra-high input resistance that makes them vulnerable to high static voltages.
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Corrections:

The CMOS output stage, which, I am really surprised was correctly described here, is usually the output of a gate, which is usually driving the input of another gate, or an external pin of the chip in which case it is invariably driving some sort of load, be it a gate, a transmission line i.e. the PCB trace between the chip and some memory. The point is, that transmission line has inductance and capacitance which is small, but load a few millions of gates into a small space together and turn them all on at the same time and the energy required to charge and discharge the reactances present becomes very significant, especially at high clock frequencies. This is what generates the heat, and it's actually due to losses in the conductive paths.

The ultra high input impedance of a FET is created by an insulating layer of oxide. Chips are damaged by static because the high voltage of a static charge punches a hole through the oxide layer causing a short between the gate and the source/drain of the FET itself. Most modern devices have protection against this internally in the form of zener diodes from each pin to VDD and VSS. However a really strong static charge hammers these diodes causing a failure anyway, the diode goes short and the chip is useless. I have personally seen this, the pin is buggered and the rest of the chip still works.

This is not to be confused with ESD latch-up, which is a condition that occurrs when the chip encounters an ESD event whilst powered up. That is when things go really bad, and the chip becomes a short. What happens there is the CMOS configuration becomes like an SCR and shorts the supply rails often with spectacular consequences, the chip usually burns a hole into itself or the PC board
 
:o
Okay. Won't argue as I have no idea what you just said. Me not electronics guru!
 
killadoob said:
well your first problem was buying something called biostar

never even heard of them

rather buy boards from known companies such as asus gigabyte etc

not biostar
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Thats because you're a noob, they are huge oversea. Your probaly one of those crappy "i love asus" fools.
 
Jeeva said:
Thats because you're a noob, they are huge oversea. Your probaly one of those crappy "i love asus" fools.
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And you are one of those I hate Asus and Gigabyte fools, because you cannot afford quality! or rather supply Quality? Mmmmmm....! Define HUGE in comparison with Asus and Gigabyte then we see who's the "blabbermouth" fool here!
 
Quality and Gigabyte is usually called an oxymoron. Quality and Asus is usually called an example.
 
ShockG said:
Quality and Gigabyte is usually called an oxymoron. Quality and Asus is usually called an example.
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Hear Hear, I used Gigabyte in the same post just to point i am not biased. But I must be honest I am as I have not bought or sold any other Mboard than Asus since 1994. I was just tired of returns and problems and ever since stayed with Asus and never looked back. Even the AsRock do not as yet attract my liking! Graphics is pure economics. I prefer Asus at any cost but then not everyone can afford the best! Value added, support and reliability!
 
Yes I can believe that. I'm not a retailer so I can't possibly know.
GB seems to have lost the plot much like Thermaltake. They were going alright, then insanity fell from the heavens and we have today DPS and other such rubbish from them. It started with Dual Bios, which was't so bad, but rather usele, then came DPS, then their entire motherboar line fell apart.

It seems like someone at the top is putting out memos on how to try and sell to the gamer\ enthusiast but at the same time not listen to their wants/needs.

I suppose that also goes for bundled Wi-Lan adapters. How about you keep the adapters and add something I like, like the ability to select more than 2.7V for my ram, memory dividers other than 200/166/133/100. Hows about the ability to increase voltage using a +xV instead of just 1.2/1.25/1.3/1.35/1.4/1.45 etc because past 1.5V the voltage change doesn't register at all.
How about a NB fan that won't die or make more noise than an FX5800Ultra.

Ability to change Bootup logo? No how about the ability to store my settings and the ability to clear Cmos without messing with jumpers and Cmos battery?

These are just some of the things Gigabyte seems to get wrong without fail.

Thermaltake?
Yes i'll take one, maybe not. They started out good, Aquarius 1/ Artic Silver/ Volcano series. Then it went from sugar to sh!#. Moto casses, with the build quality of a car built in Mayfair. TT big water has a CPU block that has its finish so poor, it doesn't reflect anything at all. It may as well be a rubber base. TT Tsunami.... A Tsunami is usually a tragedity and well...

Now they have copper heatpipes bonded to fins that are better of bonded using duct tape than what ever means their using. Most of their products are named after natural phenomena, but their products are just the last part most of the time. TWV TT 500WATT PSU shows you how many watts you're not getting. Shuts down long before you hit the 450Watt mark.

Sigh... :(
 
Agreed Thermaltake has become a Hype! Had some nice cases at a cost. But home build mods with a good third party power supply is still better! The case does nothing anyway, Cooling channels and such hype! My boxes is always open and for years, never had heat issues! Rather spend the money where it counts. Mboard, Chip-set, Graphics, LCD (Huge), Overhead projector, Drives and Power supply. The rest is just small incremental gains. A motherboard mounted on a wall with acrylic cover looks great with a small box to mount drives etc! Why waste a R1000+ on a case if that could be spend on a CPU upgrade! But then again why put Mags on a car, if the car engine is a 1100 Fiat Uno? Same logic in PC's nowadays. The bragging Factor!
 
Suppose.
I do like a nice looking case, but I'd rather have one modded, than one that comes with Horns (Those horrid Chenbro things) and some wanna be evil guys face on he front. Or the thousand Alienware knock off cases that are joined together with rivets. :/
 
Same logic in PC's nowadays. The bragging Factor
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Yep, that is what it is all about nowadays, customers want the thing to look "trendy" better than the other nerd's PC down the street or around the corner. All these "whatsit" coolers are really a waste of money, the manufacturer specified CPU fan and heatsink does the job, leaving you with money in your pocket to buy other things.

I always thought it would stay with cars but sadly, what I call "the fast and the furious factor" has now permeated to other aspects of life aswell. I guess the next thing to be adorned with stupid blue lights and boy racer accessories will be homes. Nice front door with chrome racing cap finish. ROFL!
 
Wouldn't say the stock cooler is great nor would I encourage its use (unless its the cooler that comes with FX55/57 X2 4600/4800 FX60.)
Most of us that used to OC got better coolers to handle the higher heat levels. Air was/is going nowhere so water is the next best thing. But even that has been perverted by TT wit the bigwater and such devices. :/
 
Some stock coolers are not great yes, I've fried one CPU in the past. However what I usually do is get a CPU fan for a CPU that runs hotter than the one I intend to install. Most of my experience was with AMD processors and my own desktop PC is still running perfectly 2 years on. The CPU temp rarely exceeds 35 degrees, unless there's a heatwave outside, and hovers around 16 degress on cold nights. (I never use computers when it's that hot, I have lost too many hard drives and other components by attempting to work on the computer when it's so frikken hot like it used to get here in JHB a few years ago)
 
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