Liberty

rynoZA

New Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
5
[MENTION=206603]Suspect99[/MENTION]

My broker advised that this is a good plan for my needs? I think i am still in the 30 Day cool off period just not sure if i should cancel it or not. i am still waiting for him to send me documents of this plan that he was adamant about that is good. I am clueless when it comes to investing :wtf:

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Check the photo, to me that seems like i am loosing, after my first initial payment?
 

Suspect99

Executive Member
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Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,613
[MENTION=206603]Suspect99[/MENTION]

My broker advised that this is a good plan for my needs? I think i am still in the 30 Day cool off period just not sure if i should cancel it or not. i am still waiting for him to send me documents of this plan that he was adamant about that is good. I am clueless when it comes to investing :wtf:

View attachment 526845

Check the photo, to me that seems like i am loosing, after my first initial payment?

Yes Liberty will charge you excessive fees immediately. You'll only get growth after that. In my case their fees were higher than any growth they made. Looks like the charged you almost 3k fees on your first installment. (ouch). And if you cancel you'll get 39k back. Financial advisors are more interested in what will make them the most commission rather than what will benifit you. Ask [MENTION=81322]zerocool2009[/MENTION] about his experiences as well
 

rynoZA

New Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
5
Yes Liberty will charge you excessive fees immediately. You'll only get growth after that. In my case their fees were higher than any growth they made. Looks like the charged you almost 3k fees on your first installment. (ouch). And if you cancel you'll get 39k back. Financial advisors are more interested in what will make them the most commission rather than what will benifit you. Ask [MENTION=81322]zerocool2009[/MENTION] about his experiences as well

And i said to this guy, i do not trust any advisers that's why i have never used them.Well it seems he reamed me clearly.I should cancel then :wtf: was wondering how he drives that brand new E63 AMG

Thanks
 

zerocool2009

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Sep 4, 2009
Messages
8,832
And i said to this guy, i do not trust any advisers that's why i have never used them.Well it seems he reamed me clearly.I should cancel then :wtf: was wondering how he drives that brand new E63 AMG

Thanks

You are clearly funding his wheels. GO CANCEL ASAP please
 

xrapidx

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
40,308
Get away from Liberty, and find a new financial adviser. (ask the current one if he does other financial institutions or just Liberty)

Also: Ask him for the fees being charged
http://www.liberty.co.za/our-offering/family/Pages/investment-builder.aspx#/fees said:
There are management fees, guarantee fees, where applicable, and advisory fees, based on agreements with your financial adviser.
 

Suspect99

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Aug 22, 2012
Messages
6,613
And i said to this guy, i do not trust any advisers that's why i have never used them.Well it seems he reamed me clearly.I should cancel then :wtf: was wondering how he drives that brand new E63 AMG

Thanks

Theres also a button on the website where you can pull exactly how much fees they are charging you, you'll see the breakdown. The products growth has to exceed all those fees before you even make a cent profit.
 

rietrot

Honorary Master
Joined
Aug 26, 2016
Messages
33,194
For a short term low risk investment with that amount of money just get a money market or simular type account. Compare get one with the best rates and lowest fees or a fix term savings account.

Edit: whatever rate you getting just needs to beat inflation.
 
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Sepeng

Expert Member
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Dec 12, 2011
Messages
2,733
Hi guys, question.

I am debt free, age 28. FA advised me to get a Liberty Investment builder into which a debit order of R50k a month is deposited.

I checked the value the other day after my first payment and it was standing at R47500. I also noticed this is a 5 year "Liberty short term endownment" according to him.Can i withdraw before 5 years?

i was actually just looking for 1 - 3 year investment as a saving for a deposit for a house. But this does not seem like the right investment to me.I have no idea about investments, especially if i have lost around R2500 already after my first payment!?

I'm normally loathe to give financial advice to someone over the internet - I mean it's your money and all that.
But.
I've got a horror story about Liberty (pretty much the same story as you)
A guy in my team has just cancelled his ten year endowment with them 5 years in after he realized he's lost quite a bit with them.
I would honestly quit and take the hit - easy for me to say for sure but that would be my advice.
The issue with that type of investment is
A - they take their commission up front which leaves no incentive for them to care about the performance of the product after wards
B - it typically includes some sort of death benefit which is why you've lost so much already - not all your 50K goes to investing
C - they're not flexible - you can't cancel, stop contributions etc

Look take this from whence it comes - some random guy on the internet - but I would try get out. Even go to the Ombudsman, as this product really doesn't look like it suits you.
 

rynoZA

New Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
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I'm normally loathe to give financial advice to someone over the internet - I mean it's your money and all that.
But.
I've got a horror story about Liberty (pretty much the same story as you)
A guy in my team has just cancelled his ten year endowment with them 5 years in after he realized he's lost quite a bit with them.
I would honestly quit and take the hit - easy for me to say for sure but that would be my advice.
The issue with that type of investment is
A - they take their commission up front which leaves no incentive for them to care about the performance of the product after wards
B - it typically includes some sort of death benefit which is why you've lost so much already - not all your 50K goes to investing
C - they're not flexible - you can't cancel, stop contributions etc

Look take this from whence it comes - some random guy on the internet - but I would try get out. Even go to the Ombudsman, as this product really doesn't look like it suits you.

Yeah not one person has told me 1 good thing yet so far, and it does not seem to nearly what i have asked for.
Here's what another advisor told me, so i think i will just be cutting it, send an email out coppying my FA in as well as whichever liberty email i can find and cancel asap

Thank you for allowing us the opportunity to advise.

With regards to the Liberty performance which you sent, there are some factors to take into account.

1. Platform: Liberty Investment Builder – this an endowment product designed with a minimum 5 year time in mind

2. Portfolio: Allan Gray Balanced and Coronation Balanced Plus funds – these funds have a moderate risk mandate and will experience volatility over the shorter term

2. Date of Commencement: June 2018 – the performance is not a true reflection of the portfolio as a return of 2% – 3% above inflation should be targeted on a rolling 3 year basis

It would be interesting to see what commission is taken (upfront and annual) and the effective annual cost of the plan (the quote will have these details).

Based on the information you have provided a cautious portfolio in a linked investment plan should rather be considered on a cost effective platform like Allan Gray .

For a 12 – 36 month view balanced funds might not achieve the desired return and there is a chance of selling the units at a lower price over this duration.

For consideration, please find attached an Allan Gray linked investment plan quotation for the lump sum of R***** and the monthly premium of R******

The portfolio is mostly conservative with the lump sum allocation of 50% to the Allan Gray Stable fund and 30% to the Coronation Balanced fund.

Some risk has been applied however with 20% to the moderate Investec Opportunity fund.
The monthly premium is allocated 40% to the Allan Gray Stable fund and 30% to each of the other funds.
The initial commission is waivered while a 0.75% advisor fee is applied annually.

The effective annual cost (a summary all fees and charges) over the first 3 years of 2.69% is very competitive.

If your son does not want any risk to be taken on the lump sum and/or premiums we do offer the Investec CCM Bank account which has a current rate of 7.01% on balances of R10,000 or more.

The fee is 0.5% so the effective rate is currently 6.51% (the rate is linked to the top 4 performing money market rates).
This account can also facilitate forex transfers (transfer to or from his offshore account) at low fees.

Please feel free to pass this email onto your son and request any further information if required.
 

Hamster

Resident Rodent
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
42,920
Got no problems with Liberty. My Stash is completely fee free.

Do you ever get tired of posting about Stash? We get it - you chose the inferior TFSA solution and are happy with it, but it is irrelevant to this thread. Liberty has so many more ways to rip you off than just Stash like, but not limited to, RA, Unit Trusts, Life Insurance, Income Protection, Endowments etc. Platform fees, broker fees, advisor fees, penalty fees.... lots of fees.

OP, as a general rule, do not invest with life insurance companies. Most FA's are loyal to specific companies and their advice is always always results in a product with that company. They probably never mentioned Allan Gray, Coronation or Satrix. I learned this the hard way because all my FA suggested was Stanlib and Liberty products.
 

zerocool2009

Executive Member
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Sep 4, 2009
Messages
8,832
If you want to keep this, cut the broker out NOW and go Liberty direct (if that is another option)
 

rietrot

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Aug 26, 2016
Messages
33,194
If you want to keep this, cut the broker out NOW and go Liberty direct (if that is another option)
Or just get the Allen gray or Coronation funds directly which is what the liberty fund is invested in. Cut out more of the middle man. Or just buy an low cost ETF that tracks the same stuff. That would save even more on cost and get the same returns.
 

Goosfrabba

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Dec 13, 2017
Messages
3,166
The problem with Liberty, and pretty much their competition too, is that they contract any person with a car and a pulse to go through their induction program to sell to you. The turnover of FA's is staggering because every muppet gives it a go with the promise of easy money. They don't give 2 craps about you and will sell you the product that nets them the most profit up front. They are not experts!!!

Very few FA's are able to survive the early hustle for survival and go on to make a career of it. The ones who fade away are simply replaced by the next batch of idiots.

The only reason to use the builder series from Liberty is really for tax purposes and even then only those in the highest income tax bracket will see any benefit. In almost every situation, you will be better off with a simple unit trust investment. The fees are lower and you are not locked in for any term period.

P.S. The reason they sell you the Builder series investment is because they can earn upfront commission rather than the couple bucks a months the unit trust product offers as and when the premium comes in
 
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Billy

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Feb 8, 2004
Messages
3,690
Or just get the Allen gray or Coronation funds directly which is what the liberty fund is invested in. Cut out more of the middle man. Or just buy an low cost ETF that tracks the same stuff. That would save even more on cost and get the same returns.

No other advice on this topic can improve on this post!
 

rynoZA

New Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2018
Messages
5
The problem with Liberty, and pretty much their competition too, is that they contract any person with a car and a pulse to go through their induction program to sell to you. The turnover of FA's is staggering because every muppet gives it a go with the promise of easy money. They don't give 2 craps about you and will sell you the product that nets them the most profit up front. They are not experts!!!

Very few FA's are able to survive the early hustle for survival and go on to make a career of it. The ones who fade away are simply replaced by the next batch of idiots.

The only reason to use the builder series from Liberty is really for tax purposes and even then only those in the highest income tax bracket will see any benefit. In almost every situation, you will be better off with a simple unit trust investment. The fees are lower and you are not locked in for any term period.

P.S. The reason they sell you the Builder series investment is because they can earn upfront commission rather than the couple bucks a months the unit trust product offers as and when the premium comes in

Thanks that makes alot of sense, i work abroad alot so already my tax falls away and do not really need to think about an investment that could help me lesser my tax.
 

xrapidx

Honorary Master
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
40,308
Thanks that makes alot of sense, i work abroad alot so already my tax falls away and do not really need to think about an investment that could help me lesser my tax.

Keep in mind you might have to pay tax in the returns from the investment.
 
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