Masters degree without Honours

[drkev]

Hi all

Looking at changing track in my studies.. currently doing CIMA.

The MMFI at WBS looks interesting. Entrance requirement is a 4-year honours degree.

Has anyone managed to get accepted for a masters at wits (or other universities), WITHOUT an honours degree?

If you ace the admissions test do they let you in, or do they not let you write the admissions test without the honours....?

 

[saturnz]

I know you can skip masters and go straight to Phd but not sure about skipping honours and going straight to Masters, perhaps if you can demonstrate it they may accept you, but I've never heard of it happening.

 

[Bar0n]

I know you can skip masters and go straight to Phd

I've heard of this happening overseas, but not here in SA. Generally SA universities are strict on entrance requirements and demand an appropriate M.Sc. before allowing you into the Ph.D. programme. They also request a copy of your M.Sc. thesis for review AFAIK.

OP, it's difficult to say in your case as this isn't a standard B.Sc. or B.Com. degree that you're simply continuing with; you also want to change your study direction. The best thing to do would probably be to contact them and enquire about it. I'm slightly confused why you said "4-year honours degree"? Do you mean a "4th year" for honours? If so, why not just do honours for a year and then do your M.Sc.?

 

[Cius]

There is a way for Engineers as far as I know. You can sign up for a GDE (Graduate Diploma in Engineering) with less than an honours degree I think if you have the industry experience. That consists of 6 courses. If you do well enough in the courses they may let you do another 6 credits of project and lectures to convert it into an M.Eng. This is poor memory at work though. When I did my M.Eng it seemed there where a few guys doing it that way via the school of information and electrical engineering.

 

[Ancalagon]

I know the engineering masters program at Wits does not require honours, but it does require appropriate work experience. Generally the less education you have, the stricter the work experience requirements will be.

EDIT: I can confirm what Cius is saying. I currently hold a BSc(Hons) in Computer Science and was able to register for a GDE. I applied for an MEng, but they said I have to do the GDE first. A GDE is 6 courses, to get your MEng you need to do a further 4 courses and then an investigational project.

 

[TehStranger]

Hi all

Looking at changing track in my studies.. currently doing CIMA.

The MMFI at WBS looks interesting. Entrance requirement is a 4-year honours degree.

Has anyone managed to get accepted for a masters at wits (or other universities), WITHOUT an honours degree?

If you ace the admissions test do they let you in, or do they not let you write the admissions test without the honours....?

They usually make provision for people with extensive work experience, but even then you'll probably have to write a recognition of prior learning (RPL) test and may need to attend an interview. I skipped to Honours without an undergrad at Wits through RPL and an interview, so it's definitely possible at an Honours level, not sure about Masters though.

To do post grad and Masters-level courses at WBS you will also need to write a psychometric entrance test. This places you into one of four categories AFAIK (fail, average (which is a pass), above average and excellent). I'm not sure those are the exact names of the categories, but you get the gist of it. If you fall into the top category you have some negotiation room.

 

[GhostSixFour]

Here is the admission requirements from their brochure:

• Undergraduate degree in business, economics, engineering, mathematics, statistics or
law (safe overall average performance of B or better)
• Work experience is a plus, but not required
• Individuals with limited numeracy will need additional mathematics training
(a must overall average performance of B or better).

Brochure can be found here
Very long URL

So doesn't seem to be needed.

 

[drkev]

The best thing to do would probably be to contact them and enquire about it. I'm slightly confused why you said "4-year honours degree"? Do you mean a "4th year" for honours? If so, why not just do honours for a year and then do your M.Sc.?

I read somewhere they require a NQF Level 8 Honours degree. But looking at a brochure it doesnt mention it.

I might just submit an application with a motivation. Worst case they suggest I do the honours first. In that case I might simply stick with CIMA. The thought of skipping the honours and going straight into masters is appealing though.

 

[Ancalagon]

Have you considered doing the CFA, just for interests sake?

When I applied for MEng, I dont even remember if I could submit a motivation. Maybe for business school it is different though. They did contact me to setup a telephonic interview though.

 

[R13...]

I know the engineering masters program at Wits does not require honours, but it does require appropriate work experience. Generally the less education you have, the stricter the work experience requirements will be.

EDIT: I can confirm what Cius is saying. I currently hold a BSc(Hons) in Computer Science and was able to register for a GDE. I applied for an MEng, but they said I have to do the GDE first. A GDE is 6 courses, to get your MEng you need to do a further 4 courses and then an investigational project.

There is a way for Engineers as far as I know. You can sign up for a GDE (Graduate Diploma in Engineering) with less than an honours degree I think if you have the industry experience. That consists of 6 courses. If you do well enough in the courses they may let you do another 6 credits of project and lectures to convert it into an M.Eng. This is poor memory at work though. When I did my M.Eng it seemed there where a few guys doing it that way via the school of information and electrical engineering.

That's because the 4 year engineering degree is with honours.

 

[Bar0n]

That's because the 4 year engineering degree is with honours.

Just to add on to what you've said; a B.Sc. is actually not completed in terms of international standards until you've done your 4th (i.e. honours) year. In other countries a B.Sc. lasts 4 years from which you can directly proceed with an M.Sc.

 

[Jehosefat]

I've heard of this happening overseas, but not here in SA. Generally SA universities are strict on entrance requirements and demand an appropriate M.Sc. before allowing you into the Ph.D. programme. They also request a copy of your M.Sc. thesis for review AFAIK.

I actually know 3 people who received PhD's from South African universities without having done a MSc (2 of them went straight from Hons into doing their PhD)

 

[Bar0n]

I actually know 3 people who received PhD's from South African universities without having done a MSc (2 of them went straight from Hons into doing their PhD)

Interesting. Which universities did they attend?

 

[Jehosefat]

Wits. And its not a new thing, one of the 2 who went straight on was my mate's dad back in the 70's and the other was a girl who was in my honours class in '08.

 

[saturnz]

I actually know 3 people who received PhD's from South African universities without having done a MSc (2 of them went straight from Hons into doing their PhD)

I know two people from UCT, we were both in the same Economics programme, they basically do the Master's coursework with a Phd dissertation.

 

[Cius]

That's because the 4 year engineering degree is with honours.

Guys with an engineering degree could apply directly for the M.Eng. The guys I recall who where doing the GDE had no degree whatsover but did have a lot of programming experience (they all worked for BBnD I think). Essentially they wanted an easy degree that could lean heavily on their work experience and various short courses they had done. The GDE and M.Eng are internationally recognised and according to the chat I had to these guys if you wanted to get into Ausralia the degree was a dealbreaker, hence them trying to get a Masters degree via the shortest route possible.

 

[Bar0n]

Wits. And its not a new thing, one of the 2 who went straight on was my mate's dad back in the 70's and the other was a girl who was in my honours class in '08.

Was there a reason for these exceptions? Which faculties were these? The faculty of natural science's admission criteria lists "A Master of Science of this or another university" as the very first bullet.

 

[Jehosefat]

No idea. Engineering and Science. More specifically Civil Engineering and Applied Maths.

 

[Bar0n]

No idea. Engineering and Science. More specifically Civil Engineering and Applied Maths.

Oh well. I'm sure it can happen in the case of absolutely exceptional students and willing advisors (who are well familiar with the capabilities of the students). Roughly 10k students (in total) are enroll for masters or doctoral degrees every year and I'm sure 99% of them go through the usual channels and requirements. If you phoned up the registrations department at any university right now with a request to skip masters and go straight to Ph.D., it will be denied.

Source for the number of M.Sc./Ph.D. students (interesting article anyway and worth a read):

Then there is the problem of student poverty and debt. "We produce about 100,000 bachelor graduates a year, but the majority of those need to start working immediately to pay off debt," Mouton told University World News.

Thus, the number of potential researchers is whittled down at each level of the system. Out of about 22,000 South African honours students, those pursuing masters and doctorate degrees amount to only 10,000, of which just under 1,200 (1,182 in 2008) end up graduating with a PhD, said Mouton. Among the masters cohort, nearly one third is made up of MBA (Masters of Business Administration) students who rarely remain in academia.

http://www.universityworldnews.com/article.php?story=20100820150736361

 

[Turbo_Aspiration]

Was there a reason for these exceptions? Which faculties were these? The faculty of natural science's admission criteria lists "A Master of Science of this or another university" as the very first bullet.

You register for a masters then you can "upgrade" your work for submission towards a PHD. This is a normal procedure - perhaps not common though. This is a great option for full time students who want to go into academics.