Mine Nationalisation for Dummies - please advise.

Nod said:
Not only that, but SA could have created more jobs by processing the produce from the mines locally, instead of exporting everything to Japan, or wherever, to get processed, and then we buy it back again. Some things are done in SA, but not enough.
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Through the minerals policy, government can force the mines to invest in local communities, local economic development and national economy. Let the mines carry the burden of social responsibility and government focus of country priorities.
 
daveza said:
Why just pick on the mines - why not all industries ?
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Maybe because the mineral wealth comes out off the earth so how can any particular group have sole rights over them. Other industries don't lay claim to natural resources.
 
daveza said:
In addition to all the taxes they already pay ?

Why just pick on the mines - why not all industries ?
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Because mining is a unique industry. Its an industry that exploits our national resources and leaves a liability after closure. Mines get taxed just like you and I pay tax.
 
daveza said:
What about fishing - that also exploits our natural resources.
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Maybe its because there are more documented negative impacts of mining than fishing industry, hence more attention is given to mining all over the world. E.g. as we speak now, we seating on a long term mine closure liability that we as tax payers have to fund. That should have been a social responsibility of mining companies.
 
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daveza said:
What about fishing - that also exploits our natural resources.
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Good point. However fishing can be sustainable if managed properly. In other words allowing the fish to reproduce quicker than what we exploit them. Once a piece of rock is mined that is the end of it.

However on the topic of fishing, the ANC has already "nationalised" that industry with their "Long Term Rights" that were awarded partly to existing right holders with all sorts of BEE conditions and new conditions that basically expropriated from those that had to new entrants which comprised some people who had never even caught a fish in their lives nor possibly been on a boat at sea, in other words not traditional fisherman.

I&J, from owning a factory at every harbour along our coast to just one factory left in Woodstock. I&J even sent trawlers on their own steam to scrapyard destinations in the East. The reason being, Government gave off from their rights to new entrants, I&J thought the new entrants would ask them to catch their fish, but what happened was the new entrants took their "new" quotas gave it to the Spanish or other foreign boats to catch, resulting in I&J's boats becoming underutilised. How many South African people lost their jobs as a result of the mismanagement of our Fishing Industry.

I can go on about the Fishing Industry as I am passionate about something I was once involved in 20 years ago, I still do a bit of recreational fishing etc, but what concerns me is the same thing is going to happen in the Mining Industry, just different terminology being used, but the end result is the same, the complete stuff up of something that is working. Lets be frank if the country does not get the taxes from the mines like they should, then Government will look to the man on the street and tax him more.
 
From the times: Malema brilliance: DA applauds outstanding ANCYL idea

It is reported that Julius Malema, in a moment of rare clarity and cogency, has advocated nationalising South Africa’s mines in order that they might subsidise the costs of tertiary education.

Brilliant.

The DA would like to know why no one has thought of this before.

In fact, we will be submitting a parliamentary question to President Zuma to establish exactly that: why does no one in government have as many good ideas as Julius Malema?

“If one mine takes over this university in terms of funding, you won’t have to worry about government,” Malema told a crowd at the University of Limpopo’s Medunsa campus in Ga-Rankuwa.

Well exactly. It’s all so obvious.

But, for those of you who aren’t too clued up on the accounting behind this kind of financial genius, it goes something like this:

Each university should have a mine. Great.

Because those mines are nationalised, obviously this would be a state-owned mine.

So far, so good.

At the moment – because the evil forces of imperialism have opposed nationalisation – there is only one state-owned mine – Alexkor.

So let’s use that as our archetype.

One Alexkor per university (they could even build the engineering school underground).

We have some 30 universities, so that would be 30 Alexkors. (I think I am beginning to see a problem with this.)

Between 2005 and 2009, Alexkor failed to make a profit. (It has also lost some 500 jobs, down from 700 to 100 in ten years, but that’s another matter.)

Hmmmm.

So? if you subsidise tertiary education with state-owned mines? the universities will end up having to subsidise the mines?

Hang on. That can’t be right.

Obviously this kind of Western mathematical logic will end up with a racist conclusion like that.

I think Malema’s logic is a far safer bet: State-owned mines are the source of massive wealth. They can pay for everything. Let’s attach each university to a mine.

That makes far more sense.

(Unless of course Malema meant that universities are well suited to subsidise failing state-owned mines. In which case ignore everything I have said. That is a brilliant piece of logic in the other direction.)

But why stop at universities? When there is so much else to subsidise?

Seeing as these mines generate so much money, here are a few other things we could use those enormous profits for:

? A fleet of Mabachs for the executive (and the Youth League, of course)

? A home for President Zuma (yes, another one)

? The penthouse at the Lost City (for the Minister of Police)

? A lifetime supply of Jonny Walker for future ANC general conferences and NGCs

? A Finance 101 course for the Youth League.

Excellent. We can call it: ‘Mining for Opulence’, or ‘OpuCor’.

By way of conclusion, the DA believes most of the problems concerning South Africa’s mines stem from the word ‘mine’ itself. Obviously the name ‘mine’ is misleading, especially for an organisation such as the ANC, which has its eyes on so much. Naturally the name will lead to confusion. The ANC believes its ‘mine’. The private sector believes it is ‘a mine’.

We thus propose the name ‘mine’ be changed to ‘the ANC’s’ – mainly for the benefit of the private sector. No doubt this will clear things up in no time, and rightly so.
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:D
 
The ANC believes its ‘mine’. The private sector believes it is ‘a mine’.

We thus propose the name ‘mine’ be changed to ‘the ANC’s’ – mainly for the benefit of the private sector. No doubt this will clear things up in no time, and rightly so.
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Brilliant!
 
Malema Maths

You know, everyone goes on about Malema's woodwork mark, I think the more important mark to be concerned with is his Matric Maths mark, a juicy 12 marks (12 out of 300 = 4%) represented by an H symbol. H was the lowest symbol you could obtain in a subject at School back in the day.

Never mind Chinese Maths (Some more ‘Chinese Maths’) we should rather start talking about Malema Maths in future as this boytjie has it all figured out. Brilliant article from DA Youth Chairperson, Mbali Ntuli.
 
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From the Thought leaders

Nationalising the mines is a lazy and foolish idea that will cause us to go the way of all African countries that forgot the place of the state in a budding economy. All you have to do is glance at the dilapidated African capitals that last got a facelift from the colonial masters before independence. The common denominator of them all was attempted shortcuts to economic recovery. This is what we are being invited to. There is frankly nothing magical about putting something under the state’s control and hoping that this will automatically achieve efficiency and redistribution. Frankly this is banal.

You don’t even have to cross the border to look at collapsing parastatals that have bled the taxpayer dry. How about making the only mine under the state function first before running amok with profitable enterprises. Some children still study under trees and 80% of our schools don’t have libraries and laboratories 16 years after democratic rule. There is no youth league campaign to stop the bleeding parastatals whose CEOs earn more than their counterparts in listed companies. How about getting some of these basics right first fellows?
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Now this straight talk is what the ANC’s national general council should have told its youth league instead of egg dancing with what the whole world already knows. Nevertheless one must commend President Zuma for lambasting the youth league for being a bad example. He implied that the naked bum chaos at its conferences cannot possibly produce anything worthy of consideration by the mother body and that they will never be taken seriously until they take themselves a tad more seriously. All those who have had a decent matric pass would have heard the sentiments loud and clear … nationalisation — it ain’t gonna happen in our lifetime.
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so says the man who failed woodwork

sox63 said:
Is that not the same thing though? As proposed in Australia, government would take 50+% of the profits! To me thats nationalization without the actual taking control of the company...
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wonder why their gold costs so much cheaper to produce... they had the cash to invest in robotics. Not only this, but the same investment went into many other fields too, ie computer chips, perhaps even medical... plenty inadvertently. i say it's better because it sparks development across all fields in this nation too, we need this if we are to have a technology market in the future. there is virtually none of this in africa, it's exactly what we should look for wherever we could find it

If the price is rising, what it likely means is that people need more of the stuff, and as such we have more money to find ways to get people more of this.

nah, tax the mines just as you would any other company.
 
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