Mirror (non)Trading International 2 - The Fallout

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gensix said:
The issue is actually proclaiming every incident as the demise or the end of the operation, without rational consideration. Continuously doing so in error - I understand the wishful thinking and the hope - but repeatedly making failed predictions doesn't attest to anyone's expertise. To the contrary, it serves as a contribution in serving the cult physcology, and making invested members more vulnerable. Each rebutted proclamation, serves to reassure the invested members, and encourages them to trust their leaders and show disdain to the apparent naysayers who are constantly proven wrong, providing a platform for the scammers to pull of the final heist with their members blissfully unaware. Present reason and fact, not emotion and presumption.
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What? This is a forum not court case ..I can use emotion whatever I feel on a forum. The invested members our vulnerable because they invested their money into MTI. As for facts go check out www.dishonest.co.za all the facts are there plain and simple for any invested MTI member to see. Then like every other human it’s their choice... any investment can be a risk... some more than others and some have moral issues too. based on the evidence it is 100% a scam. However if people want to knowingly profit off a scam they can it’s the same as gambling there will be winners and losers and the house always takes all. Simple.
 
gensix said:
The issue is actually proclaiming every incident as the demise or the end of the operation, without rational consideration. Continuously doing so in error - I understand the wishful thinking and the hope - but repeatedly making failed predictions doesn't attest to anyone's expertise. To the contrary, it serves as a contribution in serving the cult physcology, and making invested members more vulnerable. Each rebutted proclamation, serves to reassure the invested members, and encourages them to trust their leaders and show disdain to the apparent naysayers who are constantly proven wrong, providing a platform for the scammers to pull of the final heist with their members blissfully unaware. Present reason and fact, not emotion and presumption.
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There have been relatively few statements that incidents are the end of the operation. If you read them, most of the posts following an incident weigh this up to see if it is an indicator that the whole operation is a Ponzi, or a MLM without any product, or is operating illegally under one or other type of company regulation. So far the data indicates that MTI is all of these. The only area where the data does not constitute proof is of its being a Ponzi scheme and this is where the hopefulness in many posts comes through. Ponzi schemes can only be proven by showing that payments to existing members come from new member's investments and this requires audited accounts and fund transfer tracing. Even a crash doesn't PROVE it was a Ponzi scheme if the perpetrators simply disappear with the money - it might only have been a scam and theft.
 
Venator said:
This has been mentioned, but just putting it all together here.

So apparently Johann has already left the country on the 2nd of Dec, and yet this piece of scheming scamming scum posted about their "golf day" on the 3rd of Dec where Johann was present.
Looking further at the pics it seems this event actually took place a week prior.

View attachment 969914

View attachment 969916
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no pictures during price giving..of actual people not looking like scammers...ive been on plenty golf days and taking pics of guests during the day to share back was part of the norm....

now u can validate if johann entered his golf score on this date,or check how many golf scores was enterd on this day for this golf coarse..
 
newby_investor said:
Updated list:
@justreading is optimistic and thinks tomorrow (9 Dec).
@Waldman Jordaan for 12 Dec.
@Bruce Scott for 15 Dec.
@r00igev@@r for and @Wary GOM (ref) both for 16 Dec.
@MissKnow-a-Little for 17 Dec.
@charliedaniels for 18 Dec.
@Dr Ong reckons 20 Dec.
@Giepie1 for 22 Dec.
@Snyper564 and @soulie (ref) both for 27 Dec.
@gensix reckons they have it in them to drag it on until 30 Aug 2022.

Inserted some links but was too lazy to finish the list. You guys will just have to believe me ;-)
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I’ll take Jan 5th
 
gensix said:
I see a hysteria on both sides. Desperate end time prophecies for the past 18 months, people clutching onto anything and building it into the last gasp, and as one conspiracy fallacy crumbles, it immediately switches to another conspiracy scheme. Does anybody here have any factual information, rather than clutching at straws and desperately, almostly insanely hyping up everyhing.

All that is really obvious, is that MTI is having issues with their website, they are struggling to fix the issue, the CEO of a global company, may be in another country.

Does anybody have anything specific other than speculation and fabrications that are as laughable and riveting, as the MTI saga. I see this has been going on like this for the past 18 months?

In the meantime I am seeing those apparently being scoffed at here - making a lot of money, and they laugh at me and my conspiracy theme.
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gensix said:
Yes that's the source of my frustration, each and every one of those pages states - "this is the end", but the dragon still breathes 1000 pages later?

I don't doubt this is a ponzi scheme, a pyramid scheme, that there is no trading taking place - but I cannot prove it, I want proof, so it can all be over - no more family and friends trying to suck me into this, no more self doubt as to whether I am actually missing the bus on something, etc
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gensix said:
The issue is actually proclaiming every incident as the demise or the end of the operation, without rational consideration. Continuously doing so in error - I understand the wishful thinking and the hope - but repeatedly making failed predictions doesn't attest to anyone's expertise. To the contrary, it serves as a contribution in serving the cult physcology, and making invested members more vulnerable. Each rebutted proclamation, serves to reassure the invested members, and encourages them to trust their leaders and show disdain to the apparent naysayers who are constantly proven wrong, providing a platform for the scammers to pull of the final heist with their members blissfully unaware. Present reason and fact, not emotion and presumption.
Click to expand...
If you want facts just do the maths ....
trading pool is 23000 bitcoin monthly average is 10% compound interest which will be about 2400 bitcoin growth a month... mti has 90000 members that means everyone’s bitcoin grows 0.02 per month ... if the bot never has a bad day. Factor in bitcoin price dropping and transaction fees to withdraw your money .... and plus all the bonuses you earn that has to come from that 2400 somehow too.... you could buy 1 bitcoin at 280 000 dollars today .... and put into MTI earn 0.02 per month plus bonuses etc after a year withdraw it .... and the bitcoin price is now 217 000 dollars or worse you have lost big time and also Factor in rand dollar changes .... it’s the worst investment ever
 
Bsouthafrica said:
If you want facts just do the maths ....
trading pool is 23000 bitcoin monthly average is 10% compound interest which will be about 2400 bitcoin growth a month... mti has 90000 members that means everyone’s bitcoin grows 0.02 per month ... if the bot never has a bad day. Factor in bitcoin price dropping and transaction fees to withdraw your money .... and plus all the bonuses you earn that has to come from that 2400 somehow too.... you could buy 1 bitcoin at 280 000 dollars today .... and put into MTI earn 0.02 per month plus bonuses etc after a year withdraw it .... and the bitcoin price is now 217 000 dollars or worse you have lost big time and also Factor in rand dollar changes .... it’s the worst investment ever
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I don't know where you're buying BTC, but you're getting properly ripped off. Also, your maths could do with some work.
 
gensix said:
The issue is actually proclaiming every incident as the demise or the end of the operation, without rational consideration. Continuously doing so in error - I understand the wishful thinking and the hope - but repeatedly making failed predictions doesn't attest to anyone's expertise. To the contrary, it serves as a contribution in serving the cult physcology, and making invested members more vulnerable. Each rebutted proclamation, serves to reassure the invested members, and encourages them to trust their leaders and show disdain to the apparent naysayers who are constantly proven wrong, providing a platform for the scammers to pull of the final heist with their members blissfully unaware. Present reason and fact, not emotion and presumption.
Click to expand...
What he said.

Every time we predict eminent failure, and the failure fails : mr venter has reason to lick his lips and believe he's survived another mental vocabular attack.

Lindtbol rubbing her ring automatically evokes a knee jerk from us ;" she's getting ready to avoid Gandalf and flee !!" , but by observing this since May ,I can emphatically say i can fully understand where it is coming from.
Spider said it best when he also said " trying to disprove the bot is a test of intellect , not a fallacy". He is 100% correct.
Our wishful thinking is as strong as their ponzitivity.

It's not like a Cult.

It IS, a Cult.

I'm not going to make an end prediction : I've no basis of theory, on which to work from.
Muller will pedddle this until the end. All i see now, though, is misery and deception on the telegram groep.
Judging by that behaviour : a solid run of withdrawals will strangle this cat. I just don't know enough to make a prediction, û6 have stated numerous occasions that they will draw this thing out as long as possible.

The minds on this thread, equally rival any fiduciary endeavour in SA, not to mention the cogs of fsp justice.
 
The following names [+] were mentioned elsewhere [with their withdrawals at a certain date].
  • Ignatius Bell – 273 BTC (~$2.9 million)
  • Ignatius Michael Bell (second account) – 183.58702 BTC (~$2 million)
  • Clynton Marks (MTI admin) – 130.20470 BTC (~$1.4 million)
  • Alice Potgieter – 110.46455 BTC (~$1.2 million)
  • M Bell (third account) – 79.30734 BTC (~$867,979)
  • George Beetge – 76.57953 BTC (~$838,124)
  • Kathleen Meinking – 75.8 BTC (~$829,593)
  • Nico van der Merwe – 58.22434 BTC (~$637,236)
  • Sean Logan – 45.06488 BTC (~$493,212)
  • Henriette Bell – 44.57892 BTC (~$488,464)
  • Johannes Fourie – 42.18916 BTC (~$462,279)
Are these figures still the same? [Meaning: Has anyone on the list taken out more money since?]
I also wonder how many of the "downstream's upper levels" KNOWS it's likely a scam yet happily withdrew huge amounts while they *could*?
 
plcomp said:
The following names [+] were mentioned elsewhere [with their withdrawals at a certain date].
  • Ignatius Bell – 273 BTC (~$2.9 million)
  • Ignatius Michael Bell (second account) – 183.58702 BTC (~$2 million)
  • Clynton Marks (MTI admin) – 130.20470 BTC (~$1.4 million)
  • Alice Potgieter – 110.46455 BTC (~$1.2 million)
  • M Bell (third account) – 79.30734 BTC (~$867,979)
  • George Beetge – 76.57953 BTC (~$838,124)
  • Kathleen Meinking – 75.8 BTC (~$829,593)
  • Nico van der Merwe – 58.22434 BTC (~$637,236)
  • Sean Logan – 45.06488 BTC (~$493,212)
  • Henriette Bell – 44.57892 BTC (~$488,464)
  • Johannes Fourie – 42.18916 BTC (~$462,279)
Are these figures still the same? [Meaning: Has anyone on the list taken out more money since?]
I also wonder how many of the "downstream's upper levels" KNOWS it's likely a scam yet happily withdrew huge amounts while they *could*?
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IIRC, those figures are from the MTi Leaks...all figures were as of the 14th of Sept. I've got no doubt at all that they've taken out a butt load more since then, but they may also have deposited more (although many of them deposited very very little anyways).
 
newby_investor said:
Updated list:
@justreading is optimistic and thinks tomorrow (9 Dec).
@Waldman Jordaan for 12 Dec.
@Bruce Scott for 15 Dec.
@r00igev@@r for and @Wary GOM (ref) both for 16 Dec.
@MissKnow-a-Little for 17 Dec.
@charliedaniels for 18 Dec.
@Dr Ong reckons 20 Dec.
@Giepie1 for 22 Dec.
@Snyper564 and @soulie (ref) both for 27 Dec.
@gensix reckons they have it in them to drag it on until 30 Aug 2022.

Inserted some links but was too lazy to finish the list. You guys will just have to believe me ;-)
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Put me down for 28 Dec 2020
 
gensix said:
You see! Johan left the country on 2 Dec, look at how this was introduced to the thread, and how it is now an established fact? Is It?

Of course we saw a video which suggests he is not in South Africa - has he fled? is he on Holiday? Is he on a business trip? yes he has grown a beard, which seems to have taken Cheri aback a bit, but is this evidence of something? The simple question is - is this 2nd Dec statement a fact?
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Its a fact. I cannot give you the source of the information, so believe it, dont believe it. Thats the nature of privileged information.
As I said before, just give it less than a week before everyone will have much more very official information.
 
newby_investor said:
Updated list:
@justreading is optimistic and thinks tomorrow (9 Dec).
@Waldman Jordaan for 12 Dec.
@Bruce Scott for 15 Dec.
@r00igev@@r for and @Wary GOM (ref) both for 16 Dec.
@MissKnow-a-Little for 17 Dec.
@charliedaniels for 18 Dec.
@Dr Ong reckons 20 Dec.
@Giepie1 for 22 Dec.
@Snyper564 and @soulie (ref) both for 27 Dec.
@gensix reckons they have it in them to drag it on until 30 Aug 2022.

Inserted some links but was too lazy to finish the list. You guys will just have to believe me ;-)
Click to expand...
Totally believe you - it's on MyBB- must be true!
Anyway, I dibs the 16th for an announcement from one of the top dogs stating the BTC can't be found.
Might as well totally throw away all my morals and start gambling now as well.
 
Bruce Scott said:
Its a fact. I cannot give you the source of the information, so believe it, dont believe it. Thats the nature of privileged information.
As I said before, just give it less than a week before everyone will have much more very official information.
Click to expand...
There are so many sources on this site that can't reveal their identities. Feels a bit like Watchmen sometimes.
 
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