MWEB - Message from CEO - Acceptable Use Policy

[Necuno]

Good evening ladies and gents

I see there has been quite a lot of debate regarding "the call". Please note that I limit my posts to clarifying specific issues from time to time if I feel that it can add some value. I'm also not going to discuss the specifics of individual customers who have been contacted regarding abuse, this is a matter between MWEB and the customer so please do not expect me to respond to questions about what customer X did, or didn’t do.

I would like to clarify a few points based on recent comments and re-emphasize some of my previous comments.

There is a lot of speculation going on about whether we are looking at a gigabyte limit, or some other such arbitrary rule to determine who is 'abusive'. Let me state again, we are looking at behaviour over an extended period of time and we are considering factors such as:

· repeated incidents of long periods of uninterrupted downloading at high speeds.
· the use of various techniques which allow vast amounts of traffic to be transferred at line, or near line speeds for extended periods of time.
This includes vpns and tunnelled http traffic from commercial seedbox services (thanks Venificus for describing the methods used by these services earlier).

Customers found to be making extensive use of ‘unshaping techniques’ will not be given a second chance.
These are the actions of an Internet savvy user who has gone to some lengths to optimize their downloading experience, not someone who stumbled on a faster way to download by pure chance.
These users are having a very real impact on the integrity of the network and service delivery to the vast majority of our customers is the first priority here.

This is not a process that is going to affect normal reasonable Internet users. The handful of people being affected by this know that they are pushing the envelope trying to continuously download as much as possible, as fast as possible. This isn’t what our shaped product was designed for and we quite simply cannot allow it be used in this way.

Kind Regards
MWEB Operations (Tech Manager)

1) so non extensive use of a seed box is ok ?

for example:
4 hour run limited to 250kB/s. instead of max line speed of 424kB/s.​

2) what if i require steam download that exceeds 4 hours and goes max till it's finished ? there is 114 games in my non-installed list i have not tried out itsa going be beeg.

 

[xrapidx]

shame...

 

[SabreWolfy]

so non extensive use of a seed box is ok ?

for example:
4 hour run limited to 250kB/s. instead of max line speed of 424kB/s.

They're not going to say, obviously. The moment they do, everyone will use up to whatever limit they said. You're welcome to "sort of" bypass shaping at your own risk I guess.

 

[Necuno]

They're not going to say, obviously. The moment they do, everyone will use up to whatever limit they said.

he did say repeated raping is not allowed so now and then should be cool with rational use, but i get what you saying. instead of 100% i say limited it to 90 or 80 as long as it is not 100...

· repeated incidents of long periods of uninterrupted downloading at high speeds.
· the use of various techniques which allow vast amounts of traffic to be transferred at line, or near line speeds for extended periods of time.
This includes vpns and tunnelled http traffic from commercial seedbox services (thanks Venificus for describing the methods used by these services earlier).[/B]

 

[SabreWolfy]

he did say repeated raping is not allowed so now and then should be cool with rational use, but i get what you saying. instead of 100% i say limited it to 90 or 80 as long as it is not 100...

Yes, but we don't know what algorithm they are using. If you bypass shaping "a litte" this month, that might be fine. Do it again next month and the month after that, and then you might find that they've determined your usage is in contravention of the T&C. They're under no obligation to spell out exactly "how much" you can "sort of" contravene the T&C. It's at their discretion.

 

[Necuno]

Yes, but we don't know what algorithm they are using. If you bypass shaping "a litte" this month, that might be fine. Do it again next month and the month after that, and then you might find that they've determined your usage is in contravention of the T&C. They're under no obligation to spell out exactly "how much" you can "sort of" contravene the T&C. It's at their discretion.

well. what is worse. about 60 gigs of that spread throughout the month or like some here 800+ gigs ?

 

[SSung]

Customers found to be making extensive use of ‘unshaping techniques’ will not be given a second chance.

I've never heard of this practice before. Didn't MWEB state somewhere that they are adhering or aiming to meet international standards? When I was with Pipex in the UK I was sent a warning letter and asked to curb my data usage. I complied, but not because I felt I had to. It was because they were reasonable about the whole affair and had treated me well for all the time I was with them (2003-2007). Others, chose not to alter their habits, but I don't think anything happened to them in the end.

This type of behaviour can only be to everyone's detriment in the long run. You're losing the trust of those who were (up until recently at least) promoting MWEB as an ISP, and a bunch of them are now also living in dread of receiving *the* call and trying to explain that they were only making use of what they thought they'd paid for. How do we know that you won't be targeting people who use download managers and charging them with 'abuse' for 'unattended data transfer' next week? Who's up after that?

 

[SabreWolfy]

I think we need to give MWeb some credit here though -- they are not simply looking at usage over a month and deciding that a user is in contravention. They are monitoring usage over an extended period of time to determine usage patterns. They obviously won't release those details to use -- it would defeat the entire exercise. If you contravene the T&C, you are running the risk of your service being suspended. It's as simple as that. If you want to experiment and bypass shaping "a little" this month and a little more next month, go ahead, but don't be surprised when your account is terminated a few months later.

 

[SabreWolfy]

I've never heard of this practice before. Didn't MWEB state somewhere that they are adhering or aiming to meet international standards? When I was with Pipex in the UK I was sent a warning letter and asked to curb my data usage. I complied, but not because I felt had to. It was because they were reasonable about the whole affair and had treated me well for all the time I was with them (2003-2007). Others, chose not to alter their habits, but I don't think anything happened to them in the end.

This type of behaviour can only be to everyone's detriment in the long run. You're losing the trust of those who were (up until recently at least) promoting MWEB as an ISP, and a bunch of them are now also living in dread of receiving *the* call and trying to explain that they were only making use of what they thought they'd paid for. How do we know that you won't be targeting people who use download managers and charging them with 'abuse' for 'unattended data transfer' next week? Who's up after that?

If you read their T&C you will find that they can do this, obviously. It is in everyone's interests of course. Any excessive and unexpected load on the network means that everyone's access can be compromised.

 

[PeterCH]

I think we need to give MWeb some credit here though -- they are not simply looking at usage over a month and deciding that a user is in contravention. They are monitoring usage over an extended period of time to determine usage patterns. They obviously won't release those details to use -- it would defeat the entire exercise. If you contravene the T&C, you are running the risk of your service being suspended. It's as simple as that. If you want to experiment and bypass shaping "a little" this month and a little more next month, go ahead, but don't be surprised when your account is terminated a few months later.

Extended period of time? What's that? 3 lousy months.

MWEB is definitely being UNFAIR.

 

[Necuno]

I think we need to give MWeb some credit here though -- they are not simply looking at usage over a month and deciding that a user is in contravention. They are monitoring usage over an extended period of time to determine usage patterns. They obviously won't release those details to use -- it would defeat the entire exercise. If you contravene the T&C, you are running the risk of your service being suspended. It's as simple as that. If you want to experiment and bypass shaping "a little" this month and a little more next month, go ahead, but don't be surprised when your account is terminated a few months later.

i get the jizt of the matter. i still don't see err in using something like downstorm/erovps rationally and not going ape ****. two motivations for that being poor health torrents and not wanting to leave my box on 24.7.

 

[PeterCH]

i get the jizt of the matter. i still don't see err in using something like downstorm/erovps rationally and not going ape ****. two motivations for that being poor health torrents and not wanting to leave my box on 24.7.

Another motivation may be that you don't want a letter from RIAA. MWEB should be happy with that.

 

[PeterCH]

If you read their T&C you will find that they can do this, obviously. It is in everyone's interests of course. Any excessive and unexpected load on the network means that everyone's access can be compromised.

Their CEO however said they wouldn't kick people off.

 

[Necuno]

Their CEO however said they wouldn't kick people off.

i still don't see a rock solid case.

you are ****ing with the t&c; hence the cut off at end of the month. it's not like sol matrix that terminated you because of just using too much though it could be confused as same thing.

 

[PeterCH]

i still don't see a rock solid case.

you are ****ing with the t&c; hence the cut off at end of the month. it's not like sol matrix that terminated you because of just using too much though it could be confused as same thing.

MWEB are being very heavy handed - terminating people without a warning. If this happened in the US there would a class action suit already.

 

[SabreWolfy]

Their CEO however said they wouldn't kick people off.

The assumption being that you are adhering to the T&C obviously. Otherwise anyone can use a normal Connect account to run 10 internet cafe's because MWeb will "never kick me off". It's always about the T&C.

 

[Necuno]

MWEB are being very heavy handed - terminating people without a warning. If this happened in the US there would a class action suit already.

isn't the warning already spelt out in the t&c's ?

 

[SabreWolfy]

MWEB are being very heavy handed - terminating people without a warning. If this happened in the US there would a class action suit already.

From all 10 people they've kicked off, who willingly contravened the T&C. I don't think so.

 

[PeterCH]

isn't the warning already spelt out in the t&c's ?

1. HTTPS on news servers is advertised on news servers as a PRIVACY measure. Most countries where these news servers operate do not have shaping.
2. VPN is not illegal or mentioned explicitly as in "You may not use a VPN service on MWEB."
3. TOS by their definition are not a warning but a list of rules.
4. The TOS are worded to appear that people who intend to degrade network quality are abusers, however that's not the intent of these heavy downloaders.

 

[PeterCH]

From all 10 people they've kicked off, who willingly contravened the T&C. I don't think so.

Define "willingly". Do you have proof?