Official Super Rugby Thread 2013

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Fulcrum29 said:
The new champs will either be:

1. Brumbies (I sincerely hope not)
2. Previous Champs (They deserve the title again…)
3. Crusaders (My NZ team…)

Cannot see how the other will be able to push through, maybe Bulls… don’t know. Should the Cheetahs win, then we will hear their supporters go on about this like in FOREVER (it will always be the year 2013)… And we have enough Blue Bulls prophets already :p
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So the teams that are in the top six (It can not change):

Bulls
Chiefs
Brumbies
Saders
Reds
Cheetahs

QF1.) Team 3 vs Team 6
QF2.) Team 4 vs Team 5

The first placed team from the regular season will play the lowest ranked qualifier in week 1 of the play offs.

The second placed team from the regular season plays the team highest ranked qualifier in week 1 of the play offs.

SF1.) Team 1 vs lowest ranked qualifier.
SF2.) Team 2 v highest ranked qualifier.

The final will be made up by the teams who won the semi-finals.

Final Winner SF1 v SF2

Edit: The Bulls could still slink to 3rd place. But if all stays as is QF1 will be Brumbies vs Cheetahs and QF2 Saders vs Reds.

If the Bulls drop to 3rd they will play the cheetahs :(
 
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Devill said:
So the teams that are in the top six (It can not change):

Bulls
Chiefs
Brumbies
Saders
Reds
Cheetahs

QF1.) Team 3 vs Team 6
QF2.) Team 4 vs Team 5

The first placed team from the regular season will play the lowest ranked qualifier in week 1 of the play offs.

The second placed team from the regular season plays the team highest ranked qualifier in week 1 of the play offs.

SF1.) Team 1 vs lowest ranked qualifier.
SF2.) Team 2 v highest ranked qualifier.

The final will be made up by the teams who won the semi-finals.

Final Winner SF1 v SF2

Edit: The Bulls could still slink to 3rd place. But if all stays as is QF1 will be Brumbies vs Cheetahs and QF2 Saders vs Reds.

If the Bulls drop to 3rd they will play the cheetahs :(
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Rugby Union statistics (up to 2012):

Crusaders vs. Reds - http://www.rugbydata.com/superrugby/crusaders/reds/gamesplayed

Brumbies vs. Cheetahs - http://www.rugbydata.com/superrugby/crusaders/reds/gamesplayed

Bulls vs. Cheetahs - http://www.rugbydata.com/superrugby/bulls/cheetahs/gamesplayed

I predict high scoring games... but it is obvious that the Cheetahs will be clinging onto a maybe victory either way. Reds vs. Saders will be a tough decision… I will back NZ over the Aussies anytime at this stage in the Super Rugby. I also would not like it should the Stormers give away a victory to the Bulls… Stormers must play to win; I hate it when politics come into play… It is probable that the SA Rugby Unions would not like the Bulls to play the Cheetahs in QF1.

At least we have 2 teams (NZ / AUS / SA) each in the top six.
 
Another outcome (as indicate by me above) sees the Reds finish 6th and playing 3rd, be it bulls or brumbies or chiefs or crusaders.

Only Brumbies and Bulls are guaranteed top 3 finish. (Theory has Reds too but that would require a PD of over a hundred in their last game, as wins and draws and BP with brumbies are still able to be the same - at least in my understanding).

Chiefs could no point lose with Crusaders getting BP win.
Reds could no point lose and go to 6th, pushing Cheetahs in 5
 
Fulcrum29 said:
Rugby Union statistics (up to 2012):

Crusaders vs. Reds - http://www.rugbydata.com/superrugby/crusaders/reds/gamesplayed

Brumbies vs. Cheetahs - http://www.rugbydata.com/superrugby/crusaders/reds/gamesplayed

Bulls vs. Cheetahs - http://www.rugbydata.com/superrugby/bulls/cheetahs/gamesplayed

I predict high scoring games... but it is obvious that the Cheetahs will be clinging onto a maybe victory either way. Reds vs. Saders will be a tough decision… I will back NZ over the Aussies anytime at this stage in the Super Rugby. I also would not like it should the Stormers give away a victory to the Bulls… Stormers must play to win; I hate it when politics come into play… It is probable that the SA Rugby Unions would not like the Bulls to play the Cheetahs in QF1.

At least we have 2 teams (NZ / AUS / SA) each in the top six.
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I would also not be impressed if the Stormers gave it to the bulls.

I hope the bulls win however, as I would really not like to see the bulls play the cheetahs. And I would like to see the reds and saders have a crack at each other.
 
Oh, where to begin...

I know:

As many may have gathered, I do enjoy the musings of the Ballz Visual Radio team. I have always had a great deal of time for Darren Scott (his off-mic musings aside) and the rest of his team. Tonight, Campo was on again and offered his views of the coming week. And then some introspection followed into the stupidity of this format - not as deep as mine are, though.


FFS, we are once again at that point where mediocrity (aka the Conference Cup) is inferred. Campo said that in Oz, nobody gives a flying fck. SuperRugby has had to move to free to air TV to get the viewership into the hundreds.

So why are we still messing with this retarded format. In the past, each team had 13 matches to play and a real winner emerged. Again, we will have three winners and then a real winner. This year, my team is one of the 3. And I feel no sense of achievement what so fcking ever.

Just ranting...

I wil have something more comprehensive tomorrow.
 
Serfontein out for 2 weeks, so will miss the Stormers clash.

GreGorGy, what format would he (and you) prefer? Just play your matches, accumulate points, and the one with the most wins? Or just do away with conferences altogether and let log dictate who goes through?

I think the problem initially was that if some of the teams don't do well enough then they fall away pretty soon and the people lose interest cos no one from that country is in the running anymore.
 
Glad we kept on to Willie - I really think the Cheetahs are turning a new leaf when it comes to player retention and money management - like in the past all the newly crowned boks would be scooped up and then we build again - now it looks like we are building a great team with momentum and continuity.

Good luck to the Bulls this weekend - sorry to the Stormers supporters but I have to think patriotically here for what is best for SA rugby, then Reds go you good things! Saders you can lose for all I care.

I would love this playoffs scenario:

Brumbies host Cheetahs
Reds host Saders - this is wishful thinking I know.

Then Cheetahs can play the Bulls and Chiefs can play the saders or reds.

I think at this stage the travel will affect us badly when going to NZ :D
 
OrbitalDawn said:
Serfontein out for 2 weeks, so will miss the Stormers clash.

GreGorGy, what format would he (and you) prefer? Just play your matches, accumulate points, and the one with the most wins? Or just do away with conferences altogether and let log dictate who goes through?

I think the problem initially was that if some of the teams don't do well enough then they fall away pretty soon and the people lose interest cos no one from that country is in the running anymore.
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There are too many teams. Go back to 10 teams and play home and away - top 2 teams play in a final for the trophy.

I would like to see more international matches and longer tours, especially where the Northern Hemisphere is involved.

In this way our Currie Cup will regain some of its former glory as well... you can even have the top finishing franchise side in a promotion relegation match for the Super 10 spot.
 
No matter waht you okes say, but we all know the Stormers is gonna klap the Bulls this weekend. bulls might as well rest their players for the play offs.
 
MickeyD said:
There are too many teams. Go back to 10 teams and play home and away - top 2 teams play in a final for the trophy.

I would like to see more international matches and longer tours, especially where the Northern Hemisphere is involved.

In this way our Currie Cup will regain some of its former glory as well... you can even have the top finishing franchise side in a promotion relegation match for the Super 10 spot.
Click to expand...

Interesting idea... Also wouldn't mind more tests and proper tours. A North vs. South mini-competition could also be quite cool.

How would you determine who falls out to fit only 10 teams, though? Previous year's log standing and then relegation matches?
 
OrbitalDawn said:
Interesting idea... Also wouldn't mind more tests and proper tours. A North vs. South mini-competition could also be quite cool.

How would you determine who falls out to fit only 10 teams, though? Previous year's log standing and then relegation matches?
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New franchises? eg. only 4 SA/NZ franchises and 2 for Oz. Force existing franchises to consolidate...
 
OrbitalDawn said:
Interesting idea... Also wouldn't mind more tests and proper tours. A North vs. South mini-competition could also be quite cool.

How would you determine who falls out to fit only 10 teams, though? Previous year's log standing and then relegation matches?
Click to expand...

In SA club rugby they changed the League structure (2014) to include 15 teams, similar to Super 15. Not one club in the Super A League is happy with this decision, meaning that 5 Super B League teams will have to move up and all the way down under must do the same. Maties complaining the most and due to limited capital in clubs nowadays there is a proposition to go back to community (local players) clubs, thus bringing an end to purchasing players etc. Maties being the world’s largest club, not taking Boland in account since they are not WP, is probably going to oppose this decision, but they do keep players locked up who might even never see some game time. In club rugby you cannot simply walk over to another club, this is a registration process which takes time with the Rugby Union and all managing boards must provide the clearance. The problem is that WP has +120 clubs which is entirely unmanageable, not to mention that some clubs are sharing home grounds.

The reason I mentioning this is that Maties is the test ground related to rules and regulations in the Southern Hemisphere and decisions like these will make things very awkward or very interesting.

It is not likely that the Super Rugby structure will change now; it is only the Aussies who want to throw out one team. This product is too valuable to the marketers and they will ultimately have the say.
 
I like the thinking that is taking place (except the special one's ramblings :D although he may be right).
Sorry K.

Darren thinks each country is responsible for its own domestic league - I kinda agree.

SA, NZ and OZ all go ape in a domestic league from Jan to say Jun. International break. Then, top contenders from each domestic league (say top 3) all meet up for a series of 9. Super 9. You play 4 home, 4 away. Decided by draw. That takes care of July and Aug.

At the end, we will have two top teams to fight for the trophy. Sometime in Sept. Oct and Nov are now open for other things, like RC (ex Tri Nations) etc. The point is, this S15 is a patch for OZ's lack of a domestic league (and even domestic interest).
 
Fulcrum29 said:
In SA club rugby they changed the League structure (2014) to include 15 teams, similar to Super 15. Not one club in the Super A League is happy with this decision, meaning that 5 Super B League teams will have to move up and all the way down under must do the same. Maties complaining the most and due to limited capital in clubs nowadays there is a proposition to go back to community (local players) clubs, thus bringing an end to purchasing players etc. Maties being the world’s largest club, not taking Boland in account since they are not WP, is probably going to oppose this decision, but they do keep players locked up who might even never see some game time. In club rugby you cannot simply walk over to another club, this is a registration process which takes time with the Rugby Union and all managing boards must provide the clearance. The problem is that WP has +120 clubs which is entirely unmanageable, not to mention that some clubs are sharing home grounds.

The reason I mentioning this is that Maties is the test ground related to rules and regulations in the Southern Hemisphere and decisions like these will make things very awkward or very interesting.

It is not likely that the Super Rugby structure will change now; it is only the Aussies who want to throw out one team. This product is too valuable to the marketers and they will ultimately have the say.
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Well yeah, money speaks, and rugby has become big business. Clubs won't ever like losing their profile by being relegated or demoted.
 
They will never reduce the number of teams in Super Rugby, there is just too much money involved. The only way to make the competition better would be to go back to the old format and rid ourselves of the conference system and perhaps kick the Aussies in the ass and tell them to start their own domestic league.
 
Stupid flying tackle 4 weeks but headbutt, 2 weeks ......... yep, nothing wrong with the process AT ALL .... moving along :rolleyes:
 
Guys I have said this so many times but it falls on deaf ears:

Change Super rugby to 20 teams with 4 groups of 5 teams, play home and away - the extra 5 spots can go to Lions, Pampas another Argie team and then 2 teams from Japan.

Pool winner and runner up plays home and away quarters, then home and away semi finals then a Final - I would prefer if they determined the final location before hand or they can go with the team with the most log points/wins/tries scored to host.

The championship winning team would play 8 pool games, 4 playoffs and 1 final.

The games would just be 10 less (last time I did a calculation but never saved it) but you get new audiences.

SARU/SARFU whoever can give the Pampas Mombela stadium and build a team village, get the supporters going with free flags and promotions - like what they do at world cups, the small cities adopt a 2nd tier nation. Same with the other Argie team or even let them keep Mendoza/Beunos Aires as their homeground.

Less rugby for the players, shorter tournament which means tours and the CC gets back on track and we are all happy.
 
At 11 off the pace, my Superbru is fubared.

Crusaders over Hurricanes: They will want to make sure that the winners of the conference only get decided by the very end. Not getting the full 5 here makes the Chiefs win.

Blues down to Chiefs: Chiefs won't care what the saders do - they're gonna edge the blues anyways to gain to top log spot, if only for a few hours.

Waratahs will do in Reds: I see the reds realising that the outcome of this match will not affect their standings at all and therefore (see above) they will probably be conservative in their play, staving off injury and strain, cos they know they won't catch the brumbies.

Force lose to Brumbies: but I don't expect a humdinger. Brumbies will do what is required, nothing more.

Stormers v Bulls: I think for this game, everyone is gonna go with their own team. The sakkies will choose province while the oxen okes will go for Bulls. Without a bonus pt win, the Chiefs will sit on 65 points. With 63 points, the Bulls would only need a draw to take the top spot. So, if chiefs fail to bonus,I say draw. If the get a bonus, I gotta go with my boys in blue.
 
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