Polo~ The Mint with the Hole

[DanH]

So out of curiosity, what is the reliability like on a 1.2l turbo charged engine?

Both on the short term (within warranty) and long term (8+ years)?

I am making no claims here and not asking for heresy, are there any facts about it either way?

Turbo charged engines have more parts and run closer to tolerance so the failure rate and lifetime should be shorted but better manufacturing could counteract it to some degree.

I'm curious if there is some information out there that shows the 50th (what most customers would see) and 90th percentile (typically the worse off customers) when it comes to failures of these engines vs N/A.

I'm very curious about the reliability too.

In SA cars are very expensive compared with our earnings and we keep them longer than is done in first worlds. Our cars don't go in the crusher when we are bored of them, but resold and reused until there is nothing left due to ban on imports.

I expect a car to be able to last me 10y/200 000km should I so choose with only minor annoyances such as a battery, shocks, maybe a CV or something else minor in the second 5y.

I would expect the engine to be worn and need to be rebuilt/replaced somewhere between 250-300 000km.

Now what happens with a 1.2L turbo. How long can I expect the motor to last? How long will the turbo last? How long will the direct injectors last?

And do VW still only give a 3y warranty?

 

[Fazda]

I was in discussion with one of the management of VW back in the mid 80's, just after he had got back from a trip to Germany.

I asked him about the future of engines - at that stage, bigger was better, end of story. Anyway when I asked him, he just grinned and told me that I would be horrified to know that VW was doing extensive tests on a 1.2 Turbo that would out perform their current 1600.

That was just under thirty years ago, and they were then testing these motors to destruction.

The 1.2 Turbo has done many millions of test kilometers in the interim, so I wouldn't be too concerned as to what they will be like after 8 or 10 years.

 

[Ancalagon]

I was in discussion with one of the management of VW back in the mid 80's, just after he had got back from a trip to Germany.

I asked him about the future of engines - at that stage, bigger was better, end of story. Anyway when I asked him, he just grinned and told me that I would be horrified to know that VW was doing extensive tests on a 1.2 Turbo that would out perform their current 1600.

That was just under thirty years ago, and they were then testing these motors to destruction.

The 1.2 Turbo has done many millions of test kilometers in the interim, so I wouldn't be too concerned as to what they will be like after 8 or 10 years.

But what about the fact that the Polo GTI went from the 1.4 twincharger to the 1.8 turbo? There were rumours that they were having reliability problems with the 1.4 twincharger.

 

[Zuluzebra]

I had a 1.6 comfortline which I sold and upgraded to larger SUV. People should really do their research on what they can actually get for the same money

The new comfortline with just basic extras (metallic paint, cruise control etc) will cost around R222 000 which is ridiculous for that small car. Good car but you can get so much more for that price.

 

[Fazda]

But what about the fact that the Polo GTI went from the 1.4 twincharger to the 1.8 turbo? There were rumours that they were having reliability problems with the 1.4 twincharger.

I have no idea.

I had a 1.6 comfortline which I sold and upgraded to larger SUV. People should really do their research on what they can actually get for the same money

The new comfortline with just basic extras (metallic paint, cruise control etc) will cost around R222 000 which is ridiculous for that small car. Good car but you can get so much more for that price.

What? Like a Fiat 500?

 

[Sm00thSm0k3]

I had a 1.6 comfortline which I sold and upgraded to larger SUV. People should really do their research on what they can actually get for the same money

The new comfortline with just basic extras (metallic paint, cruise control etc) will cost around R222 000 which is ridiculous for that small car. Good car but you can get so much more for that price.

Agreed. VW's are way overpriced (and overrated if you ask me). There is a lot better "value for money" buys out there but as someone said, too many people in SA are obsessed with brand and image or "NEW" rather than substance. I just can't understand why on earth anyone would pay R220K for a small 1.2 hatch when for a similar amount of money one can purchase a low mileage 2012 A4 1.8T or a low mileage E90 BMW 320i. Just doesn't make sense.

These small motors with turbo's/superchargers concern me. I know of 2 Tiguan 1.4 TSi owners who've both had to have the engines replaced before 60 000 km due to the hammering that the engine took from the supercharger and turbo.

That being said, that 1.2 with a turbo if is going to take a beating if the driver has a heavy foot...and lets be honest here, most people with a turbo on the engine tend to push the car. I can also imagine that once you load that Polo with passengers, that turbo is going to work overtime.

 

[Ancalagon]

I had a 1.6 comfortline which I sold and upgraded to larger SUV. People should really do their research on what they can actually get for the same money

The new comfortline with just basic extras (metallic paint, cruise control etc) will cost around R222 000 which is ridiculous for that small car. Good car but you can get so much more for that price.

Hence why VW has dropped the price. Comfortline Polo went from R224k to R209k, and they now throw in a better engine, service plan and better interior.

 

[Zuluzebra]

I have no idea.


What? Like a Fiat 500?

No like a second hand A4..., or spend 20 000 more and get a new car that's more value

 

[Zuluzebra]

Hence why VW has dropped the price. Comfortline Polo went from R224k to R209k, and they now throw in a better engine, service plan and better interior.

Once all the accessories come on the price is still way too expensive...

 

[Ancalagon]

Once all the accessories come on the price is still way too expensive...

Agreed but my point is that even VW is feeling the pinch and they have had to drop prices.

 

[Gnome]

If there was any serious issues with reliability, I'm sure there would have been more noise about it on the internet.

There are a lot of complaints about it on the internet but that isn't really an accurate measure.

I was in discussion with one of the management of VW back in the mid 80's, just after he had got back from a trip to Germany.

I asked him about the future of engines - at that stage, bigger was better, end of story. Anyway when I asked him, he just grinned and told me that I would be horrified to know that VW was doing extensive tests on a 1.2 Turbo that would out perform their current 1600.

That was just under thirty years ago, and they were then testing these motors to destruction.

The 1.2 Turbo has done many millions of test kilometers in the interim, so I wouldn't be too concerned as to what they will be like after 8 or 10 years.

Your argument is largely invalid for many reasons:
- Testing at scale (or in the field) is different than testing in a lab
- Testing a prototype is different than testing the final product
- Testing requires large quantities (> 1000 data points) to be valid statistically.
- Testing in isolation is not indicative of testing a product as a whole.
I could list a large number more reasons.

Also I wouldn't really expect that kind of information to be released by a manufacturer like VW unless it showed increased reliability.
Lastly testing is only as good as the individuals whom prepared the tests and the parameters of the tests.

This whole list of reasons is the exact reason commercial aircraft manufacturers have uplinks to aircraft engines which send metrics of the engines to the manufacturer.

That said, I'm more asking about reliability over the long term and don't expect that from car manufacturers (yet).

 

[Fazda]

There are a lot of complaints about it on the internet but that isn't really an accurate measure.



Your argument is largely invalid for many reasons:
- Testing at scale (or in the field) is different than testing in a lab
- Testing a prototype is different than testing the final product
- Testing requires large quantities (> 1000 data points) to be valid statistically.
- Testing in isolation is not indicative of testing a product as a whole.
I could list a large number more reasons.

Also I wouldn't really expect that kind of information to be released by a manufacturer like VW unless it showed increased reliability.
Lastly testing is only as good as the individuals whom prepared the tests and the parameters of the tests.

This whole list of reasons is the exact reason commercial aircraft manufacturers have uplinks to aircraft engines which send metrics of the engines to the manufacturer.

That said, I'm more asking about reliability over the long term and don't expect that from car manufacturers (yet).

I related the story simply to highlight the fact that VW has been working on a 1.2 Turbo for approximately 30 years, and that this new model is not some flash in the pan.
VW would also have done some pretty extensive testing before releasing the car to the public, plus it was released in Europe before here, so I will stick to the fact that reliability should not be a problem.

 

[Rouxenator]

Well there is definitely hope for the new Polo.
Firstly the engines are a huge improvement over the current crap they are selling, I mean seriously, a 1.6 that kicked out 77kw? The new 1.2 is an amazing little power-plant.
Secondly looking at the new Adam-inspired Corsa E/Mk5 I am sure some people will rather go for the still dull, drab and boring Polo even if it means living with a church pew interior.

 

[Rocket-Boy]

Well there is definitely hope for the new Polo.
Firstly the engines are a huge improvement over the current crap they are selling, I mean seriously, a 1.6 that kicked out 77kw? The new 1.2 is an amazing little power-plant.
Secondly looking at the new Adam-inspired Corsa E/Mk5 I am sure some people will rather go for the still dull, drab and boring Polo even if it means living with a church pew interior.

It looks a whole lot better than the Corsa E, there is no denying that.