Prius haters

xrapidx said:
Ok. One study against another - doesn't make the hummer one wrong, these could be wrong.
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Not really, the CNW study has been thoroughly and repeatedly debunked.

What is clear, however, is that the conclusions appear to be very different from the results of several other rigorous, scientifically-reviewed studies of the lifecycle impact of vehicles (e.g. Argonne National Laboratory, Massachusetts Institute of Technology).

* Example 1: These studies conclude that the majority (80-85%) of the total lifetime energy use of a vehicle comes from the driving stage, with the remainder coming from the remaining stages of a vehicle life, whereas the CNW study shows these percentages to be reversed.
* Example 2: Two Toyota models mentioned in the report, the Scion xA and xB sold only in the USA, are engineered with the same processes, built on the same assembly line, transported and shipped together, distributed through the same dealer network, have the same engines and transmissions, are about the same weight (within 50 lbs.), and have very similar fuel consumption ratings (one just over 35 mpg combined, the other just below 35), yet the CNW study shows the lifetime energy use of these vehicles to be very different (53 per cent).
* Example 3: The CNW study states that hybrids require more lifetime energy than even large SUVs. Toyota's internal analysis does conclude that there is more energy required in the materials production stage for a hybrid, but that this is overwhelmingly made up for in the driving stage (the 80-85% stage), causing the hybrid to have a significantly lower lifetime energy use.

There are also basic factual errors in the report, for example CNW claim that the hybrid batteries are not recycled.
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BlueCollar said:
It's not *that* underpowered anyway or expensive. I've posted before on this forum a cost comparison of a VW Golf 5 TDI (very similar performance to a Prius) kitted out with all the options that a Prius has as standard, and the Golf comes out more expensive.
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But that's not a fair comparison, with the Golf you are not forced to take all those extras, usually the standard features will suffice for most.

The question is what makes the Prius better than a R300k Audi/BMW/Merc/Lexus? Sure it has a few nice tricks, but not worth the price IMO.

I'd think that even the Joule would make a lot more sense considering that it might enter the market at about half the price of a Prius.
 
Smooth Criminal said:
But that's not a fair comparison, with the Golf you are not forced to take all those extras, usually the standard features will suffice for most.

The question is what makes the Prius better than a R300k Audi/BMW/Merc/Lexus? Sure it has a few nice tricks, but not worth the price IMO.

I'd think that even the Joule would make a lot more sense considering that it might enter the market at about half the price of a Prius.
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That is a good question, and it's one that comes down to personal preference for what someone is looking for in a vehicle. A Prius may not be as fast or good looking or handle quite as well as a similarly priced Audi or BMW, but it's a lot more economical to run, it has more interior space and it has a more standard features. Depends what you want from a car - for example, the Prius competes directly with the Avensis 2.0 diesel as a large, comfortable, economical car. Personally, I reckon the Prius wins here hands down.
 
xrapidx said:
Maybe we need a poll

Prius:
1. No
2. No!
3. All of the above.
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"Prius haters"

How about this poll:

Prius:
1. Kark
2. Just not my cup of tea
3. Yes please

A little balanced. I predict one vote in #3 :p
 
xrapidx said:
If you're lucky. :p
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I can always count on me :D

Oh well, I guess I proved my point (or at least the bit about there being a lot of haters... dunno if I convinced anyone the Prius is a good car).

The real issue is that if people took this to heart, we wouldn't have to be worrying about driving "green" cars and saving fuel in the first place. Then I could actually be aspiring to a F430 rather than a Tesla Roadster.
 
I like this poll

Sound of a V8
Sound of a turbo
Eery silence
 
The fuel consumption and price of the Prius do not impress me.

For that price you can buy a Polo 1.9 TDI Sportline and still get the same fuel consumption.
If you're traveling long distances then it works out being even better than the Prius and that's not even taking performance, comfort and safety into account.

Polo 1.9 TDI Sportline :
Freeway : 4.3 L/100km
City : 6.8 L/100km
Combined : 5.2 L/100km

Prius (2008 model):
Freeway : 4.9 L/100km
City : 5.23 L/100km
Combined : 5.11 L/100km
 
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Paul_S said:
The fuel consumption and price of the Prius do not impress me.

For that price you can buy a Polo 1.9 TDI Sportline and still get the same fuel consumption.
If you're traveling long distances then it works out being even better than the Prius and that's not even taking performance, comfort and safety into account.

Polo 1.9 TDI Sportline :
Freeway : 4.3 L/100km
City : 6.8 L/100km
Combined : 5.2 L/100km

Prius (2008 model):
Freeway : 4.9 L/100km
City : 5.23 L/100km
Combined : 5.11 L/100km
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Yip and the 1,9 TDi Highline can even get 3l/100km
 
I'm not vehemently opposed to the Prius or anything. I agree with you that it comes down to personla choice and as a driver, I think I'd be more economical in an M3 than a previous. Like Clarkson said (and I posted earlier), it all comes down to driving style. I'd find the Prius underpowered and I'd keep pushing it. A more powerful car wouldn't feel so sluggish so I wouldn't drive it as hard. I used to drive a Corsa Lite Sport and I continually gunned the little car to get any sort of fun out of it. Now I drive an Opel Turbo Coupe and I hardly ever exceed 3000 RPM. Even so, I still have more fun with this car.
 
JK8 said:
Yip and the 1,9 TDi Highline can even get 3l/100km
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Link, please.

If you look at the results of the annual Total Economy Run you'll see that there's not a single car that has ever recorded below 4l/100km. The Citroen C2 has done 4.1l/100km. The cars in this competition are driven by professional economy drivers that know exactly how to eke every last bit of economy out of a car. And you're saying that a Polo can achieve 25% better fuel consumption than the best figure ever achieved on the Total? I don't think so.
 
Paul_S said:
The fuel consumption and price of the Prius do not impress me.

For that price you can buy a Polo 1.9 TDI Sportline and still get the same fuel consumption.
If you're traveling long distances then it works out being even better than the Prius and that's not even taking performance, comfort and safety into account.

Polo 1.9 TDI Sportline :
Freeway : 4.3 L/100km
City : 6.8 L/100km
Combined : 5.2 L/100km

Prius (2008 model):
Freeway : 4.9 L/100km
City : 5.23 L/100km
Combined : 5.11 L/100km
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A Prius is a much bigger, more well equipped, safer and more luxurious car than a Polo (and it's reflected in the price). The fact that it has better combined fuel consumption than a diesel Polo says a lot.
 
StrongTurd said:
Link, please.

If you look at the results of the annual Total Economy Run you'll see that there's not a single car that has ever recorded below 4l/100km. The Citroen C2 has done 4.1l/100km. The cars in this competition are driven by professional economy drivers that know exactly how to eke every last bit of economy out of a car. And you're saying that a Polo can achieve 25% better fuel consumption than the best figure ever achieved on the Total? I don't think so.
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No links unfortunately, but most drivers claim those results, I dont care much for diesels anyway.
 
JK8 said:

No links unfortunately, but most drivers claim those results, I dont care much for diesels anyway.
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Alas, there's a world of difference between what people claim and what is reality. Suffice to say that I call BS on that claim.
 
StrongTurd said:
Alas, there's a world of difference between what people claim and what is reality. Suffice to say that I call BS on that claim.
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And yet you believe a 1,9TDi 96kw can get 4.3l/100km...
 
I recon we all agree the Prius sucks on this bright sunny morning?

/END TROLL
 
JK8 said:
And yet you believe a 1,9TDi 96kw can get 4.3l/100km...
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Sorry, but I don't get your point. 4.3l/100km is 43% worse than 3l/100km. Sure it can achieve the former (given a very experienced economy driver). It is the latter figure (3l/100km) that I'm saying is BS. There's no contradiction in my statement.
 
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