Racism: How to fix it together

[OrbitalDawn]

http://www.financialmail.co.za/coverstory/2016/01/21/racism-how-to-fix-it-together

Not going to post any bits, as it has to be read in its totality.

Thoughts?

 

[envo]

tl;dr

My thoughts is just to stop being a grudge-holding-douche and stop teaching your children hate.

I saw the perfect thing the other day in my complex, 4 kids playing, 1 indian, 2 black and 1 white kid. All holding hands and skipping and laughing.

Racism is taught by those who can't let their hatred of what happened in the past go. Passed onto the kids and the vicious cycle continues.

As with many things, responsible parenting is what is key to solving SO many problems

 

[Flanders]

Her easy insult comes from deep down. She wouldn’t even know where or how it got there. But it is in her culture. And it is hard-wired into the culture of every South African of Western European descent.

Stopped right there.

1.) Acknowledge that racism affects and is perpetrated by all races.

 

[Ancalagon]

but I am certain that the broad generalisation can be made that black South Africans are not racist.

Stopped reading.

Other problems I could point out, but an opinion like that is simply and factually wrong.

EDIT: Oh it gets better. Written by a white guy called Peter Bruce. Had a black person said that black South Africans are not racist, I would have at least understood where he was coming from, even if I disagreed with it.

But this is just pure unadulterated white guilt.

EDIT 2: In any case, the recommendations of the article are completely at odds with the primary discussion of the article. He spends a few pages talking about the history of slavery and violence in Africa, and how it affected black people, but then his recommendations are primarily economic. He doesn't explain how and why he thinks his economic improvements will reduce racism.

 

[Mephisto_Helix]

Previous 2 posts pointed out and said it best ...... Not going to fix anything with bullshyte.

 

[stricken]

Stopped right there.

1.) Acknowledge that racism affects and is perpetrated by all races.

Yes exactly. There is this notion that racism is only white -> black. But with BEE and various other public institutional processes clearly being racist, how can we start to have a talk about racism when it is legislated?

 

[The_MAC]

tl;dr

My thoughts is just to stop being a grudge-holding-douche and stop teaching your children hate.

I saw the perfect thing the other day in my complex, 4 kids playing, 1 indian, 2 black and 1 white kid. All holding hands and skipping and laughing.

Racism is taught by those who can't let their hatred of what happened in the past go. Passed onto the kids and the vicious cycle continues.

As with many things, responsible parenting is what is key to solving SO many problems

 

[giovannidc]

I believe a step in the right direction for South Africa would be to address policies like BEE and shift the focus from black empowerment to empowering the poor of all races. By doing so you are eliminating government policies that focus on giving privilege to a particular race and eliminating resentment from the non qualifying races.

 

[grok]

Part of the problem is that we are led by not so much a visionary as a distracted and self-obsessed president who cannot unite us because his life has led him elsewhere.

Maybe this is exactly why people's emotions are boiling over and racist remarks come out?

Plus, I've seen predictions for years that foretold of the ANC's coming need to scratch the apartheid scab to keep the people voting emotionally, they have nothing but the racism card left.

 

[The_MAC]

Maybe this is exactly why people's emotions are boiling over and racist remarks come out?

Plus, I've seen predictions for years that foretold of the ANC's coming need to scratch the apartheid scab to keep the people voting emotionally, they have nothing but the racism card left.

I think its exactly that.

But what makes it worse, is that when there is a real case of racism or discrimination, people roll their eyes - its the crying wolf syndrome

 

[Durandal]

Maybe this is exactly why people's emotions are boiling over and racist remarks come out?

Plus, I've seen predictions for years that foretold of the ANC's coming need to scratch the apartheid scab to keep the people voting emotionally, they have nothing but the racism card left.

Agreed. And as un-PC as it is to say this, I guess, I think a a lot of us white folk have been getting increasingly sick and tired of being blamed for everything that goes wrong in the country, when it's blatantly obvious that it's the fault of the government and the voters who keep them in power.

They're quick to jump on the Blame Apartheid Wagon (read: Blame the Whities), but somehow that's never racist.

 

[Durandal]

And I'm still trying to work out wtf he means here:

Sure, blacks are angry about the racism — be it soft or hard, subtle or Sparrow-esque — they face daily. But that anger, however chillingly expressed on occasion, cannot itself be racist. Affirmative action cannot possibly be, as it is often called, racism in reverse. When the British bombed German cities in retaliation for the German raids on London, did that make Churchill a Nazi?

 

[falcon786]

tl;dr

My thoughts is just to stop being a grudge-holding-douche and stop teaching your children hate.

I saw the perfect thing the other day in my complex, 4 kids playing, 1 indian, 2 black and 1 white kid. All holding hands and skipping and laughing.

Racism is taught by those who can't let their hatred of what happened in the past go. Passed onto the kids and the vicious cycle continues.

As with many things, responsible parenting is what is key to solving SO many problems

It's not always easy,I'm not racist and me and my wife are careful to never say anything even racist "sounding" around our kids,yet the other day my 5 year old tells me "Dad don't drive in this street as there's lots of blacks here".I was like wtf.:wtfut a stop to it right then and there made it clear there is nothing wrong with blacks and they are just ordinary people,nothing to be afraid of.

Seeing as me and my wife don't have anything against blacks it obviously came from an outside source so yeah you have to actively discourage it actually because many people that your kids come into contact with are racist,even in school other kids are still racist(probably because of their parents), and kids pick this up easily.

 

[saturnz]

I believe a step in the right direction for South Africa would be to address policies like BEE and shift the focus from black empowerment to empowering the poor of all races. By doing so you are eliminating government policies that focus on giving privilege to a particular race and eliminating resentment from the non qualifying races.

thats why they moved from BEE to BBBEE, you do understand the difference?

 

[OrbitalDawn]

And I'm still trying to work out wtf he means here:

Sure, blacks are angry about the racism — be it soft or hard, subtle or Sparrow-esque — they face daily. But that anger, however chillingly expressed on occasion, cannot itself be racist. Affirmative action cannot possibly be, as it is often called, racism in reverse. When the British bombed German cities in retaliation for the German raids on London, did that make Churchill a Nazi?

He's saying acting in retaliation to something doesn't make you the same thing that you're retaliating against.

 

[Durandal]

He's saying acting in retaliation to something doesn't make you the same thing that you're retaliating against.

Ah, okay, tks. I was scratching my head at that.

 

[OrbitalDawn]

Stopped reading.

Other problems I could point out, but an opinion like that is simply and factually wrong.

EDIT: Oh it gets better. Written by a white guy called Peter Bruce. Had a black person said that black South Africans are not racist, I would have at least understood where he was coming from, even if I disagreed with it.

But this is just pure unadulterated white guilt.

EDIT 2: In any case, the recommendations of the article are completely at odds with the primary discussion of the article. He spends a few pages talking about the history of slavery and violence in Africa, and how it affected black people, but then his recommendations are primarily economic. He doesn't explain how and why he thinks his economic improvements will reduce racism.

I think he segues into that here:

We have first to properly identify our problems. If we do not we will apply the wrong “solutions”. Is poverty a bigger problem than inequality? Each invites a specific remedy. Is racist speech the same thing as hate speech? No. Europeans and Africans alike are equally capable of hate speech. Is enmity between black tribes not a form of black racism? No, it is ethnic rivalry, like the rivalry between Kosovans and Serbs.

The only way two sides get over a bad past is to fix their future together. The best way to express that in SA has to lie, somehow, in the economy and in the way we create and distribute wealth. A potent and inclusive SA economy needs to have three main characteristics:

• It would need to make profits that the state can tax and use to pay for services to the poor;

• It would need to create much higher levels of formal employment; and

• Barriers of entry into the economy would need to be low, to encourage competition.

What has to go is the capitalist model we employ now. It is, in principle, not that much changed from the capitalism that drove slavery or from the Victorian model that people like Cecil John Rhodes brought with them to SA.

So we can use economic progress as a catalyst to help mend a fractured society. So much of our racial past, and the resulting divisions, were laid into the economic foundations of the country. Therefore the solution, broadly speaking, has to have a large economic element.

That's how I understood his position.

I tend to agree with him in that sense. Doesn't it also feel to you like our racial issues became exacerbated the more our economy dove? People look for scapegoats, someone to blame for their worsening economic situation. You see it everywhere in the world.

 

[saturnz]

I tend to agree with him in that sense. Doesn't it also feel to you like our racial issues became exacerbated the more our economy dove? People look for scapegoats, someone to blame for their worsening economic situation. You see it everywhere in the world.

thats what happens in all economies, theres an old adage that growth solves all problems

 

[Vrotappel]

Bunch of crud in there (with some truths), with all due respect.

 

[Durandal]

I tend to agree with him in that sense. Doesn't it also feel to you like our racial issues became exacerbated the more our economy dove? People look for scapegoats, someone to blame for their worsening economic situation. You see it everywhere in the world.

Agreed - the nose-diving economy has placed huge strain on everyone, across all race groups, so there's huge frustration, blame games and the anger is just boiling out. We desperately need to kick start the economy, but instead I hear of yet another big strike looming, which just makes it worse for all of us.