Regret leaving previous job

[Nerfherder]

My first job was physically digging trenches for optic fiber cables. I worked my way up there and eventually managed a few people. Still miss that job. Did my work, got pay and if I did a bit extra I could often score myself a day off on a Friday.

^^ The lords work

 

[Toxxyc]

LOL. I started out digging the trenches, then started working on laying the ducts, doing the DITs the works. Later on that turned into actually floating the fiber, and eventually doing the physical splicing of the cables in the joints and everything. I left the industry after managing the planning teams for a while. Pay was just not the best.

 

[Mr Justice]

same here, unfortunately, due to many factors, those companies hardly exist these days, that keep staff forever.
most companies, as @Thugscub mentioned just want to make a buck, and dont care who they step on top of to get there.

sad reality of the situation, seen it firsthand, more than I ever want to admit.

Agreed, there seems to be an incentive to keep a rotation of new staff then they don't have to pay salary increases and can change conditions as they want. Experienced this first hand.

 

[cguy]

Lots of assumptions there, which I don't agree with.

I'll use myself as an example.

My father died when I was 15, and my mother's mental illness made me not trust her for guidance. From the age of 15 onwards, I decided what to do and why to do it. One of the things that I did not do was find a role model that I could trust for advice. That would have given me stability and a balanced perspective. But, it didn't even occur to me.

Lack of a role model, plus not even realising why a role model would be a good idea, plus emotional problems caused by my traumatic childhood, made my career unstable. It's inevitable, when you think about it. It took me years to realise this.

Anyway, eventually I grew up and became a bit more stable, but by then, I had several <2 year jobs and some <3 year jobs on my CV.

In some cases, I wasn't a great employee, but in some cases, I was an amazing employee. But I lacked the insight to become a consistently amazing employee. That takes some doing, and I'm learning how to do it now.

Do I regret the instability of my early career? Of course! I made loads of mistakes. I quit my first job after 6 months remember. I remember my bosses telling me it was a stupid idea. They were right, but I was too stubborn to listen. I can't change the past though, I can only learn from it.

So, I think if you were to evaluate someone else's career history, I'd probably place a bias on the more recent work. If you're 22, even if you come from a stable household (unlike me), with the greatest respect, you just have no idea what you want or how to get it. For a lot of people, this applies if you're under 30 I'd say.

Another anecdote - one of our best employees, who I won't name because you might poach him, is a young guy who was fired from his previous job. But now that he is working for us, he is on his way to success. Why the change? I don't know. But I know he has got what it takes to be successful as a software engineer.

It sounds like for the most part you're actually agreeing with me. You're saying that when you were job hopping, you weren't a great employee, certainly not consistently so.

As for the history vs. the present, every resume tells a story. If someone has one longer stint in their recent history, it shows that under the right conditions they can be a good hire, or that they've had a change of attitude/professional-maturity, or that they were unlucky enough to choose a string of toxic companies, etc. all of which is a big positive. The issue is more with people who's entire career thus far is spent jumping around. Eventually staying longer term at a company is exactly how one distances oneself from the "job hopper" label.

Another possible concern, although we don't see this too often, is when someone spends a long time at some company, then moves, and apparently can't adapt - you'll see 10+ years at a company, followed by several short stints. This is also a red flag.

As for hiring people who were fired: Firing doesn't necessarily mean that someone was a bad employee - the issue could come down to a bad cultural fit, a lack of motivation from the company (who hasn't decided to take it easy after a year or two of "You did well, but times are tough. Do you like my new Tesla?" annual reviews?), etc. The thing to remember, is that they are competing with people who weren't fired, so they would have to perform significantly better in the interviews in order to compete.

 

[shadow_man]

I'd definitely be classified as a job hopper by most in this thread:

- 9 jobs since 2008.
- only one job over 3 years --> the rest under 2 years
- by moving i've gained a ton of skillset --> even worked for a FAANG
- became a Linux Architect
- and salary has just about quadrupled in the last 8 years

I would have never had had these opportunities sitting still, not by any stretch of the imagination.

I am however probably an outlier.

One size doesn't fit all...

 

[cguy]

I'd definitely be classified as a job hopper by most in this thread:

- 9 jobs since 2008.
- only one job over 3 years --> the rest under 2 years
- by moving i've gained a ton of skillset --> even worked for a FAANG
- became a Linux Architect
- and salary has just about quadrupled in the last 8 years

I would have never had had these opportunities sitting still, not by any stretch of the imagination.

I am however probably an outlier.

One size doesn't fit all...

Awesome. Did you go overseas to work at FAANG or work from SA?

 

[HavocXphere]

Another possible concern, although we don't see this too often, is when someone spends a long time at some company, then moves, and apparently can't adapt

Recent experience has taught me that a more dramatic switch can actually helpful on this e.g. recently made a jump where the baseline assumption is simultaneously:

1) Well of course he's competent he's from XYZ

2) Well of course he's not gonna know which side is up he's from XYZ and that's obviously different

Thank goodness because yeah it was different. I wonder if FAANG has a similar halo

 

[cguy]

Recent experience has taught me that a more dramatic switch can actually helpful on this e.g. recently made a jump where the baseline assumption is simultaneously:

1) Well of course he's competent he's from XYZ

2) Well of course he's not gonna know which side is up he's from XYZ and that's obviously different

Thank goodness because yeah it was different. I wonder if FAANG has a similar halo

I would say that the above assumptions are typically made. The infrastructure/system and type of projects in big tech/finance, is typically so involved that it takes anyone a very long time to ramp up (9 to 18 months is pretty typical). During this time, the learning rate is so high, it's almost like doing a type of masters-by-coursework in "that firm".

In terms of trying to predict whether or not the person is likely to adapt, we will consider qualifications: degree, masters or PhD show increasing levels of motivation. We also consider the career progression: Junior Dev, Dev, Senior Dev, Architect/Principal, etc.) - so it's always good to have these on the resume as opposed to just the last-held position. We will look at the complexity and diversity of the major projects listed (so saying something like: "C++ and Python, Agile, OOP" or some such for a 10 year stint is a bad idea). When interviewing, we will also be aware that we need to determine whether or not the person was active at the company or coasting, by asking them what they did day to day, the kind of work they did, challenges, successes, failures, lessons learned, etc. (Mostly, from a technical perspective - we're not interested in a self flagellating essay of how you failed as a thought-leader, we want to know why your tests with Deep Neural Nets failed, but Decision Trees worked, or whatever).

 

[shadow_man]

Awesome. Did you go overseas to work at FAANG or work from SA?

In ZA - but I could have easily transferred to another country, but family commitments tie me down here (for now).

Although as I'm getting older (34) I regret not making use of my British passport and flying the coop when I easily could have. House, multiple pets, older parentals are all factors that keep me here - and the longer I stay, the harder it's going to be to leave (in monetary / visa terms).

 

[cguy]

In ZA - but I could have easily transferred to another country, but family commitments tie me down here (for now).

Although as I'm getting older (34) I regret not making use of my British passport and flying the coop when I easily could have. House, multiple pets, older parentals are all factors that keep me here - and the longer I stay, the harder it's going to be to leave (in monetary / visa terms).

I can certainly understand the concerns. When I left I was few years younger, but also had similar issues. Kept the house, since the payments were relatively cheap in US $ (paid it off in 4 years after I left). Family moved into the house with the pets (we didn't know if the move was permanent so we didn't move them, and they adapted well - they also knew these family members very well). Certainly miss my folks, but speak to them several times a week, and their financial situation was such, that it made sense to plan to support them (which I now do). I also see them about twice per year under normal circumstances.

Not sure if this is something that affects you, but I've heard from people I know working in SA branches of multinationals, that they sometimes get a bit of an HR marketing line along the lines of "You're paid X% less than your US based colleagues because your have lower CoL where you live." - yeah, given the chance, I would rather have the company pay me extra to afford my R16m US home than my R4m home in SA. The two scenarios aren't equitable. Also, a constant CoL percentage deduction becomes progressively less fair as income goes up (i.e., someone earning 10x more is very unlikely to be living in a house that costs 10x, or spending 10x more on food).

 

[TEXTILE GUY]

In ZA - but I could have easily transferred to another country, but family commitments tie me down here (for now).

Although as I'm getting older (34) I regret not making use of my British passport and flying the coop when I easily could have. House, multiple pets, older parentals are all factors that keep me here - and the longer I stay, the harder it's going to be to leave (in monetary / visa terms).

In my case -
I am not a wealthy guy - I don't have millions - I am just Joe Average.
I own a house in SA still.

What I can say, is that leaving my previous job - yeah, I have days where I think I regret it. But then realise, I miss the good times, not the company I left or the shady owners. Resigning and going into the SA job market really showed me the effect of affirmative action - and that drove me out of SA - I add, I am in my 50s.

Coming over to the US .... its tough, REALLY tough.
I miss my kids, I miss my mates, I miss SA. Things are different here.
When I decided to move, I had dogs, cats, cars ....... all those things we gather as we live. Its not easy to pack up and move ....... and harder yet when you don't know whether its going to be for a year or forever.

You have to do it, to understand it, and expect that alot of people will throw some negative jibe at you - but you learn to ignore these p0ephols.

But then, I look at what I have ..... I earn US$, and while the cost of living is more expensive in the US, the quality of life is much better. I leave for work, knowing my wife is safe. I want for nothing, other than to see my mates and kids, but you make new friends. Interesting friends.

During the COVID times in SA, I let people stay for free in the house, I paid the rates. I bailed out a few other families. The savings I should have made in 2020 with my dollars I gave away in aid to Saffers. It made me happy to help. If I hadn't resigned, moved here ....... these folks would have been harder off.

Living with regrets ......... hey life is tough enough, let that baggage go and live life. You only get to take that ride once in a lifetime.

I personally wish the best for anyone who decides to make a life change for the right reason.

 

[shadow_man]

Not sure if this is something that affects you, but I've heard from people I know working in SA branches of multinationals, that they sometimes get a bit of an HR marketing line along the lines of "You're paid X% less than your US based colleagues because your have lower CoL where you live." - yeah, given the chance, I would rather have the company pay me extra to afford my R16m US home than my R4m home in SA. The two scenarios aren't equitable. Also, a constant CoL percentage deduction becomes progressively less fair as income goes up (i.e., someone earning 10x more is very unlikely to be living in a house that costs 10x, or spending 10x more on food).

Oh I've heard this gag a lot! Luckily (or unluckily) i'm not THAT skilled and my US counterparts were probably only on double or at best case probably triple what I was. That being said they didn't have to pay for their own medical, private security, borehole, solar etc etc that I'd have to here - so yeah disposable income gap is huge!

 

[shadow_man]

In my case -
I am not a wealthy guy - I don't have millions - I am just Joe Average.
I own a house in SA still.

What I can say, is that leaving my previous job - yeah, I have days where I think I regret it. But then realise, I miss the good times, not the company I left or the shady owners. Resigning and going into the SA job market really showed me the effect of affirmative action - and that drove me out of SA - I add, I am in my 50s.

Coming over to the US .... its tough, REALLY tough.
I miss my kids, I miss my mates, I miss SA. Things are different here.
When I decided to move, I had dogs, cats, cars ....... all those things we gather as we live. Its not easy to pack up and move ....... and harder yet when you don't know whether its going to be for a year or forever.

You have to do it, to understand it, and expect that alot of people will throw some negative jibe at you - but you learn to ignore these p0ephols.

But then, I look at what I have ..... I earn US$, and while the cost of living is more expensive in the US, the quality of life is much better. I leave for work, knowing my wife is safe. I want for nothing, other than to see my mates and kids, but you make new friends. Interesting friends.

During the COVID times in SA, I let people stay for free in the house, I paid the rates. I bailed out a few other families. The savings I should have made in 2020 with my dollars I gave away in aid to Saffers. It made me happy to help. If I hadn't resigned, moved here ....... these folks would have been harder off.

Living with regrets ......... hey life is tough enough, let that baggage go and live life. You only get to take that ride once in a lifetime.

I personally wish the best for anyone who decides to make a life change for the right reason.

That's very good of you and a great way to look at things.

My girlfriend is just about wrapping up her PhD - so perhaps now's a good time to look at doing a post grad in a foreign country (and her dragging me along) or moving and gaining foreign employment. I don't think either of us quite know what her income potential would be, given that she's essentially in marine conservation (stats, legal etc - so think R and a lot of metrics).

Me - I could easily find work, BUT I don't have a degree - which makes the Visa process rather interesting...

 

[cguy]

That's very good of you and a great way to look at things.

My girlfriend is just about wrapping up her PhD - so perhaps now's a good time to look at doing a post grad in a foreign country (and her dragging me along) or moving and gaining foreign employment. I don't think either of us quite know what her income potential would be, given that she's essentially in marine conservation (stats, legal etc - so think R and a lot of metrics).

Me - I could easily find work, BUT I don't have a degree - which makes the Visa process rather interesting...

If you can do an intracompany transfer, a degree is far less important. Otherwise, in many countries if a spouse has a work visa, the other can get work - so may be time to propose...

BTW, if your GF is really good with stats and R, quantitative finance has enormous income potential.

 

[shadow_man]

If you can do an intracompany transfer, a degree is far less important. Otherwise, in many countries if a spouse has a work visa, the other can get work - so may be time to propose...

BTW, if your GF is really good with stats and R, quantitative finance has enormous income potential.

Haha - I'm not sure how to define what good as as I don't do / use R - but she's done well enough to do all the stats for said PhD / draw heat maps / teach her supervisors a thing or two.

I think she's too keen on saving the planet, to actually pull a corporate job

 

[AtoZ]

The job? No. Some of the fantastic people you meet and get to know? Yes.

 

[Foxhound5366]

If you left on amicable terms, go back to your previous employer and ask for your job back.

I would much rather hire an ex employee, than a new one who I will have to spend months training.

Yeah I've done this. Left a job, immediately realised I made a bad mistake, and returned to my old job (offered a more senior position) after only three months. That was a hard decision, but sometimes the only way to fix a mistake is to go back.

 

[Genisys]

Yeah I've done this. Left a job, immediately realised I made a bad mistake, and returned to my old job (offered a more senior position) after only three months. That was a hard decision, but sometimes the only way to fix a mistake is to go back.

And yet they were not willing to pull the same tricks to keep you in the first place, think about that for a few minutes.

 

[Foxhound5366]

And yet they were not willing to pull the same tricks to keep you in the first place, think about that for a few minutes.

I've never made it seem like an option to be kept. Whenever I announce my resignation, it's only after I've already signed a contract at my new place. I don't believe in bidding wars.

I'm not at that place, in case you're wondering. Left them for the second time four jobs back