So it starts in Ventersdorp

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klasvaakie

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http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Farm-attacked-in-Ventersdorp-20100418

Pretoria - A 50-year-old man is in a serious condition after he was allegedly attacked on his farm on Sunday morning near Ventersdorp.

ER24's Emergency Contact Centre received an emergency call shortly after 05:00 for a farmer that sustained multiple injuries.

When paramedics arrived on the farm they found the elderly man with multiple stab wounds to his leg and a serious fracture of his upper leg.

He was also treated for multiple other bruises.

The man apparently heard a noise outside his house when his dogs started barking. When he tried to investigate, a group of unknown suspects overpowered him and allegedly assaulted him.

According to bystanders on the scene the man's wife and his two daughters hid away in a nearby room. Paramedics assessed both of them and found that they were only in shock and sustained no visible injuries.

The man was airlifted by the ER24 Discovery Medicopter in a serious but stable condition to a Johannesburg Hospital for further medical management.

Police are investigating.
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An update

Amanda Roestoff, Beeld
Johannesburg - A farmer from Syferbult outside Ventersdorp in the North-West was shot in the leg on Sunday morning and repeatedly stabbed with a knife during a farm attack.

It happened just 16 days after Eugene Terre'Blanche, leader of the AWB, was murdered on his farm in the district.

Karel Griessel, 49, who has been farming outside Ventersdorp on the Potchefstroom road for the past 20 years, was shot at his kitchen door at about 05:00.

He opened the door to throw a bone to one of his dogs when three men overpowered him and one shot him in the leg.

His two daughters, aged 12 and 17 respectively, hid in the house. The older of the two phoned her mom, who stays on a farm in the area, on her cellphone.

Carina Griessel, 46, who recently divorced Karel, says the assault on her ex is "like any attack or murder...It doesn't go down well".

She told Beeld that her eldest daughter had phoned her shortly before 05:00, and said: "Mom, you have to come quickly... There are strangers on the farm."

The mother of three (she also has a 19-year-old son) took her revolver and, along with her foreman and a former police officer, sped to Griessel's farm while calling other farmers in the area.

All armed

The attackers were presumably hiding in the garden when they arrived. One of the men who went with her saw two of the attackers run past the kitchen window. He fired two shots at the attackers, who ran away.

When another farmer from the area showed up, the third attacker fled, Lesego Metsi, police spokesperson, told Sapa.

Carina found her ex-husband on the kitchen floor. The impact of the first shot presumably broke his leg, she says. He also sustained head injuries after being repeatedly beaten over the head.

She says the attackers, who all had handguns and one a knife as well, charged and overpowered Griessel when he opened the door.

"They wanted money and weapons. He didn't have either on him. When they tried to tie him up, he fought back.”

In the ensuing struggle, Griessel was assaulted and, according to paramedics, stabbed several times with a knife.

"We put towels under his head and stayed with him for support until the paramedics arrived. He had severe pain in his leg."

Evacuated by helicopter

Werner Vermaak, spokesperson for ER24, says the patient was treated for a broken leg and several stab wounds in his leg.

He was taken by helicopter to the Netcare Milpark hospital in Johannesburg, where he's in a serious but stable condition.

Erin Smylie, hospital spokesperson, was unable to comment on Griessel's condition on Sunday night. "I haven't received any official reports from the doctors. The hospital will decide tomorrow (on Monday) whether they will release a statement."

Visitors from the area were clearly upset and emotional about the attack.

"They want our land! They want to chase us out of the country. (Julius) Malema (leader of the ANC Youth League) is being used to stir up the youth. We (the farmers) are not going to sit still..." one farmer, who wanted to remain anonymous, told Beeld.

There have been no arrests in connection with the incident.
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So this is how it starts.
 
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Ja, just hang on. I need my Sunday afternoon nap before we start. :)
 
Could be right wing elements wanting to make it look like a farm murder attempt in their so called "backyard" but not kill him? Look at his injuries, all in the leg, which is not as serious as stabbing in the chest.

If you are going to stab someone, dont you normally aim for the chest/abdomen in a fight/scuffle?
 
Gory51 said:
Could be right wing elements wanting to make it look like a farm murder attempt in their so called "backyard" but not kill him? Look at his injuries, all in the leg, which is not as serious as stabbing in the chest.

If you are going to stab someone, dont you normally aim for the chest/abdomen in a fight/scuffle?
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Not if you know what you are doing. You go for the arteries in the neck or the legs...arms are harder to get at because the person you are attacking moves them around a lot. Legs are mostly stationary though...so you go for the legs...deep slices in the thigh should get you an artery.
 
But where do you hear of thugs going for arteries? Skilled assassins yes....but a farm attack? It just sounds weird that's all. There was a group of them. So they held him down (overpowered him), and then decided to go for a some careful precision cuts to his arteries in his legs to try kill him by letting him bleed out and still being able to call for help? I don't think so.


If held down by a group, the quickest way to kill the guy is just stab him in the heart or brain. They never did this which is why I asked the question in my first post. Something just doesn't add up.
 
Gory51 said:
But where do you hear of thugs going for arteries? Skilled assassins yes....but a farm attack? It just sounds weird that's all. There was a group of them. So they held him down (overpowered him), and then decided to go for a some careful precision cuts to his arteries in his legs to try kill him by letting him bleed out and still being able to call for help? I don't think so.


If held down by a group, the quickest way to kill the guy is just stab him in the heart or brain. They never did this which is why I asked the question in my first post. Something just doesn't add up.
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Actually, the heart or the brain can be tricky. You see, the ribs are very supple bones...so they bend and most of the time the knife gets stuck in the ribs without ever reaching the heart. So you have to go in underneath the ribs, which takes even more precision that some random slashes up and down the thigh. The brain...the skull is rather hard and it takes a lot of force to break through it and then you have the added annoyance of the blade getting stuck there. Sorry, I work with criminals every day. Hardened criminals will go for your softer areas like your stomach or liver.

Anyhow, I just said IF they knew what they were doing the legs are a good place. But I that they knew what they were doing :P...but was just saying ;)
 
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Gory51 said:
But where do you hear of thugs going for arteries? Skilled assassins yes....but a farm attack? It just sounds weird that's all. There was a group of them. So they held him down (overpowered him), and then decided to go for a some careful precision cuts to his arteries in his legs to try kill him by letting him bleed out and still being able to call for help? I don't think so.


If held down by a group, the quickest way to kill the guy is just stab him in the heart or brain. They never did this which is why I asked the question in my first post. Something just doesn't add up.
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He could have been on the ground kicking at them. That would explain stab wounds to the legs.
 
I see the sense in the points raised, but I still think this just sounds a little strange, considering all the current drama with Malema's outbursts and ET's death. And its in Ventersdorp, its on a farm, the guy was NOT killed but overpowered by a group of attackers who only injured his legs.

The potential is there for this to be a plot to make it look like a farm attack, in order to justify some retaliation. Its not necessarily what happened, just that it could be a situation like this. ;)
 
He survived, but he's probably lucky to be alive and it will probably take him at least 6 months to recover, and even then he might never walk normally again. Lets not forget, they didnt just skin his knee, they stabbed him multiple times. Even someone young and healthy would struggle to survive that, or recover from it. Just because he survived doesnt mean it was a half hearted attempt, it means he was lucky.

This what we get from the ANC, and Malema, spouting off. I'm just glad that he survived and that his wife and daughters were not raped, unlike that other terrible case.
 
Gory51 said:
I see the sense in the points raised, but I still think this just sounds a little strange, considering all the current drama with Malema's outbursts and ET's death. And its in Ventersdorp, its on a farm, the guy was NOT killed but overpowered by a group of attackers who only injured his legs.

The potential is there for this to be a plot to make it look like a farm attack, in order to justify some retaliation. Its not necessarily what happened, just that it could be a situation like this. ;)
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A "fracture" of the upper leg is definitely something that can kill you. It also takes a LOT of force to break your femur(which I assume is what they are referring to).
 
Thanks for the News24 link, I prefer it over the IOL links since the News24 articles make so much more sense
 
Gory51 said:
The potential is there for this to be a plot to make it look like a farm attack, in order to justify some retaliation. Its not necessarily what happened, just that it could be a situation like this. ;)
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Smoking some good stuff there ?

There are more than enough farm attacks, nobody needs to fake them, especially not with serious injuries !
 
Jola said:
Smoking some good stuff there ?

There are more than enough farm attacks, nobody needs to fake them, especially not with serious injuries !
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You can leave the insults behind, I merely asked a question and stated a possibility.

I never said the guy faked his attack at all.

Thank you for reminding me why its almost pointless asking questions here....
 
Gory51 said:
You can leave the insults behind, I merely asked a question and stated a possibility.

I never said the guy faked his attack at all.
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Don't worry, your purpose was abundantly clear: To sow doubt where there was none, with no evidence at all. Trying to "hide behind" the fact that you posed it as a question is a bit puerile, someone with more balls would stand behind his/her agenda, but hey, I don't really expect better.

It's an age-old tactic, and a transparent one at that. Here's an example: If I ask "Could it be that Gory51 molests his children?", and I put it forth as if it were a genuine point, I create a debate out of thin air, complete with sides, each supposedly worthy of consideration.

Cf. http://www.fudco.com/chip/deconstr.html ... "What's more, the form makes it appear as if there is ongoing debate, further legitimizing the reader's entertainment of the question."
 
Gory51 said:
Could be right wing elements wanting to make it look like a farm murder attempt in their so called "backyard" but not kill him? Look at his injuries, all in the leg, which is not as serious as stabbing in the chest.

If you are going to stab someone, dont you normally aim for the chest/abdomen in a fight/scuffle?
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We do not atack or kill our own.
 
Tick said:
Don't worry, your purpose was abundantly clear: To sow doubt where there was none, with no evidence at all. Trying to "hide behind" the fact that you posed it as a question is a bit puerile, someone with more balls would stand behind his/her agenda, but hey, I don't really expect better.

It's an age-old tactic, and a transparent one at that. Here's an example: If I ask "Could it be that Gory51 molests his children?", and I put it forth as if it were a genuine point, I create a debate out of thin air, complete with sides, each supposedly worthy of consideration.

Cf. http://www.fudco.com/chip/deconstr.html ... "What's more, the form makes it appear as if there is ongoing debate, further legitimizing the reader's entertainment of the question."
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Firstly, you have no idea what political stance I have, which side I may support or not support. So please dont try and state I have any agenda associated with a simple question I asked.

There are many farm murders that occur and I deplore every single one. In my mind, a farm murder attempt normally reuslts in a victim losing their life. I was wondering if it wasn't a little strange, that this 50 year old faced off against a group of men and was stabbed several times in the leg, but not killed.

I did not make anything up out of thin air. When we dont know all the answers to something it is only logical that we ask questions and pose different theories. It does not necessarily mean that any of the theories may be correct. Just because you think of a possibility does not mean you support it either, or the causes that may have been behind it.

I have not insuted you or personally attacked you. I expect the same common courtesy.
 
Master Cain said:
We do not atack or kill our own.
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Can I ask that you please clarify your definition of "our own"?

When I say our own I identify with fellow human beings.
Some peopel identify only with their specific race
Others further define that as people belonging to similar religions, cults, sects, or political alignments.

If you can define that term you used, I am sure we could debate that statement.
 
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