Tesla in freefall

Sideshow Bob said:
Best time to buy. Viva Elon Via.
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Buy?...... what is the biggest market for EVs?....liberal tree huggers and yuppies (now known as hipsters).....who is he alienating with his politics? Liberals.....who else, European liberals, who else? Chinese buyers getting angry at Trump and his tarrifs..... Tesla is a meme brand, without the meme value it falls flat.

You can't cater to a segment of the population that won't ever buy your products on mass, especially when you incorporated the angle of climate change in your product advertising and that segment rejects the very premise.

Elon let his ego get in the way and deviated too far from the core of what he was selling. Biden doesn't invite him to a summit and all a sudden he goes to war on the Dems and liberals.....what a moegoe.
 
  1. Tesla has been for a long time way over priced, not a reflection of the true value of the company.
  2. EV sales is taking a hit world wide, looks like we over the hype.
  3. All Car makers are taking hit, the Chinees only looks good because they are not showing us the losses they are making.
  4. Elon is upsetting a big part of the Tesla traditional buyers base.
 
GrootVoet said:
  1. Tesla has been for a long time way over priced, not a reflection of the true value of the company.
  2. EV sales is taking a hit world wide, looks like we over the hype.
  3. All Car makers are taking hit, the Chinees only looks good because they are not showing us the losses they are making.
  4. Elon is upsetting a big part of the Tesla traditional buyers base.
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Regarding point 3. If you closely follow the Chinese EV business, you'll see how the CCP directive of only a few automakers being allowed by 2030 comes into perspective, right now there's far too many in the market even though last year many went belly up fairly suddenly. What is saving grace is that they do have many brands that sell on volume and are successful.....even newer entries like Xiaomi is seeing a lot of success. And given the Chinese ability to rapidly copy a successful concept, I'm sure many EV companies will pivot their product segmentation and offers to match.....making the market more enticing even though the Chinese economy is lagging generally.

Point 4 is Tesla's biggest issue. It obliterates their projected value and the market sentiments aren't really reflecting that yet. When it does, the selloff will have massive effect on the rest especially the tech sector.
 
GrootVoet said:
  1. Tesla has been for a long time way over priced, not a reflection of the true value of the company.
  2. EV sales is taking a hit world wide, looks like we over the hype.
  3. All Car makers are taking hit, the Chinees only looks good because they are not showing us the losses they are making.
  4. Elon is upsetting a big part of the Tesla traditional buyers base.
Click to expand...
this, but I still dont understand one thing,

EV's are hilariously simple things, strip away the self driving and cameras and fast charging and whatever flashy stuff,
its a Battery, motor and controller, thats it,

no gears, to break, no shafts to lubricate, no brakes to replace, no nothing, like camshafts and oil and brake fluid and coolant and everything else a ICE vehicle needs.

I think they need to go back to basics, and look at something like a Beetle, why did they sell so many? because it was simple,
combine that with the toughness of a Corolla, and you have a recipe for success

I think Tesla making the software propitiatory and difficult to work on, and the subterfuge with glued on bumpers did them worse then having said to people okay, were going to make the model T of EV's, simple reliable and anybody can afford and fix.

I think there is definitely a market for somebody to step in and say, okay, were going to build the Simplest Cheapest EV that anybody can maintain with basic tools and with some common automotive knowledge.

problem with that is the profits will be Zero, as you dont have cameras and LIDAR and AI and software running it,
 
Jet-Fighter7700 said:
this, but I still dont understand one thing,

EV's are hilariously simple things, strip away the self driving and cameras and fast charging and whatever flashy stuff,
its a Battery, motor and controller, thats it,

no gears, to break, no shafts to lubricate, no brakes to replace, no nothing, like camshafts and oil and brake fluid and coolant and everything else a ICE vehicle needs.

I think they need to go back to basics, and look at something like a Beetle, why did they sell so many? because it was simple,
combine that with the toughness of a Corolla, and you have a recipe for success

I think Tesla making the software propitiatory and difficult to work on, and the subterfuge with glued on bumpers did them worse then having said to people okay, were going to make the model T of EV's, simple reliable and anybody can afford and fix.

I think there is definitely a market for somebody to step in and say, okay, were going to build the Simplest Cheapest EV that anybody can maintain with basic tools and with some common automotive knowledge.

problem with that is the profits will be Zero, as you dont have cameras and LIDAR and AI and software running it,
Click to expand...
The problem with selling a simple low cost vehicle today is the market perception and tastes have moved on. The Chinese are the only ones willing to buy a cheap EV, the rest of the world has different tastes. Just look at Citroen's Ami, decent cheap and basic, just like the 2CV back in the day.....nobody bought it because it doesn't have the status symbol cache attached beyond quirkiness. In SA even if we could demolish the taxes, I don't think people would buy a R200k basic EV like we used to buy the Picanto and cheap Corsa's back in the day.
 
Actually, the EV market is propped up by tax credits and in turn leasing companies.
 
Slckrck said:
The problem with selling a simple low cost vehicle today is the market perception and tastes have moved on. The Chinese are the only ones willing to buy a cheap EV, the rest of the world has different tastes. Just look at Citroen's Ami, decent cheap and basic, just like the 2CV back in the day.....nobody bought it because it doesn't have the status symbol cache attached beyond quirkiness. In SA even if we could demolish the taxes, I don't think people would buy a R200k basic EV like we used to buy the Picanto and cheap Corsa's back in the day.
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fair enough point, peoples tastes need to be brought down to earth away from idiot U v's that are hilariously impractical
and EV's that are far too expensive, and commercial vehicles

honestly a whole bunch of Cheap EV scooters would be perfect for SA, unfortunately taxis bosses would run them over quite happily.

so maybe conversions of existing vehicles to EV would be a better idea?
 
Slckrck said:
Buy?...... what is the biggest market for EVs?....liberal tree huggers and yuppies (now known as hipsters).....who is he alienating with his politics? Liberals.....who else, European liberals, who else? Chinese buyers getting angry at Trump and his tarrifs..... Tesla is a meme brand, without the meme value it falls flat.

You can't cater to a segment of the population that won't ever buy your products on mass, especially when you incorporated the angle of climate change in your product advertising and that segment rejects the very premise.

Elon let his ego get in the way and deviated too far from the core of what he was selling. Biden doesn't invite him to a summit and all a sudden he goes to war on the Dems and liberals.....what a moegoe.
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No, you're wrong there. Tesla is a multi-faceted company with huge value in IP, tech and numerous divisions. It will bounce back for sure.
 
The Darkness said:
No, you're wrong there. Tesla is a multi-faceted company with huge value in IP, tech and numerous divisions. It will bounce back for sure.
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this, although hard to say what people eventually do when the expensive EV hype bubble bursts.
I keep pointing out a cheap and simple EV is a better idea, just like the ICE cars of Yore, before the Model T
 

UK entrepreneur Arron Banks, thinks Elon has over extended himself
 
liberal nose ring Karen's going off at Elon because they don't like that he supports Trump...
here is there mentality : "let's do all we can to drive the share price down, that'll teach him!"
ok so now the share price is down : "why is my pension fund not doing well, I've lost my investments???"

Amazon went from $90 to $16... then $180 to $80... up down up down... Do we care Bezos married a big boobie girl? no, Amazon is still a great company to invest in. Don't bet against Tesla, it is still a great company producing a great product.
I don't care that Bill Gates diddles with fake cow meat or fondles mosquitos, Microsoft is a seriously good company to invest in.
 
Wrath of Khan MD said:
liberal nose ring Karen's going off at Elon because they don't like that he supports Trump...
here is there mentality : "let's do all we can to drive the share price down, that'll teach him!"
ok so now the share price is down : "why is my pension fund not doing well, I've lost my investments???"

Amazon went from $90 to $16... then $180 to $80... up down up down... Do we care Bezos married a big boobie girl? no, Amazon is still a great company to invest in. Don't bet against Tesla, it is still a great company producing a great product.
I don't care that Bill Gates diddles with fake cow meat or fondles mosquitos, Microsoft is a seriously good company to invest in.
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Agreed. The savvy investor looks for intrinsic value - not hype and emotions. The value of this company is immense. That's not going away. I think this will last another month or two and then start climbing once the social justice warriors move on to the next thing.

Even guys like this below, who seemed intelligent, goes and offloads his Tesla so he can parade around like a sanctimonious saviour. All he did was give someone a beautiful machine for a bargain.

 
The perceived m
The Darkness said:
No, you're wrong there. Tesla is a multi-faceted company with huge value in IP, tech and numerous divisions. It will bounce back for sure.
Click to expand...
The perceived moat around it's IP has evaporated especially since the Chinese have rapidly caught and surpassed in deployed ADAS systems, data and applications.

The only possible saving grace might be Optimus and that seems too far off to justify the sky high evals. They are faced with enormous competition in that sector as well. Again the Chinese are investing heavily along with a myriad of other "western" robotics companies, so idk why there should be optimism about Tesla's potential beyond holders trying to gaslight and prop up the stock for suckers before they dump.
 
Since when do a company share price increase 100% without signing a significant contract or doing an acquisition of some sorts in 2 months?
17 Oct'24 share price was hovering around $220/share.
Peaked 17 Dec'24 @ $479.
Who in their right mind thought its sustainable?

Investors jumped on the Elon Musk hype train and now the share price is in "free fall", yeah right.
 
Slckrck said:
The problem with selling a simple low cost vehicle today is the market perception and tastes have moved on. The Chinese are the only ones willing to buy a cheap EV, the rest of the world has different tastes. Just look at Citroen's Ami, decent cheap and basic, just like the 2CV back in the day.....nobody bought it because it doesn't have the status symbol cache attached beyond quirkiness. In SA even if we could demolish the taxes, I don't think people would buy a R200k basic EV like we used to buy the Picanto and cheap Corsa's back in the day.
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It's difficult to test whether it's true that the rest of the world outside China does not want to buy cheap EVs.
The EU and USA tariffs on those Chinese cars are so high (e.g. 100% in the USA) that the cars are no longer cheap. My assumption is that without tariffs the demand would be high (which is why tariffs were imposed to protect EU & USA manufacturers.
 
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