Heh, wonder if sars knows
And all it cost was millions of jobs and an entire countries economy.-
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The Bitcoin Thread
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Heh, wonder if sars knows
And all it cost was millions of jobs and an entire countries economy.As L10Yn said, luno would have deducted fee, ie it would never have been processed through lunos system without a fee
Heh, wonder if sars knows
Parody account.
Vox Populi Vox Dei
High Tory
/tfw you were planning on a relaxing weekend goofing off but the charts were looking sweet so you end up trading all weekend anyway
The market that never sleeps...
Staying up until 2am to witness the launch of the first ever BitCoin futures ?
Kloofvreter
Honorary Master
The market that never sleeps...
Staying up until 2am to witness the launch of the first ever BitCoin futures ?
Nah. But for interest's sake, what is the risk here?
Vox Populi Vox Dei
High Tory
No-one is really sure how the market will react. First time that 'institutional money' will be entering BitCoin. Many people think the traders will short BitCoin (i.e. predict the price will fall) but unsure how that will affect the actual BitCoin market (remember in the futures market, you don't actually own BitCoin, you are simply betting on whether the price movements in the future).
Read more here: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...trading-brings-crypto-into-mainstream-finance
The market that never sleeps...
Staying up until 2am to witness the launch of the first ever BitCoin futures ?
Nope. Come what may I say. Regular rest is key when day trading.
/inb4 y’all little people got played and they long.
KleinBoontjie
Honorary Master
Like Binary options?
SaiyanZ
Executive Member
I'll stay up to see what happens with the futures launch. Mainly to see if there is a massive drop that I can take advantage of. I missed out on the drops yesterday and this morning but I'm ready now.
Sinbad
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No, options and futures are not the same thing. Similar, but not the same.
An option is an option to buy or sell at a certain time and rate.
A future is a commitment to buy or sell at a certain time.
I think its going to be huge for btc... I mean, in order to short the btc to drop it, they have to buy btc, and in order to have any real effect on any exchange, they'll have to buy billions of dollars worth... whats the point in dumping that sort of cash into btc just to force the price down to cash in on futures /shrug may are saying they'll short and drop the price, I'm seeing it going the other way
Sinbad
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LOL no you don't have to buy to short. You sell to short. And if someone decides to sell millions of $ worth of BTC in one go, you think the price isn't going to move dramatically? ESPECIALLY given the current sentiment/sheep mentality that is driving the bubble. The greed will vanish and the fear will kick in. At that point, don't be left long......
I meant(maybe I wasn't clear), they have to own btc to short, ie, they have enter the crypto market and buy btc to begin with
Yes, it will move down, but as I'm saying, they have to buy btc to start with, why spend millions/billions on btc, just to force the price down
Sinbad
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No you don't have to own BTC (or any other instrument) to short.
Wait, the futures are based on the price of btc, ie tracking prices of gdax/bitfinex etc
How will they affect the btc price if they don't own any?
Sinbad
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Do you know how short-selling works?
Quick example
Imagine you're an exchange or some other entity with a big chunk of BTC.
Hi Temujin, I would like to borrow 1 million BTC from you for 2 weeks. I will pay you 500 BTC for the privilege, and return your BTC on 28 December.
Temujin: OK sure.
/gets 1m BTC
/sells 1m BTC for $10000 each, speculating that the price will drop below $10000 in 2 weeks
Price tumbles to $9000
/buys 1m BTC for $9000 each
/returns 1m BTC to Temujin, plus the fee.
/Profits $1Bn less whatever 500BTC fee is worth
Ah, I see what your saying, if you borrow my btc you screw me
I was thinking you'd buy the btc yourself, ie, we'd have a huge growth in the market cap with all the cash coming in /shrugAh, I see what your saying, if you borrow my btc you screw me
That example is shorting actual bitcoin too. For futures you don’t even have to borrow the underlying asset at all. It’s 100% based on contracts, and settled in US dollars, meaning you don’t even have to deliver the actual asset at all at the end of the settlement period.
Sensorei
Executive Member
Ah, I see what your saying, if you borrow my btc you screw me
That example is a bit exaggerated for effect lol. CME's initial margin for investment will be 35% for BTC futures, so you need a considerable capital investment in the first place compared to most less volatile commodities that might only be 5-10% of the futures contract. CBOE's initial margin is 44%, so realistically it's more like "Hi Temujin, I would like to borrow 1000 BTC from you for 2 weeks (like an IOU). I will pay 440 BTC for the privilege, and return your BTC on 28 December".
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