The Brexit Thread

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OrbitalDawn said:
How do you see that happening? Davis and Barnier ruled out a soft brexit on day 1 of negotiations, already. Do you think when the UK capitulates and asks for a soft Brexit the EU would allow it?
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If the UK agree to the 4 freedoms and a Norway model the Tories can still say they've kept their pledge and taken the UK out of the EU, if the economy gets any worse they won't have much choice.

Tusk was making conciliatory noises today and the discussions have only just begun.


Donald Tusk echoes John Lennon to suggest UK could stay in EU

Donald Tusk used the first EU summit since the general election and the start of the Brexit negotiations to suggest that there is a chance the UK could still remain a member of the union, as leaders called on Theresa May to provide clarity on her minority government’s intentions.

Tusk, the president of the European council quoted the lyrics of John Lennon’s Imagine in expressing his hope that Britain could change its mind given recent events. “We can hear different predictions, coming from different people, about the possible outcome of these negotiations: hard Brexit, soft Brexit or no deal,” Tusk said, of what he described as a difficult process.

“Some of my British friends have even asked me whether Brexit could be reversed, and whether I could imagine an outcome where the UK stays part of the EU.

“I told them that in fact the European Union was built on dreams that seemed impossible to achieve. So, who knows? You may say I’m a dreamer, but I am not the only one.”
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https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/22/donald-tusk-john-lennon-eu-summit-uk-britain-brexit
 
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Brexit: EU citizens offered 'UK settled status' by PM May

EU citizens legally resident in the UK should have the same rights as British citizens after Brexit, the UK prime minister has told EU leaders.

"No-one will face a cliff edge," Theresa May said at a Brussels summit.

A new "UK settled status" will grant those who have spent five years in the UK equal rights on healthcare, education, benefits and pensions.

Guaranteeing EU citizens' rights is the top priority for the EU delegation negotiating Brexit.

Before Mrs May's offer, the EU proposed that EU citizens in the UK and the estimated 1.2 million Britons living in EU countries should continue enjoying the same rights, enforceable by the European Court of Justice (ECJ).
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As far as I'm concerned, the only really important issue in Brexit is that the UK recover its sovereign ability to make its own trade deals and treaties with others, unencumbered by the EU.
 
Arthur said:
As far as I'm concerned, the only really important issue in Brexit is that the UK recover its sovereign ability to make its own trade deals and treaties with others, unencumbered by the EU.
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Being in the EEA and accepting the 4 freedoms would allow just that. Would you be OK with that?
 
Arthur said:
As far as I'm concerned, the only really important issue in Brexit is that the UK recover its sovereign ability to make its own trade deals and treaties with others, unencumbered by the EU.
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I don't know if that's really possible in a world as interdependent as it is today
 
Chris_the_Brit said:
You're just being pedantic. Yes technically/in reality it will be 31 March 2019 but the vote is what started it.
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So why don't you just celebrate the day when Cameron announced the vote as independence day. That's actually what started it
 
zippy said:
I think the sticking point is going to be whether the European Courts enforce it or the UK Court
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Parliaments will ratify it you mean ?

Why would courts enforce it ?
 
f2wohf said:
Parliaments will ratify it you mean ?

Why would courts enforce it ?
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If there is a dispute, a court needs to settle the dispute. Will it be the European Court or the UK Court that hears the dispute and makes the ruling. There is a difference between the EU and UK negotiation teams on this.
 
EU still not understanding that people voted to take back control. UK voted to become a sovereign nation again and therefore we don't want any oversight from the ECJ. Now bugger off.

The sneaky EU buggers obviously want ECJ juridisction as the UK wouldn't be able to veto or ignore their rulings.

EU Refuses to Accept May's Offer on Migrant Rights

As Donald Tusk predictably criticises May’s generous offer on EU citizens’ rights this afternoon, it is once again clear that Remain ultras in Britain will side with the EU even when the UK government is being entirely reasonable. What did Remainers want? EU citizens’ rights to be guaranteed. And the government has indeed guaranteed their rights from the Article 50 trigger date, a completely fair and common sense proposal. Still the Guardian’s Brexit correspondent bizarrely calls it “disgraceful”.

Juncker wants the ECJ to continue to hold sway in Britain post-Brexit as part of any deal: “I can’t see the ECJ being excluded from the settlement in the future”. Any fair-minded pundit can see this is unacceptable – the UK voted to take back control of laws.

Sky News, ever-more partisan for a supposedly impartial broadcaster, asked May what her mandate was for leaving the single market and customs union. Seriously? This debate has been had time and time again – even the government’s biggest Remainers accept it is over. May quite rightly slapped down Faisal, telling him yet again that 80% of voters backed parties which support leaving the single market and customs union. There is a lot of important Brexit scrutiny that Remain supporters could be carrying out. Instead they are backing the other team and asking the same tired old questions…
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Chris_the_Brit said:
EU still not understanding that people voted to take back control. UK voted to become a sovereign nation again and therefore we don't want any oversight from the ECJ. Now bugger off.

The sneaky EU buggers obviously want ECJ juridisction as the UK wouldn't be able to veto or ignore their rulings.

EU Refuses to Accept May's Offer on Migrant Rights
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I'm wondering how you actually know people really voted to "take back control" or indeed what that means. I know a few very pissed off Brexit voters from our UK office who want the UK to remain in the single market - after all this was suggested by the leave campaign on numerous occasions, along with other tripe like 350M/week for NHS etc. 80% of the people at one of our UK suppliers voted for Brexit and if the UK leaves the customs union and there is no trade deal, they will be closing their doors.

The FT has done a good analysis of the various outcomes, and in every one barring single market access, the UK is going to be in a world of hurt:

https://www.ft.com/content/52fb4998-573f-11e7-9fed-c19e2700005f?mhq5j=e2
 
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