The Brexit Thread

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f2wohf said:
1. They don’t need to, they want to. Can you let them do as they deem fit?

2. And how is this not happening in Europe?

3. Because the US, Japan, China, Brazil are not fueled by debt? All major economies except petromonarchies are. How is the EU making any difference? Do you know how often E.U. members were devaluating their currencies before the euro? Was this preferable?
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I was replying to C4Cat's retarded post.

1) Of course. Emphasis on let them do as they deem fit. If they want to join the EU they can join, if they want to leave they should leave.
2) Immigration is one of the areas where it is not happening. And it is quite an important issue.
3) I thought the EU was meant to bring about an age of rationality and sound financial planning between countries? How that translated to giving Greece a cr@pton of cheap money to fund their welfare state is beyond me.

As for being preferable: yes. Individual currencies quarantine the problem.
 
konfab said:
I suppose the scarcity of resources doesn't play into your explanation of history. Besides you are quoting one side of the argument, most of these are in Europe BTW.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_treaties#1900%E2%80%931999

And you haven't answered the points I raised.
1) Why hasn't South Africa declared war on Botswana? We don't have a supranational government stopping us?
2) If a democratically elected government shouldn't prioritise its own citizens, then how much of out taxes should go to Lesotho?

There are a lot of commonalities in Europe besides the f__king EU. Language, Religion, ideas, history, trade. All of these things do not need a supranational government.

Ironically what actually keeps the peace between wildly different communities are strong and well defined borders.

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0095660

How does a country like Switzerland, which is not part of the EU fit into your thesis? Do you think Switzerland is going to declare war on everyone who is not part of Switzerland?
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1. You actually have SADC.
2. You do pay taxes that are used to fund SADC and to develop Lesotho or Botswana.
 
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konfab said:
And you haven't answered the points I raised.
1) Why hasn't South Africa declared war on Botswana? We don't have a supranational government stopping us?
2) If a democratically elected government shouldn't prioritise its own citizens, then how much of out taxes should go to Lesotho?
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1) In South Africa and Botswana we don't have the same fervent and reckless nationalism and patriotism in our country, as in the countries of Europe. If the borders here were based on tribal identity, as in Europe, I can pretty much guarantee ongoing conflict. In South Africa we already see conflict among various tribes and the only thing keeping this from all out war is once again the unity of being part of a greater whole, we're all part of South Africa. If that had to fall, we would all be fighting for our own tribe, or area, be it Zulu, Xhosa, Afrikaaner or what have you.
2)A democratically elected government should prioritise its own citizens, that's why Unions like the EU are so important to provide a space for unity under an umbrella where negotiation and compromise can take place so as to be advantageous to everyone.

konfab said:
Ironically what actually keeps the peace between wildly different communities are strong and well defined borders.

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0095660
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The EU has well defined borders. From your article:
Our analysis shows that peace does not depend on integrated coexistence, but rather on well defined topographical and political boundaries separating groups, allowing for partial autonomy within a single country.
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Partial autonomy within a single country, see? In the EU we have partial autonomy within a single union.

konfab said:
How does a country like Switzerland, which is not part of the EU fit into your thesis? Do you think Switzerland is going to declare war on everyone who is not part of Switzerland?
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No, but they will profit off everyone else's conflict of course! Switzerland has been involved in it's fair share of war too - before the EU existed, of course
 
f2wohf said:
1. You actually have SADC.
2. You do pay taxes that are used to fund SADC and to develop Lesotho or Botswana.
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SADC's budget: $79 million approx.

EU's budget: €145 bn approx.


Besides the scope of the SADC is far less ambitious than the EU.
 
konfab said:
SADC's budget: $79 million approx.

EU's budget: €145 bn approx.


Besides the scope of the SADC is far less ambitious than the EU.
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Compare SADC’s economy to the EU economy too? The GDP of the whole of Africa is smaller than the GDP of Italy alone...

Your statement was that there is no Supra national organization between SA and Botswana, and that SA does not pay taxes to Lesotho. Both statements are factually wrong.
 
C4Cat said:
1) In South Africa and Botswana we don't have the same fervent and reckless nationalism and patriotism in our country, as in the countries of Europe.
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:erm:
LOL, what rock have you been sitting under:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenophobia_in_South_Africa

Besides, right now you literally have people in government thinking it is a good idea to deprive some people of property because of their ethnic origin. Do you think that is not nationalism? The whole justification for EWC is because some people think they are more citizens than others.

The EU has problems, but you won't see the government of the UK stealing the property of everyone who is not a UK citizen? Or would you see an anti-British sentiment going around the governments of Europe with governments expropriating British property without compensation?

2)A democratically elected government should prioritise its own citizens, that's why Unions like the EU are so important to provide a space for unity under an umbrella where negotiation and compromise can take place so as to be advantageous to everyone.
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You don't need a supranational government to force this on everyone.

C4Cat said:
Partial autonomy within a single country, see? In the EU we have partial autonomy within a single union.
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The British Empire also had partial autonomy within a single union, look how well that turned out...

So did Imperial Germany after Unification.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unification_of_Germany#Political_and_administrative_unification
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Empire
 
f2wohf said:
Compare SADC’s economy to the EU economy too? The GDP of the whole of Africa is smaller than the GDP of Italy alone...

Your statement was that there is no Supra national organization between SA and Botswana, and that SA does not pay taxes to Lesotho. Both statements are factually wrong.
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MY statement was:

konfab said:
There are a lot of commonalities in Europe besides the f__king EU. Language, Religion, ideas, history, trade. All of these things do not need a supranational government.
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That is different from a union.
 
konfab said:
MY statement was:


That is different from a union.
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I was not referring to this part of your statement but to this one:

1) Why hasn't South Africa declared war on Botswana? We don't have a supranational government stopping us?
2) If a democratically elected government shouldn't prioritise its own citizens, then how much of out taxes should go to Lesotho?
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SADC prevents you from declaring war on Botswana:

Article 3 of the Mutual Defence Pact 2003 states that: “State Parties shall, in accordance with the principles of the Charter of the United Nations, settle any international dispute in which they may be involved, by peaceful means, in such a manner that regional and international peace, security and justice are enhanced.” Article 6 goes on to say that “An armed attack against a State Party shall be considered a threat to regional peace and security and such an attack shall be met with immediate collective action.”
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https://www.sadc.int/themes/politics-defence-security/defence/
 
BoJo the clown has left the circus.

Boris Johnson has resigned as foreign secretary, becoming the third minister in 24 hours to walk out of the government rather than back Theresa May’s plans for a soft Brexit.

The prime minister hammered out a compromise with her deeply divided cabinet in an all-day meeting at Chequers on Friday, but after consulting friends and allies since, Johnson decided he could not promote the deal.

A Downing Street spokesman said: “This afternoon, the prime minister accepted the resignation of Boris Johnson as foreign secretary. His replacement will be announced shortly. The prime minister thanks Boris for his work.”
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https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/09/boris-johnson-resigns-as-foreign-secretary-brexit
 
Well done Boris. Thought you might not resign but you can't polish a turd! Hopefully May gets the message and she resigns! She's a joke! No authority left. Busted goods!

Oh just saw this from Twitter. Will send shivers down Dave from Sunderland's spine ..

Dhq0NUuX4AEIId6.jpg
 
Chris_the_Brit said:
Oh just saw this from Twitter. Will send shivers down Dave from Sunderland's spine ..
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Unlike you who's an Australian pretending to be from Britain I'm not actually from (or in) Sunderland and you really shouldn't try and act on an in joke between people who have some respect for each other.

Interesting to see you are actually being a TK peeping tom though...
 
Chris_the_Brit said:
Well done Boris. Thought you might not resign but you can't polish a turd! Hopefully May gets the message and she resigns! She's a joke! No authority left. Busted goods!

Oh just saw this from Twitter. Will send shivers down Dave from Sunderland's spine ..

View attachment 535269
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At least he will now have time to stick to his work and lie in front of the bulldozers at Heathrow!
 
greg0205 said:
Ran a disgusting referendum campaign, was a bad joke Foreign Secretary and casually walks away from chaos he was instrumental in creating... History is not going to be kind to Boris.
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I would agree, he went frombeing a universally popular person to someone who's a bit of a joke now.
 
The inveterate anal wart Farage says he'll contest the Ukip presidency in 2019 if Article 50 is "suspended or delayed". I fear the "NHS 350 million pounds" card won't work as well a second time around, so I wonder what new lies he'll come up with?
 
The_Assimilator said:
The inveterate anal wart Farage says he'll contest the Ukip presidency in 2019 if Article 50 is "suspended or delayed". I fear the "NHS 350 million pounds" card won't work as well a second time around, so I wonder what new lies he'll come up with?
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As almost everything coming out of his mouth is a lie it shouldn't be too hard for him.
 
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