The Brexit Thread

[Spizz]

He will win tomorrow's vote though as Lib Dems and SNP are supporting a bill which only requires a simple majority. Good that's on 12 December...I believe most university students are back at home so hopefully less fraudulent/double voting .

Even after it was proven to be rubbish, you still think this is a thing. What a true Tory you really are. No need for facts, just lie at will to suit your agenda.

Anyway, seems like a fair few Tories are getting a tad upset with Johnson and his lies....

 

[ToxicBunny]

Yes I'm highly aware of the UK voting system works. I've known for a decade or more in fact. Double digit leads give a majority based on a uniform swing. I'm aware that the SNP will probably take out almost all Scottish Tories and some London Tories will have to be collateral damage but will be more than made up in more Brexity areas. Just research the Bishop Auckland seat - never gone Tory, old mining town... definitely going Tory in the next election.

So that's a hard no on having a clue then...

 

[noxibox]

Boris Johnson to try again for pre-Christmas election after Commons defeat

The PM is defeated - but will now present legislation to parliament in a fresh attempt to get MPs to back a 12 December election.

news.sky.com

From that article:

It's time for the voters to have a chance to pronounce on that deal

So why doesn't he let them pronounce on the deal instead of calling for an election? Perhaps because he thinks the majority are now against leaving the EU? He's hoping the UK's skewed electoral system will give him the votes in parliament to go ahead anyway.

 

[ToxicBunny]

From that article:

So why doesn't he let them pronounce on the deal instead of calling for an election? Perhaps because he thinks the majority are now against leaving the EU? He's hoping the UK's skewed electoral system will give him the votes in parliament to go ahead anyway.

If anything, I actually think he is hoping the skewed electoral system will end up in another "hung" parliament of sorts, and it means the UK will eventually crash out of the EU with no deal...

 

[Verde]

I predict today will be crunch time. Everyone will have to show their cards.

The shifty character occupying no 10 is unfortunately sitting with a strong hand.

You have to understand Boris’s motivation to see what’s going on. He does not care for his deal, he does not even care much for Brexit, he is only interested in remaining PM for a long as possible with as strong a majority as possible. He’s been concocting an election from the start.

Pundits see him hamstrung by a Brexit party who hate his deal. I don’t think he plans to campaign on his deal.

His refrain will be:

“They said the EU would not budge, but not only did I get them to reopen negotiations, I got them to agree on a much better deal while my one arm was tied behind my back by the surrender parliament.”

“They said my deal would never get approved by parliament, but I got the votes, alas due to the surrender bill there was no time to get it through.”

“I did all in my power to deliver the October deadline. I could not foresee or prevent parliament’s betrayal of the people.”

“If the election delivers a parliament united behind a hard Brexit, I will tear up my deal and get a much better deal by 31 Jan.”

He will use this reasoning to form an alliance with the Brexit party. They will go for it as it potentially delivers on all they want, and the alternative is to risk another hung parliament delaying Brexit.

With the Brexit party not putting up candidates in marginal Tory seats, while causing chaos for Labour in their leave constituencies, I expect a hard Brexit parliament to be elected.

I do not relish watching an untouchable Boris steering the out of control Brexit juggernaut for the next 5 years.

On the bright side, I am sure this disaster will come to an abrupt halt when he has to face the voters again in 5 years.

 

[Verde]

The interesting thing is how the opposition stacks up.

I think the Libs and SNP are serious about supporting the Dec election. Boris does not want his own deal, he would love a Dec election which will be a disaster for Labour turnout.

There is serious room for negotiating the exact terms of an election between these parties who have enough votes to get it through.

The question is, are the Libs and SNP using the threat of an election as leverage against Corbyn. He has his back against the wall. So far he has stood in the way of a majority for a 2nd referendum.

To me it looks like a Dec election will end Corbyn politically. Given the stark choice between his career and backing a 2nd referendum he might just cave in today.

 

[Vox Populi Vox Dei]

[Even after it was proven to be rubbish, you still think this is a thing. What a true Tory you really are. No need for facts, just lie at will to suit your agenda.

Anyway, seems like a fair few Tories are getting a tad upset with Johnson and his lies....

View attachment 731789

If voter fraud is such a non-issue according to you, why are Labour opposed to a new voter ID law (the identity documents will be free to obtain BTW) ?

By the way the Economist has noted postal vote fraud:

Redirect Notice

Whether or not the need for photo id puts off legitimate voters, the reforms will probably fail to stamp out a bigger source of fraud: postal votes. In 2004 Labour candidates in Birmingham manipulated postal ballots in a case of “electoral fraud that would disgrace a banana republic”, as Mr Mawrey, then sitting as an election commissioner, put it. Rules have since been tightened a bit. And the government now wants to ban “campaigners” from handling postal votes, put in place a limit on the number that can be handed in by one person, and make people reapply for a postal vote every three years.

But postal fraud will still be far from impossible. People have got used to the convenience of voting by mail, so there is little hope of returning to a system that allowed it only in special circumstances. As Eric Pickles, a Conservative peer who wrote a report on electoral fraud in 2016, notes: “Once the toothpaste is out of the tube, it’s very tough to get it back in.

By the way an official report noted:

Sir Eric Pickles said fraud may be overlooked because of “over-sensitivities about ethnicity and religion”, as he criticised town halls, police and election watchdogs for failing to detect, prevent and prosecute election fraud.

In a report released today the Government's corruption tsar claimed there is evidence of pressure being put on vulnerable members of some ethnic minority communities, with young people and women being urged to vote “according to the will of their elders”

Sir Eric said “politically correct sensibilities” meant authorities were not confronting voting irregularities in Pakistani or Bangladeshi communities in particular.

 

[Spizz]

If voter fraud is such a non-issue according to you, why are Labour opposed to a new voter ID law (the identity documents will be free to obtain BTW) ?

By the way the Economist has noted postal vote fraud:

Redirect Notice

By the way an official report noted:

Sorry, I’m missing the bit about students committing voting fraud in amongst all the vagueness. Could you highlight it to me?

 

[Vox Populi Vox Dei]

Sorry, I’m missing the bit about students committing voting fraud in amongst all the vagueness. Could you highlight it to me?

As I said previously, it's very difficult to obtain a guilty ruling but that doesn't mean it does not occur - in fact, it is clear to me that it must occur simply because the politically active students (who are overwhelmingly Labour and Lib Dem) will know about this loophole.

Let review the facts:

1. You are allowed to register at your home address and your university (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...emy-corbyns-vote-boosted-by-student-fraud?amp)

2. There are no strong mechanisms to prevent duplicate voting

It suggests ministers should investigate "developing a new computer system to block duplicate voting", the Daily Telegraph says, and the electorate should be "forced to choose" where they will cast their vote

3. The Electoral Commission itself admits the current electoral system is wide open to abuse:

An Electoral Commission report suggests that voter fraud may be an inevitable consequence of the current electoral register system and that changes may need to be made

 

[ToxicBunny]

Ahhh so because its possible, therefore its happening..

Right Chris... btw, have you figured out FPTP yet?

 

[Vox Populi Vox Dei]

In other GREAT news, the poisoned dwarf known as John Bercow (the Speaker) will be vacating his position at the end of this week. This is not insignificant as he has been the most biased Speaker in history, aiding and abetting the Remainer camp. Out of all the candidates, Harriet Harmen is the one most aligned to Bercow.

Hopefully we can expect a return to impartiality and thus I have placed a bet on Lindsay Hoyle, the current bookies favourite and widely respected across the aisle. Harriet Harman is Continuity Bercow. She's a huge danger.

 

[ToxicBunny]

In other GREAT news, the poisoned dwarf known as John Bercow (the Speaker) will be vacating his position at the end of this week. This is not insignificant as he has been the most biased Speaker in history, aiding and abetting the Remainer camp. Out of all the candidates, Harriet Harmen is the one most aligned to Bercow.

Hopefully we can expect a return to impartiality and thus I have placed a bet on Lindsay Hoyle, the current bookies favourite and widely respected across the aisle. Harriet Harman is Continuity Bercow. She's a huge danger.

Ok, so at least we can be sure that Lindsay Hoyle is not impartial at all if you think he is....

 

[Vox Populi Vox Dei]

Ahhh so because its possible, therefore its happening..

Right Chris... btw, have you figured out FPTP yet?

Err...why wouldn't it be happening? The fact that Labour opposes all forms of strengthening the integrity of the electoral system is revealing as well.

Yes I figured out FPTP 10 years ago as I said in my previous post. It's you who seems to be struggling somewhat. A double digit lead will lead to a majority government. End of story. You cannot obtain such a lead by simply deepening support of your existing seats. There's even a site, www.electoralcalculus.co.uk
where you can plug in the vote shares and how it translates to seats.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Err...why wouldn't it be happening? The fact that Labour opposes all forms of strengthening the integrity of the electoral system is revealing as well.

Yes I figured out FPTP 10 years ago as I said in my previous post. It's you who seems to be struggling somewhat. A double digit lead will lead to a majority government. End of story. You cannot obtain such a lead by simply deepening support of your existing seats. There's even a site, www.elecroralcalculus.co.uk where you can plug in the vote shares and how it translates to seats.

10 years ago? Really? Cos even yesterday, it seemed to escape you.

 

[Sideshow Bob]

Is John Bercow partial like SA is not a democracy? Will next speaker be impartial when he/she starts supporting my views?

 

[ToxicBunny]

Is John Bercow partial like SA is not a democracy? Will next speaker be impartial when he/she starts supporting my views?

Pretty much...

The next speaker (if its Lindsay) is definitely going to be impartial, because Chris's Twitter education possibly agrees with him..

Though it will be fsck off funny if Lindsay is installed as Speaker, and then proceeds to be properly impartial and upsets Chris...

 

[noxibox]

Well a majority would be good, because then they can vote the deal through without the DUP getting in the way.

Based on the polls in looks like the Brexit Party is now in decline. Already predicting they'll get no seats.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Well a majority would be good, because then they can vote the deal through without the DUP getting in the way.

Based on the polls in looks like the Brexit Party is now in decline. Already predicting they'll get no seats.

Liez! They will get a majority and it will all happen like Chris's Twitter masters say it will.

 

[Dave]

Labour to back early general election

Addressing the shadow cabinet this morning, Jeremy Corbyn MP, Leader of the Labour Party, said: "I have consistently said that we are ready for an election and our support is subject to a No Deal Brexit being off the table.
"We have now heard from the EU that the extension of Article 50 to 31st January has been confirmed, so for the next three months, our condition of taking No Deal off the table has now been met.
"We will now launch the most ambitious and radical campaign for real change our country has ever seen."

MPs vote in favour of general election on 12 December

The PM is successful - at the fourth attempt - in taking the UK to the polls before Christmas.

news.sky.com

 

[Spizz]

In other GREAT news, the poisoned dwarf known as John Bercow (the Speaker) will be vacating his position at the end of this week. This is not insignificant as he has been the most biased Speaker in history, aiding and abetting the Remainer camp. Out of all the candidates, Harriet Harmen is the one most aligned to Bercow.

Hopefully we can expect a return to impartiality and thus I have placed a bet on Lindsay Hoyle, the current bookies favourite and widely respected across the aisle. Harriet Harman is Continuity Bercow. She's a huge danger.

I thought you'd like Bercow. IIRC, he called for Mandela to be hanged.