The F-35 thread

buka001 said:
I know that, hence my clarification that "solutions are either in place or being worked on".

Just surprising though.
Click to expand...

Why? the original test aircraft were built for testing, they wouldn't be flying flight tests during thunderstorms (there's a lot of sensitive test equipment loaded into them for flight testing).

Now that flight testing of that sort is complete the old planes are just demonstrators and it's pointless wasting money on specific upgrades now when the planes will have to go into the factory for complete upgrades to current production build level at some time.

By the way, if you knew that it was just the early planes that had the bad weather flight issues the tone of your previous post borders slightly on trolling ;).

buka001 said:
The RAAF F-35's were grounded because of weather this week.
Click to expand...

When you knew that it was just the original 2 demo planes...
 
Dave said:
Why? the original test aircraft were built for testing, they wouldn't be flying flight tests during thunderstorms (there's a lot of sensitive test equipment loaded into them for flight testing).

Now that flight testing of that sort is complete the old planes are just demonstrators and it's pointless wasting money on specific upgrades now when the planes will have to go into the factory for complete upgrades to current production build level at some time.

By the way, if you knew that it was just the early planes that had the bad weather flight issues the tone of your previous post borders slightly on trolling ;).



When you knew that it was just the original 2 demo planes...
Click to expand...

The surprise is they sent those models to Red Flag 16-3. Instead of the weatherproof ones. They lost an oppurtunity to test the combat availability in poor weather.

I'll take the point on the Australian ones. I did miss that they were the demo versions. I thought it was the first two production ones still awaiting the solution.
 
So due to the F-35 money black hole this happened. The can't axe the A-10 so now they are after the air superiority F-15's.

This startling news came during a House Armed Services Committee hearing on the current state of the U.S. Air Force. Chairman Joe Wilson asked right out of the gate about a previously unknown USAF plan to retire the F-15C/D Eagle fleet and replace them with F-16s.
Click to expand...

Source
 
Blu82 said:
So due to the F-35 money black hole this happened. The can't axe the A-10 so now they are after the air superiority F-15's.


Source
Click to expand...

F15C's and D's? what a shock the USAF is thinking about retiring planes that were built between 1979 and 1985! I mean they should keep them going until at least 2079!

Most people realise that a combat airframe built in 1980 isn't going to function forever without spending more and more money on maintenance and upgrades until you're spending more on those upgrades and maintenance than it would cost to replace with a brand new airframe.

Funny how the USAF budget in 2015 publicly mentioned retirement of a chunk of the C fleet, yet it comes as "startling news" to Mr Rogoway...

The US Department of Defense unveiled a budget proposal on 4 March that would slash billions of dollars in aviation spending and make sweeping cuts to procurement of new fighter jets and unmanned aircraft.

The $495.6 billion proposal, which still must be approved by Congress, also would delay entry-into-service of Sikorsky's CH-53K heavy-lift helicopter by one year and reduce the US Air Force's fleet of Boeing F-15C fighters by 51 aircraft.
Click to expand...

March 2014
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...-fighters-unmanned-aircraft-in-fy2015-396612/

It's even on Wikipedia if he had wanted some advance warning.

There's another scandal for the author to uncover if he's quick, someone should tell him the USAF retired all F15A's and B's in 2009...
 
So any comments on why they are replacing them with F-16s instead of say F22s, F15Es or F15SE?s Also note the air force is discussing the fact that they want to retire all the aircraft instead of retiring old air frames. Then we have articles like these discussing the modernization program for that exact same fleet.

With rival nations like China and Russia quickly closing the technology gap that has allowed the US to rule the skies for decades and fewer F-22s than expected at its disposal, the Air Force has decided to invest in a major facelift for the battle-tested F-15 to help fill the void by extending its lifespan through 2040.
Click to expand...

Source
 
Blu82 said:
So any comments on why they are replacing them with F-16s instead of say F22s, F15Es or F15SE?s Also note the air force is discussing the fact that they want to retire all the aircraft instead of retiring old air frames. Then we have articles like these discussing the modernization program for that exact same fleet.



Source
Click to expand...

The C's and D's are old airframes. The youngest ones will be 32 years old this year. All the A's and B's were retired by around age 31, so as a comparison the C's and D's are going to be older at retirement than the A's and B's were.
 
Blu82 said:
So any comments on why they are replacing them with F-16s instead of say F22s, F15Es or F15SE?s Also note the air force is discussing the fact that they want to retire all the aircraft instead of retiring old air frames. Then we have articles like these discussing the modernization program for that exact same fleet.



Source
Click to expand...

Well, in that very report you originally posted (and has been discussed a lot) they have spoken about reopening F-22 production. F-15E does not do the same job as the F-15C. F-15SE is a whole other air frame that would have to be built when the stated point of all this is to reduce the number of airframes.
 
FoXtroT said:
Well, in that very report you originally posted (and has been discussed a lot) they have spoken about reopening F-22 production. F-15E does not do the same job as the F-15C. F-15SE is a whole other air frame that would have to be built when the stated point of all this is to reduce the number of airframes.
Click to expand...

So now the question is will an F-16 be able to fulfill the same role as an F-15C (as stated by the USAF) and is that difference worth the ease in maintenance. Why not scrap the F-15E since it and the F-16 offers similar capability.
 
Looking at the CNN article and eight missile F-15 combined with and F-35 reads like a very dangerous combination in an air to air scenario.
 
The way they are flying their old air fleet at the moment and that lack of replacements in any significant amount the USAF are going to be very very thinly stretched in the near future.
 
F-35 Continues to Stumble

Electronics Used to Justify Cost Not Delivering Capabilities

Ineffective as a Fighter

Ineffective as an Interdiction Bomber

Ineffective as a Close Air Support Platform

Navy’s F-35 Unsuitable for Carrier Operations

Price Tag Is the Only Thing Stealthy about the F-35

Combat Effectiveness at Risk

Can the F-35 Be Where It’s Needed, When It’s Needed?

F-35 Reliability Problems

Officials Hiding Truth about F-35’s Problems and Delays from Taxpayers

http://www.pogo.org/straus/issues/weapons/2017/f35-continues-to-stumble.html
 
We're getting a bunch of F35's stationed at our local airport soon. They already have a bunch of camo dome hangars for F16s, which make a pass over our town every now and then. It's a pity, I really liked those. Last year one flew to Bodø and caused a sonic boom that rattled our office windows. Pretty neat.
 
An interesting article that might help some understand the concept behind the F35's stealth abilities a little better.

An F-35 pilot explains why Russia and China's counter-stealth can't stop him

Ever since the US rocked Baghdad, at the time one of the most defended cities in the world, with F-117s in 1991, Soviets and other potential US adversaries have been studying up on how to counter stealth jets.

Later, over Serbia, an F-117 was shot down, forever souring the image of so-called “invisible” aircraft that have been on the top of the US Air Force’s agenda for decades.

Today, Russia and China have built out impressive arrays of very high frequency (VHF) and other integrated radars that can spot even the US’s most advanced and stealthy jets like the F-22 and the F-35 under the right circumstances.

While many have rushed to declare stealth a fruitless and expensive path for the US Air Force to walk, retired Marine Maj. Dan Flatley told Business Insider just why pilots of America’s most expensive weapons system aren’t afraid of Russian or Chinese counter-stealth.

“Adversaries have to build a kill chain,” said Flatley, a former pilot of the F-35. Just because a radar can find an object, and Russian VHF radars can spot F-35s, doesn’t mean it can fix, track, target, and consummate that kill chain with a missile hit.

“We’re not trying to prevent every aspect of that chain, just snap one of those links,” said Flatley.

So while an infrared radar could spot an F-35, and give enemy pilots an idea of where it is, it can’t track it or target it with a missile. This means that the systems Russia and China have spent millions developing only provide a tiny glimpse of the F-35, which may be sunk costs in the grand scheme of things.

“I don’t need to stop everything all the time,” Flately said of the kill chain. “I just need to make you unable to finish what you’ve already invested tons of time and money and effort in trying to shoot me down.”

“That’s the thing people don’t understand,” said Flatley. “They think we’re saying we’re invisible to everyone all the time at all bandwidths and energy levels … that’s not what we’re saying.”

Flatley says that F-35 pilots joke that only Wonder Woman has an invisible jet. The reality is that the F-35 is a huge piece of flying metal and alloy — a radar pointed at the right place at the right time will definitely spot it, but good luck shooting it down.

Meanwhile, as the enemy shoots out radiation to scour the skies for any trace of the F-35, the F-35 sees all of those emissions and can pinpoint the air defences and enemy planes.

Where legacy planes had to chose between lethality and survivability on a mission, the F-35 can do four, 16, or even 32 things at a time, meaning that while air and ground threats are looking for the stealth jet, the F-35 can already be dropping bombs that will smash them, according to Flatley.

“We’re extraordinarily confident in what we believe the performance of this jet is, and we have a lot of data and material to back that stuff up,” said Flatley.

So while Russian propaganda may boast that they can see F-35s, it may just be a response to a platform that’s rendered parts of their battle plan irrelevant.

The F-35 was custom-built to penetrate the most guarded air spaces in the world and get the job done. While the enemy hasn’t been standing still, and has made great progress towards countering the F-35, Flatley said he’s still sure that the US can carry out its mission on its terms.

“The expectation is that the F-35 will operate in a scenario against air and surface defence systems — and that’s an expectation that the American taxpayer and public should have,” said Flatley, who acknowledged the incredible effort the US has put behind the F-35 as a stealth penetrator, and remained resolute that “we’re not going to waste it.”

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/f-35-russia-china-radar-counter-stealth-2017-5?r=US&IR=T
Click to expand...
 
Dave said:
An interesting article that might help some understand the concept behind the F35's stealth abilities a little better.
Click to expand...
Did you see the F-35 went through the Mach Loop in Wales recently.

Some great footage.

I need to go visit this spot, only a 3 hour drive from me. Need to take leave though as they only fly during the week.
 
buka001 said:
Did you see the F-35 went through the Mach Loop in Wales recently.

Some great footage.

I need to go visit this spot, only a 3 hour drive from me. Need to take leave though as they only fly during the week.
Click to expand...

Gonna be there in July, hope to head out there for a day or two.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X