The Middle East Conflict Thread

[daveza]

http://www.wanted.org.il/tzipi_livni_en.htm

I'm not sure who is more dangerous, this thing or Netanyahu.

 

[Glock26]

Anybody with some savvy can see we're headed for another world war. The Bible predicts that Israel will eventually infuriate all nations to the point that they will rise up against Israel and attempt to destroy them. This event is known as Armageddon, when the entire world will declare war against Israel.adiation acting against the iron content in the water.
According to Bibical fact, one can certainly draw conclustions. It will enevitbly be an Arab vs Israeli conflict
Israel has it easy now, but as their own Bible predicts, life is going to get extremely complicated for them in the future.

Ah..this is quite peaceful without the rambling of some people thanks to the ignore feature.
Just thought I would correct you here respectfully J.
(Note, I am not religious at all, and don't subscribe to any of this) but if you want to talk about the "prophesies" then you have it incorrect.
Modern interpretation all agrees on the following: http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Armageddon+What+the+Bible+Says-a01073851643

The armies of the world do not gather to fight each other or to destroy the Jews (although destruction of the Jews is a primary aim of Satan and the Antichrist). Rather, the ultimate purpose of Armageddon is to emancipate the human race from God?s authority. Psalm 2 describes this futile plan:

Why do the nations rage? Why do the people waste their time with futile plans? The kings of the earth prepare for battle; the rulers plot together against the Lord and against His Anointed One. Let us break their chains, they cry. And free ourselves from this slavery. But the one who rules in heaven laughs. The Lord scoffs at them.? Psalm 2:1-4 (NLT)

Notice who the rulers plot against. They don?t plot against each other or Israel. They plot against the Lord and His Anointed One. Who is His Anointed One?? Jesus Christ. The armies of the world actually plot against the Prince of Peace Himself.

If you believe in the Bible's prophesies (your choice of course) then it has nothing to do with Israel. And as believers, you should already know that they are His chosen people anyways, and he does not make mistakes. More here: http://brittgillette.com/WordPress/?p=47

Just FYI.

G26

 

[CyraxHB]

There's only 4 countries which declare Hezbollah to be a terrorist organisation, and only 2 which declare that Hezbollah's military wing is a terrorist organisation.

So much for "internationally recognised".


And just remember : you were the one who falsely claimed that Hezbollah had been cowed by the IDF. The reality is quite the opposite. Any other "defense" of Hezbollah is merely correcting your icorrect claims about them.

Unless those countries are in Lebanon, it still stands as "internationally recognised". And lets not forget hamas who you also openly support which is also an internationally recognised terrorist organisation. You had better hope your real name doesnt come out here as you might find yourself on a few "no fly" lists in western countries.

That does not change the fact that hezbollah was falling over themselves to deny responsibility for the rocket attacks. Anyone with common sense can see the connection.

 

[Ghazi]

When Hamas agreed not to shout for Israel's destruction they were just looking at the AID money that stopped flowing.

The US provides about one-third of the nearly $1.1 billion in aid to the Palestinians. The Palestinians are the most foreign-aid dependent society on earth. So the threat by the United States to cut off most aid to Palestine after its 3.6 million people last month elected the militant group Hamas into government, is foreboding. The European Union is weighing similar action. And Israel says it will withhold $55 million a month in taxes and other fees collected by Israel, but owed to Palestinians.

Hamas is responsible for dozens of suicide bomb attacks over the past few years. To Hamas and its sympathizers, this is justified resistance to a decades-long Israeli occupation. But killing and injuring hundreds of civilians in Israel is also defined as terrorism.

"You cannot have one foot in the camp of terror and the other foot in the camp of politics," Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice told the press in Cairo last week. "You have to renounce violence."

http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article4518.shtml

Hamas became best known for its numerous suicide bombings against Israeli civilians and security forces.[6] Hamas renounced the practice in April 2006,[7] but has continued, after a 5-month ceasefire in 2008, to launch rocket attacks into Israel, endangering and sometimes killing Israeli civilians.

Hamas's charter calls for the destruction of the State of Israel[citation needed] and its replacement with a Palestinian Islamic state in the area that is now Israel

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas

Steven Cook, a Mideast expert at the Council on Foreign Relations, says, "For Hamas to no longer be considered a terrorist organization it must change its charter, it must renounce its violence and it must lay down its arms. At that point, and only at that point, can it be seen as a legitimate participant in the political arena."

Iran's proxy.
We all know Iran's "primate" president calls for the destruction of Israel.

Hezbollah's financial support is a matter of controversy. Critics argue that it is, or has been, massively supported with tens of millions of dollars annually from the Islamic Republic of Iran. Hezbollah maintains that the main source of its income comes from donations by Muslims. [Iranians are Muslims]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hezbollah

 

[daveza]

Israel probes itself again -

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Wo..._Mongering_Graffiti,_Left_By_Soldiers_In_Gaza

The Israeli military is investigating racist, war-mongering graffiti left by soldiers in Gaza, near the scene of alleged atrocities carried out by its troops.
A series of disturbing slogans were daubed on the walls of a house occupied during Operation Cast Lead by soldiers in the town of Zeitoun.

One reads "Arabs need 2 die", another says "make war not peace".
Elsewhere a soldier appears to crow about killing a Palestinian, writing in bad English: "1 is down, 999,999 to go."

On another wall in Hebrew, is written: "The Only Good Arab is a Dead Arab."

Others are too offensive to be reprinted here.

The graffiti is all the more disturbing because of what is alleged to have happened during the offensive in Zeitoun.

The UN's Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs quotes eye witnesses as saying a hundred Palestinians were rounded up and moved to a house which was repeatedly shelled 24 hours later.

Around thirty people are thought to have died.
Nearby, another 20 members of the same extended Samouni family claim they were sheltering when Israeli soldiers burst in and shot a father and his four year old son, deliberately and in cold blood, according to eye witnesses.

The Red Cross said it was delayed access to the area following the incidents.

Medics found children clinging to the bodies of their dead parents two days after the killings.

Major Avital Leibovich, a spokesman for the Israeli Defence Forces told Sky News the incidents in Zeitoun are under investigation.

The way soldiers are instructed is not to target civilians, it is against our code of ethics.

Major Avital Leibovich, spokesman for the Israeli Defence Forces

Asked about the graffiti, she told Sky News Online, "This is not the way soldiers are educated and trained. It is against our moral values. They will be investigated and those responsible will be punished."

 

[daveza]

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1057352.html

Olmert to Ban: Probe into Gaza war devastation must take rocket damage into account, too

By Barak Ravid



Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has asked UN Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon for assurance that any UN investigation of the damage resulting from the war in Gaza includes the damage Palestinian-fired rockets caused in Israel's south. Ban has agreed to do so, a top government official said.

"Any report must include the damage caused during the operation and in the past eight years to the communities of the south as a result of the Qassam fire," Olmert said.

Damage done by hamas rockets - 21 dead, broken windows, 300 chickens, some lamp poles, ceilings and a wall here and there.

Damage done by tanks, fighter bombers, helicopters, naval barrages, phosphorus bombs - over a thousand dead, thousands wounded and maimed, whole blocks destroyed, infrastructure destroyed, schools, hospitals, hundreds of orphans......

Does Olmert seriously want this comparison ?

 

[Alan]

and thousands living in bomb shelters. But hey they're only attempting to kill the Israelis. If somebody takes a few pot shots you're only allowed a few pots shot back ROFL.

Would you have preferred Israel indiscriminately launch thousands of rockets into Gaza

 

[w1z4rd]

Got this in my email today:

What happens when a fly falls into a coffee cup? The Italian - throws the cup and walks away in a fit of rage. The Frenchman - takes out the fly, and drinks the coffee. The Chinese - eats [Citeste] the fly and throws away the coffee. The Russian- drinks the coffee with the fly, since it was extra with no charge. The Israeli - sells the coffee to the Frenchman, the fly to the Chinese, buys himself a new cup of coffee and uses the extra money to invent a device that prevents flies from falling into coffee. The Palestinian - blames the Israeli for the fly falling in his coffee, protests the act of aggression to the UN, takes a loan from the European Union to buy a new cup of coffee, uses the money to purchase explosives and then blows up the coffee house where the Italian, the Frenchman, the Chinese, and the Russian are all trying to explain to the Israeli that he should give away his cup of coffee to the Palestinian.

 

[Alan]

Got this in my email today:

Unfortunately so true

 

[d0b33]

Got this in my email today:

Yah, I also find BS like this in my spambox.

 

[assassin]

and thousands living in bomb shelters. But hey they're only attempting to kill the Israelis. If somebody takes a few pot shots you're only allowed a few pots shot back ROFL.

Would you have preferred Israel indiscriminately launch thousands of rockets into Gaza

Preferred it, where do you live. Take a look at the damage and the death toll.

Looks to me like thats exactly what they did.

 

[w1z4rd]

Yah, I also find BS like this in my spambox.

Then relax, sit back and drink a cup of coffee

 

[Mephisto_Helix]

Preferred it, where do you live. Take a look at the damage and the death toll.

Looks to me like thats exactly what they did.

Uhm, not quite ...... to have a death toll of what, 1300 when the population is about 400 000 means they did the exact opposite

 

[Xarog]

I dunno mate, there are nukes in existence that would sucessfully destroy the entire Middle East with one hit aka Tsar Bomb but really, anybody who uses a weapon like this is either out of his godam f**n mind...or Russian. It left a crater so big you could fit all of Gauteng inside of it. God forbid that thing should ever be used on any nation, it would change the world forever.

Well, I'd like to think that Israel wouldn't be dumb enough to commit genocide. But who knows, maybe I'm giving them too much credit.

Makind currently has at his disposal the capacity to destroy the world, to eradicate all living life from this earth and to rend our planet useless. We must certainly be proud of our achievements, the power to give life and the power to take it away. We can now play god and to a capacity we are now god's of our own world. What an accomplishment. Even Barbarossa boasted of this accomplishment so we need to ask ourselves, how far have we really come??

We don't have the power to give life. We can preserve it in some instances, but ultimately, we die, and nothing can change that. As for taking life away, what's the difference between a stone and a gun? One is more effecient, but the effect is just the same.

Anybody with some savvy can see we're headed for another world war. The Bible predicts that Israel will eventually infuriate all nations to the point that they will rise up against Israel and attempt to destroy them. This event is known as Armageddon, when the entire world will declare war against Israel.

Well, personally I don't think another world war is as guaranteed as you may think. Firstly the economic crisis means that countries are going to be too busy looking after themselves to be thinking about aggressive behaviour. On the US's part, I think the loan guarantees they give to Israel and Egypt are going to be under threat; no American is going to like the fact that the US is spending money on other nations when more and more people find themselves jobless and in need of government aid.

The Bible says that this battle will be so intense than rivers will run with blood and the only escape will be for women and children to hide in caves and flee to the mountains.

After the Hiroshima bombings, people noted that the river running through Hiroshima turned red, this was because of the radiation acting against the iron content in the water.

According to Bibical fact, one can certainly draw conclustions. It will enevitbly be an Arab vs Israeli conflict

Israel has it easy now, but as their own Bible predicts, life is going to get extremely complicated for them in the future.

Personally, I don't believe in the bible. However, I would rather that Israel just grow the f##k up rather than cause a world war.

http://www.wanted.org.il/tzipi_livni_en.htm

I'm not sure who is more dangerous, this thing or Netanyahu.

She's repeatedly claimed that she doesn't talk to terrorists, yet her dad was the leader of a terrorist organisation...

I guess things are strained at home.

Unless those countries are in Lebanon, it still stands as "internationally recognised".

I'd rather side with the other 150 countries around the world who do not regard Hezbollah as terrorists, thanks.

And lets not forget hamas who you also openly support

Wrong.

You had better hope your real name doesnt come out here as you might find yourself on a few "no fly" lists in western countries.

What, for deconstructing spurious claims made by yourself and others like yourself? Don't make me laugh.

That does not change the fact that hezbollah was falling over themselves to deny responsibility for the rocket attacks. Anyone with common sense can see the connection.

Ipse dixit.

When Hamas agreed not to shout for Israel's destruction they were just looking at the AID money that stopped flowing.

So... You guys demand they renounce violence and then there will be positive changes towards Hamas. They do make a change and then you accuse them of being money grubbers. :Rolleyes:

I suppose if they put their weapons down you'll see it as the perfect opportunity to killt hem all?

And for the record : I don't see anyone claiming that Israel should lay down its weapons to be considered a legitimate participant in the political arena. Double standards? Naaaaaaah

(Although, on second thought, this might actually be a good idea. Israel would have to resort to diplomacy for once...)

 

[w1z4rd]

Well, I'd like to think that Israel wouldn't be dumb enough to commit genocide. But who knows, maybe I'm giving them too much credit.

I dont think they will. They are not Sudanese Islamic militia. Though if any country is able to really threaten Israel to the point of destruction... well I dont expect Mecca to be around too much longer.

 

[R/SGT]

Xarog, I believe that they want Hamas to stop the indiscriminate and unprovoked attacks on Israeli citizens.

The Israeli attacks are for the most part in response to attacks from Hamas and they try to take out the militants without killing innocent civilians.

Both sides need to back off and sit their asses down until this issue is resolved once and for all.

 

[Xarog]

Xarog, I believe that they want Hamas to stop the indiscriminate and unprovoked attacks on Israeli citizens.

The Israeli attacks are for the most part in response to attacks from Hamas and they try to take out the militants without killing innocent civilians.

Both sides need to back off and sit their asses down until this issue is resolved once and for all.

I can completely understand that Israel would not want to be the target of attacks.

It's a reasonable expectation.

*However*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfFMZ7Y-s_c&

Even Israel admits that until Israel attacked Gaza, Hamas had observed the cease-fire. Israel did not uphold its side of the bargain (i.e. opening the borders). Hamas negotiated in good faith, Israel negotiated in bad faith.

But you are right. Both parties need to meet at the negotiation table, and both parties need to negotiate in good faith. I honestly look forward to this happening.

 

[R/SGT]

Honestly I dont hold out much hope of that happening as there are plenty of groups on both sides who are only to happy to muddy the waters and prevent any sort of peace plan

 

[Xarog]

Honestly I dont hold out much hope of that happening as there are plenty of groups on both sides who are only to happy to muddy the waters and prevent any sort of peace plan

I just wish Israel would realise that its in their best interests to set up an independent Palestinian state.

Case in point : Israel destroyed 80% of Gaza's agricultural land. Who's going to have to foot the bill for the extra food that will now have to be shipped to Gazans in order to prevent widespread starvation. I find it unlikely that there was ever a military reason for such widespread destruction.

But the real point is that eventually the Palestinians will be reduced to a point where they cannot form an independent state. And when that point comes, they will instead look to be annexed by Israel. A sizable portion of the West Bank has already been taken over via settlements. If Israel has to annex the occupied territory, that is instantly another 5 million arab-Israelis. Not a pleasant thought for anyone who wants Israel to remain a "Jewish and Democratic" nation.

 

[d0b33]

Peace loving Israel just fired a missile injuring 5...

Five Palestinians injured, two seriously, as Israeli naval gunship vessels intensively fired missiles at an area in western Gaza City on Thursday, medics and witnesses said.

Residents said that several Israeli naval gunship vessels fired dozens of shells at the western coast of the Gaza Strip, mainly at Shati (Beach) refugee camp west of Gaza City, wounding at least five people.

Gaza emergency chief Mo'aweya Hassanein told reporters that five Palestinians had several injuries and were brought to Shifa Hospital by local ambulances, adding that two are in serious conditions.