The UCT - Cecil John Rhodes Statue Thread

[Mila]

Neanderthals are actually now considered to be quite intelligent. You're outdated.

These people are also considered "intelligent". They can breath with out assistance, they can fling crap. They can even write!

So you like them talking for you, says a whole lot.

 

[Space_Chief]

:erm: hitler Hussein = Cecil oke dokey

For many, yes. It's beside the point really. Lenin is still appreciated by many, yet statues of him were taken down all over Eastern Europe. Point is this is not about changing history but at how we look at aspects of the history. Do we hold some people in high regard still? Do these values still represent our own, or not.

If you want to moan, moan about Chaka's statue. He was more in that bracket. And what did he do? Give land away to the white imperialists.
But what ever blows your hair back.

It depends whether he is venerated or not. Shaka must still be venerated or such protests would occur. Rhodes is a figure who was not pro-Blacks or pro-Afrikaaners either.

 

[Space_Chief]

These people are also considered "intelligent". They can breath with out assistance, they can fling crap. They can even write!

So you like them talking for you, says a whole lot.

They don't speak for me, Mila. I don't have to agree with them to find your points incorrect. You should stop pulling ad hominems.

 

[alternate]

The more "transformation" that happens at university the more of this **** you will see.

 

[The_Right_Honourable_Brit]

They don't speak for me, Mila. I don't have to agree with them to find your points incorrect. You should stop pulling ad hominems.

Read the comments on the article - some good points made: http://www.dailymaverick.co.za/arti...the-rhodes-less-travelled-or-whats-in-a-name/

 

[Mila]

They don't speak for me, Mila. I don't have to agree with them to find your points incorrect. You should stop pulling ad hominems.

But that was my question... and that was your answer. :erm:
I did not speak for you. You did however.

 

[Space_Chief]

But that was my question... and that was your answer. :erm:
I did not speak for you. You did however.

You said: " So you like them talking for you, says a whole lot."

 

[Space_Chief]

Read the comments on the article - some good points made: http://www.dailymaverick.co.za/arti...the-rhodes-less-travelled-or-whats-in-a-name/

Hi, thanks for that.

It's not so much about what were considered his views on black and non British people, but he was a political figure who did some nasty things on a grand scale and on a personal scale.

Take this for example:

Rhodes had already tried and failed to get a mining concession from Lobengula, king of the Ndebele of Matabeleland. In 1888 he tried again. He sent John Moffat, son of the missionary Robert Moffat, who was trusted by Lobengula, to persuade the latter to sign a treaty of friendship with Britain, and to look favourably on Rhodes' proposals. His agent Francis Thompson, who had travelled to Bulawayo in the company of Charles Rudd and Rochfort Maguire, assured Lobengula that no more than ten white men would mine in Matabeleland. This limitation was left out of the document, known as the Rudd Concession, which Lobengula signed. Furthermore it stated that the mining companies could do anything necessary to their operations. When Lobengula discovered later the true effects of the concession, he tried to renounce it, but the British Government ignored him.[17]

He basically cheated the local authority out of mining rights, or to say, acted dishonestly. Then when caught out the British govt ignored pleas from the local sovereigns. That's just one ethically bad thing. It was unethical then - just happened that these were blacks - but if you did this to a fellow Englishman it would be unethical - and still is definitely unethical now. He is part of the British Imperial World. One which thanks to WW2 and the USA is no longer present. But we definitely would not want people to emulate this behaviour.

 

[ProfA]

@Space_Chief has made many valid points.

I see the closet racist mentality of many users here is still strong.

 

[Electric]

@Space_Chief has made many valid points.

I see the closet racist mentality of many users here is still strong.

Agreed

 

[ellyally]

I guess we need to burn down all universities too then

 

[ProfA]

I guess we need to burn down all universities too then

huh?

 

[Mila]

In 1904 Leander Jamson issued £50 000 preferred stock to the university from the Rhodes Trust. With this funding Rhodes University College was founded by an act of parliament on 31 May 1904.

It was built with his money as well. So if you want to tear it down. Do the whole thing. Why just the statue?

 

[Mila]

@Space_Chief has made many valid points.

I see the closet racist mentality of many users here is still strong.

Like?

 

[ellyally]

huh?

Why stop with removing a statue or two, the white man is responsible for all infrastructure... so, burn down schools and universities, dig up the roads(whats left of them) destroy all hospitals, smash the dams and reservoirs, destroy the power stations(not that eskom needs much help), while we at it, planes, trains and automobiles can go too

 

[Electric]

Why stop with removing a statue or two, the white man is responsible for all infrastructure... so, burn down schools and universities, dig up the roads(whats left of them) destroy all hospitals, smash the dams and reservoirs, destroy the power stations(not that eskom needs much help), while we at it, planes, trains and automobiles can go too

It seems this plan is already in full force.

 

[Brawler]

Why stop with removing a statue or two, the white man is responsible for all infrastructure... so, burn down schools and universities, dig up the roads(whats left of them) destroy all hospitals, smash the dams and reservoirs, destroy the power stations(not that eskom needs much help), while we at it, planes, trains and automobiles can go too

hah, not going to happen.
People here want the best of both worlds and neither of the crappy parts. It will be a good day when people stop looking into the past (which cannot change) and concentrate on their future.

 

[The_Right_Honourable_Brit]

Oh dear lord...the guilt is strong with this one...

 

[ellyally]

hah, not going to happen.
People here want the best of both worlds and neither of the crappy parts. It will be a good day when people stop looking into the past (which cannot change) and concentrate on their future.

Yeah, I just find it funny though that the very people screaming and shouting to have his statue torn down are the very same people who are benefiting from his money by studying in the university he paid for. They must either destroy it all or STFU.... there are bigger more important problems in this country they should be demonstrating for/against.

 

[Kilgore_Trout_Redux]

It was built with his money as well. So if you want to tear it down. Do the whole thing. Why just the statue?

Because we are never allowed to celebrate the good that whites have done in this country - only demonize us for the bad actions.