Thoughts on Discovery Capital 200+

Ecco

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It means they are very confident that they will be able to make even more than double over the 5 years and cream that top part off...
 
Phew, Discovery being rather 'generous', what % annual fees are going to be claimed?
 
Yah I was looking at this and was also curious as it seemed quite good
 
I have analysed many of these structured index linked products. I hate them, because of all the deception that goes into the design and sale of them.

There is nothing wrong with structured products per se, but the predatory financial services industry abuses them to deceive ignorant investors.

I guarantee that you will not find a single Discovery broker who can do the calculations required to analyse the appropriateness of such products for the particular circumstances of their clients, or to evaluate the value proposition. But boy oh boy are these things easy to sell.

I’m sure most people who listen to the Discovery broker’s pitch will come away thinking this product gives them high risk-like returns without actually being exposed to much risk.

The truth is, financial engineering cannot achieve miracles like lowering risk whilst maintaining high return expectations. What it can do is to change the probability distribution of possible outcomes to suit an investors needs. For eg. You can sacrifice some of the upside in exchange for limiting some of the downside. Unfortunately with most of these products, it is not the client’s needs that are taken into account in the engineering, it is the salesman’s.

I will post an analysis I did of this specific product here tomorrow – just working on the finishing touches.

Here are a few things to think about:
Financial engineers use derivatives like options and futures to create structured products like this.

None of the investment goes into the companies that make up the indexes it derives its value from.

If you invest in for eg. the DBX Eurostoxx50 ETF, your money is used to actually buy shares in the various companies making up the index – with a structured product this does not happen.

Your money is locked up for 5 years. If you want to get out you will be heavily penalised. ETFs and unit trusts on the other hand are highly liquid, you can get out anytime at the market price.

These products do not give investors in them exposure to the dividend income earned by the shareholders of the companies in the index, like an ETF or unit trust does. Dividend yield made up more than 60% of the real return earned by investors in the companies making up the S&P 500 index over the last 50 years.

“Lump sum Discovery Endowment Plan administration fees apply and financial adviser fees apply. These will reduce the final return received.”
These fees are (for a R100000 investment):
Initial fees: 5.42% = R5420 deducted upfront. So only R94580 is actually invested in the product and will grow as per the illustrative values.
Ongoing: 2% per year of the average value of the investment.
 
Personally....I'm wary of these things. I don't particularly feel like going up against a major corporation in making long range predictions & "trigger" conditions stuff like that. Presumably they've got an army of acturaries, traders and economists to back them...I don't.

I'll rather take my chances with the raw underlying share/whatever.
 
Quote from the Discovery 200+ fact sheet:

“The Discovery Capital 200+ is backed by a product issued by BNP Paribas Aribitrage Issuance B.V. (the "Issuer") and guaranteed by BNP Paribas. There is a risk of partial or total loss of capital in the case of bankruptcy or payment default by the Issuer or the Guarantor. BNP Paribas is one of the world’s largest banking group with domestic markets in France, Italy, Belgium, Luxembourg and retail operations in the USA, Turkey and Africa. BNP Paribas enjoys robust credit ratings of A+/A2/A+.”

This disclaimer is important.
Structured products are exposed to the credit risk of the issuer.
This is different from products like ETFs and unit trust where you are not exposed to the issuer’s credit risk.
If you own a unit trust managed by Allan Gray you will not lose anything if Allan Gray goes bust.
In contrast when Lehman Bros went bankrupt in 2008 investors in structured products underwritten by them got the shock of their lives when they had to stand in a very long line of creditors to get their money back – they ended up with only cents on the dollar.
This had nothing to do with the performance of the underlying product which may well have been good, it was a result of the fact that their claim was against a bankrupt company, instead of against a portfolio of real assets like you have with ETFs, UTs etc.
 
Analysis of Discovery Capital 200+ (DC200+)

Financial engineering can divide a portfolio up into its parts, and then put it back together again in a new configuration, but the sum of the parts remains the same. Risk cannot be reduced without also reducing expected return.

Assumptions:

These assumptions are off the top of my head, and good enough for a rough analysis. There are ways to derive these values from current market prices to perform a more accurate analysis.
USA Inflation: 2%
RSA Inflation: 6.5%
Real index growth: 2%
Dividend yield: 2%
Standard deviation of annual returns: 20%

Option 1: 70% DJ Eurostoxx50 ETF/30% MSCI USA index ETF (70/30ETF)

Option 2: DC200+

Option 1 expected nominal return per annum: USA inflation+ Inflation differential between USA/RSA (6.5%-2%=4.5%) + Real index growth + Dividend yield = 2%+4.5%+2%+2% = 10.5% p.a.

Option 2 expected nominal return p.a.: USA inflation + Real index growth = 2%+2% = 4%

Expected value of R1 invested after 5 years: Option 1: R1.65 ; Option 2: R1.22

Can you see what the engineers did here?

From what I can find in the small print there are 3 things that are taken away from an investor in option 2 vs option 1 (don’t be alarmed, they do give most of it back in another form as you will see later).

1. The expected depreciation of the Rand vs hard currencies over the next 5 years – which adds to nominal returns earned by investments priced in hard currencies and then translated back into R. The expected annual depreciation of the R vs. $ can be calculated as the difference between the expected inflation rate in RSA vs USA, in my example (6.5%-2%) = 4.5% per annum of return given up in option 2 vs. option 1

2. The dividend yield earned by the stocks underlying the index. ie. 2% p.a. Dividends have value and can be exchanged for something else that has value like downside protection in derivatives markets.
From the brochure :
Dividends from these indices are utilised to provide the enhanced payouts and guarantees at maturity and are therefore not included in the index returns.

3. The investor in option 2 is locked in for 5 years vs option 1. He has to give up liquidity. This is a valuable thing and can be sold for a price in derivatives markets.

Rand depreciation
They refer to an index, not a R or $ value. Their prey (read clients) would assume if they refer to an index composed of US and euro stocks that it must be priced in a hard currency. In fact they are explicitly referring to a Rand index which is evident in this paragraph in the brochure:

Currency Protection
Although the global portfolio is based on offshore markets, it is unaffected by any Rand appreciation or depreciation. You will therefore not be exposed to any risk of currency fluctuations.


See how they put a positive spin on something that is actually expected to impose a 4.5% annual drag on performance.

5 years ago the S&P 500 stood at 879 points, today it is 1960. The index return was 123% over the 5 years. R1 invested turned into R2.23

5 years ago the R/$ was 7.91 vs. 10.66 today. The return over the 5 years for an investor who had a $ claim on the index value would have been 200% in Rand terms. R1 invested turned into R3.

An investor in the DC200+ has a Rand claim on the index so their R1 would now be worth R2.23

The 70/30ETF investor has a $ claim on the index, so their R1 turned into R3. They also have a claim on dividends, if we assume a yield of 2% for the last 5 years, that means R1 turned into R3.32.

Big picture: the expected outcome for R1 invested in option 1 is R1.65 vs R1.22 for option 2 before the goodies that are added back by our engineer to sweeten the deal for option 2 investors.

The table below shows the probability distribution for the 2 options:

Outcome for R1 investment; Option 1 ; Option 2
>R3........................................6%...............1%
>2; <R3................................25%.............10%
=R2.........................................0%.............56%
>R1; <R2...............................57%...............0%
=R1.........................................0%..............30%
>R1; <R0.5.............................12%...............0%
<R0.5.......................................0%...............3%

Look at the tails: > R3 and <R0.5 so 200% gain or 50% loss, the best and worst outcomes on the table. See how option 2 gives up some of the upside, and how the probability of a really bad outcome also increases. So you have a 6% chance to shoot the lights out with option1, but only 1% with option 2 which is a bad thing for DC200+. Also there is zero chance you can lose more than 50% of your money with the 70/30ETF but a whopping 3% chance with DC200+.

3% might not seem like much, but imagine you are retired and dependent on this thing. You could retire at 60 and die at 95, that is seven 5 year periods each time exposed to this 3% risk, so it becomes a 21% (1 in 5) risk of catastrophic retirement ending loss. Remember the 50% loss is in nominal terms, if my inflation assumption of 6.5% pans out the loss actually means your money loses 64% of its buying power after 5 years, and that is without spending a cent of it.

Another negative for DC200+ is that there is a 30% chance that you make zero return, but with 70/30ETF you at least have a 57% chance to make between zero and 100% return.

On the plus side for DC200+: most of the middle of the distribution is very nice:
- The chances that you end up with more than double your money is: 56%+10%+1%=67%; for 70/30ETF it is only: 0%+25%+6% = 31%

- The chances of losing money is reduced from 12% to 3% for DC200+

So the engineer taketh and the engineer giveth.

But what is the value proposition. Does he take more than he gives.

I calculated that the expected outcome for R1 invested ie. All possible outcomes x their probabilities for the 2 options is: Option 1: R1.76 ; option 2: R1.68. So the hidden cost is about 5% upfront.

However the costs for option 1 has not been deducted yet. Investing in these ETFs incurs a cost of .95% per year, which translates to about the same 5% cost as option 2.
So from a value perspective the 2 options are equivalent.

It is for the investor to decide which distribution they find more attractive. I would suggest DC200+ is not good for a highly risk averse investor like a retiree. Bet that was not the impression the brochure gave you.
I think the ideal investor for this product is a young person with a lot of money. Since there are not too many of them around I wonder how those Discovery brokers manage to get so rich - surely they're not selling this to old people.

Also DC200+ has other costs as explained in my earlier post – those costs are a dealbreaker for me.

Also there is tax – on a R100,000 investment DC200+ would be taxed much more heavily than 70/30ETF. If we are talking R5m+ then the tax position for DC200+ starts getting more advantageous than 70/30ETF.

And remember the liquidity and credit risk associated with DC200+
 
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Thats a 15% pa return, which is pretty good

My analysis shows that the probability of 15% or better return is only 67%. 1/3 of the time investors will be very disappointed. 3% of the time they will be ruined.
 
It means they are very confident that they will be able to make even more than double over the 5 years and cream that top part off...

Actually no, they are very confident that they can use derivatives to perfectly hedge all their risks and guarantee that they will earn all their fees.
There is no risk that they can lose on this deal, and also no chance for them to earn a profit beyond the fees disclosed. It requires a bit of digging to uncover all the fees.

The Discovery endowment plan has an upfront fee calculated on the initial investment of 5.42% and an annual fee of 2% of the investment value charged for each of the 5 years.

There is also a hidden cost amounting to about 5% of the initial investment. This is not a fee, but rather costs incurred in trading the required derivatives including the underwriter's (BNP Paribas) fees.
 
My analysis shows that the probability of 15% or better return is only 67%. 1/3 of the time investors will be very disappointed. 3% of the time they will be ruined.

Isn't the chance of 67% to make get a 15% return quite good? Or what would be a better investment then?
Sorry I'm clueless with this.
 
Isn't the chance of 67% to make get a 15% return quite good? Or what would be a better investment then?
Sorry I'm clueless with this.

Yes it is, but can you live with the downside the other 33% of the time.
Also that is 15% before costs, costs siphon off about 3% per year leaving 12%.
 
Update on this product offering:
* Costs can and should be negotiated with the broker, they are not fixed
* As an endowment there is no tax, the return is net money in your hands, the beauty of the endowment scheme (until SARS change the rules of course)
* There is downside protection against negative index performance, to a point. In the latest tranche - 40%. In today's volatile markets that is a tremendous incentive. The value of other equity based products or straight share/unit trust investments would lose 40% whereas this fund would give you 100% of your capital back.
* The upside is not capped at 15%, outperformance is passed on to you.

How do I know this? The last tranche I took has made 25% realized. Could you have made that investing directly in the market? Maybe, but are you really able to? Also do your research - there are other products on the market that offer full capital protection and even guaranteed minimum returns eg. Investec's offshore products, the latest guarantees 105% and is capped on the upside at 150%. Capital protected index tracking products such as these should form part of everyone's diversified portfolios IMHO - you essentially get the security of a fixed deposit but with equity market returns
 
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