Understanding HDMI cables and why cheap ones work perfectly

[kingrob]

Thought this was well written and an excellent explanation.

http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=ps3&thread.id=828972

Since this question gets asked like 15 times a day, and I usually end up responding to them, I'll make a general post... Sure would be nice to be stickied, but since that won't happen, at least highlight it and keep the URL so you yourself will have an easy time "replying" to the onslaught of questions...

I originally wrote this as a reply to a post, but thought it made more sense standing on it's own... So here goes...

"Question: Is there any difference between a cheap (i.e. $10 HDMI cable) and an expensive (i.e. $150 HDMI cable)???"

I have an EE degree. I work as a broadcast engineer. I live and breath digital and analog signals every day. So yes, you could say I'm qualified to give the answer to this question...

That answer is, "No, an expensive HDMI cable will make NO difference in the quality of your picture OR sound"

I'll give you the more complex reason first, then an analogy... Hopefully one will make sense... If you don't want all the real technical stuff, just skip down to B for a real simple explaination...

 

[arf9999]

This is 100% true.

But in my experience, the very cheap cables have crappy connectors that separate from the cable if you don't treat them with the greatest care.

 

[I am Penguin]

Yeah, there is some more things to consider tho. The writer did not enlarge on the frequecy and capacitance of the "cheaper" cable. The analogies used is correct but if you have a longer cheap quality, capacitance prone cable then yes you could get in trouble. The fact is that a lot of the digital data carried are just the picture data and thus would not influence the working of the system. The analogy of either working or not is true for the "system" data but if the picture data gets bit losses then you may see some sort of random artifacts or disturbances. Also consider that some recovery will be attempted by the digital electonics that would/may retain operation but at a possible degraded function.

The point I am trying to make is the same as when very cheap ethernet/Coax cable is used with high inherant capacitance then on longer cables or higher data rates some bits may get lost.

In general the cheaper cables does the same job due to the fact that they were tested to work you would expect but you need to have access the the specification as to what frequecy itwas tested. Also the durabality and the stability of the PVC on the cable may be an issue over long term. It is not cheaper for no reason.

I stand corrected that there is a data speed/rate change between the V1.1 and V1.3 cables? So all it means that the so called V1.3 cable have a better AC impedance or data rate spec than the V1.1 cable.

 

[kingrob]

Yeah, there is some more things to consider tho. The writer did not enlarge on the frequecy and capacitance of the "cheaper" cable. The analogies used is correct but if you have a longer cheap quality, capacitance prone cable then yes you could get in trouble. The fact is that a lot of the digital data carried are just the picture data and thus would not influence the working of the system. The analogy of either working or not is true for the "system" data but if the picture data gets bit losses then you may see some sort of random artifacts or disturbances. Also consider that some recovery will be attempted by the digital electonics that would/may retain operation but at a possible degraded function.

The point I am trying to make is the same as when very cheap ethernet/Coax cable is used with high inherant capacitance then on longer cables or higher data rates some bits may get lost.

In general the cheaper cables does the same job due to the fact that they were tested to work you would expect but you need to have access the the specification as to what frequecy itwas tested. Also the durabality and the stability of the PVC on the cable may be an issue over long term. It is not cheaper for no reason.

I stand corrected that there is a data speed/rate change between the V1.1 and V1.3 cables? So all it means that the so called V1.3 cable have a better AC impedance or data rate spec than the V1.1 cable.

What on earth are you trying to say???

 

[avr-rulez]

Cheap may work now...but 2 years down the line - are they still working?

 

[W@P]

This is 100% true.

But in my experience, the very cheap cables have crappy connectors that separate from the cable if you don't treat them with the greatest care.

I agree, my fancy gold plated cable that i got from kalahari is splitting the plastic covering the connecters in 2. I have to get some super glue or something to glue the plastic cover together again.

 

[sand_man]

So my 42inch HD ready Pvision plasma has every slot under the sun other than HDMI slot. Am I able to use the HD PVR with this set or not?

 

[MrSmith]

So my 42inch HD ready Pvision plasma has every slot under the sun other than HDMI slot. Am I able to use the HD PVR with this set or not?

No you need HDMI input.

 

[sand_man]

No you need HDMI input.

Why the hell then does my set purport to being HD ready?

 

[Silver82]

Why the hell then does my set purport to being HD ready?

DVI input?

 

[sdd]

Yeah, there is some more things to consider tho. The writer did not enlarge on the frequecy and capacitance of the "cheaper" cable. The analogies used is correct but if you have a longer cheap quality, capacitance prone cable then yes you could get in trouble. The fact is that a lot of the digital data carried are just the picture data and thus would not influence the working of the system. The analogy of either working or not is true for the "system" data but if the picture data gets bit losses then you may see some sort of random artifacts or disturbances. Also consider that some recovery will be attempted by the digital electonics that would/may retain operation but at a possible degraded function.

The point I am trying to make is the same as when very cheap ethernet/Coax cable is used with high inherant capacitance then on longer cables or higher data rates some bits may get lost.

In general the cheaper cables does the same job due to the fact that they were tested to work you would expect but you need to have access the the specification as to what frequecy itwas tested. Also the durabality and the stability of the PVC on the cable may be an issue over long term. It is not cheaper for no reason.

I stand corrected that there is a data speed/rate change between the V1.1 and V1.3 cables? So all it means that the so called V1.3 cable have a better AC impedance or data rate spec than the V1.1 cable.

bs.

I have being telling my buddies this for ages. Cheap cables work just as well as the more expensive counterpart for the purposes that we as consumers use it. We are not talking about long cable lengths here and you are using it indoors.

Buy the cheap ones and use the saving to buy more beer.

 

[sand_man]

DVI input?

Yes it does... HDMI to DVI?

 

[HapticSimian]

Yes it does... HDMI to DVI?

Stand to be corrected, but no. HDMI -> DVI doesn't allow for the electronic handshake with regards to DRM between devices, so you won't get an HD feed from an HD PVR on that television.

Oh, and IAP does that sometimes... over-complicates things... he likes the PS3

 

[@udiS3]

bs.

I have being telling my buddies this for ages. Cheap cables work just as well as the more expensive counterpart for the purposes that we as consumers use it. We are not talking about long cable lengths here and you are using it indoors.

Buy the cheap ones and use the saving to buy more beer.

+100 my cheap cables work well...

 

[arf9999]

Yes it does... HDMI to DVI?

As long as the set is HDCP compliant, you can run HDMI-DVI. But you'll need to run audio separately.

Check your instruction manual.... or mail Pvision salesjhb(at)pvision.co.za

 

[sand_man]

As long as the set is HDCP compliant, you can run HDMI-DVI. But you'll need to run audio separately.

Check your instruction manual.... or mail Pvision salesjhb(at)pvision.co.za

Sweet, thanks. On the back of the set the DVI port and the RCA audio ports are grouped together so that would confirm the configuration you suggesting...

 

[I am Penguin]

What on earth are you trying to say???

Read and see! Note the difference between Lab and real world tests.

http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/long-hdmi-cable-bench-tests/hdmi-cable-testing-results

http://www.audioholics.com/education/cables/long-hdmi-cable-bench-tests/evaluation-conclusion

http://gizmodo.com/282725/the-truth-about-monster-cable-+-grand-finale-part-iii

 

[I am Penguin]

Some more info:

http://www.ilovehdtv.com/articles/2006/08/hdmi_part_8_cables_for_13.php

A i said, test the cable! If it works fine, smile and be happy.

I am going to buy a cheap R455.00 15 meter cabe from SpaceTV confimed to work on 1080p projector in another forum.http://www.spacetv.co.za/

 

[I am Penguin]

Interesting read!

HDMI Cables - Worth visiting the Hi End?

http://www.audiophilecandy.com/news2.asp?article=22&type=info

Conclusion

For a digital connection I was pleasantly surprised at the differences between the worst and best cable here. Happily there was only one cable which I found to be poor, that being the generic cable supplied with the likes of the Virgin + cable box and SkyHD receiver, whilst it does work and get a signal to the display, it doesn't really do the display or source justice due to the noise and blockiness on smooth edges, it looks like the noise getting into the cable is causing the error correction in the link to work harder, degrading the image. The basic Labgear HDMI cable was a welcome upgrade from the Generic cable, whilst still not perfect if you're on a very tight budget then this is a worthwhile upgrade. It took the Black Rhodium Calypso and Chord LoPro to show this connection at its best, I would call these the start of serious, high end performance on HDMI. The Calypso has a slightly better performance, but the LoPro's low profile design and ease of handling make this an excellent choice where spaced is tight and a discreet installation is demanded, regardless of whether I used a 720p or 1080p, both types of HD display performed superbly with these cables and I would happily recommend either of these cables either in a high end system if I was using a 720p display. Finally we come to the most expensive cables on test, WyreWizard and Nordost Silver Screen. To be completely honest, if I used a 720p display, either panel or projector, then I would buy the WyreWizard and be delighted as I felt that the increased cost of the Silver Screen did not give a sufficient improvement in quality, but at 1080p resolution both of these cables offered a sufficient improvement over the Black Rhodium and Chord justify their higher prices, but again the WyreWizard was so good that it actually makes the cost of the Silver Screen hard to justify, however if you demand the absolute ultimate performance from a 1080p source and display combination, then the Nordost Silver Screen is the one to go for. Personally I expect the WyreWizard to be on my shopping list for my projector in the near future, whilst the LoPro and Calypso will be welcomed as guests in my home for as long as I can hang onto them.

 

[PeterCH]

So my 42inch HD ready Pvision plasma has every slot under the sun other than HDMI slot. Am I able to use the HD PVR with this set or not?

No. You need an HDCP splitter like HD-Fury.
YES you can watch full HD signal too - even without an HDCP enabled set, with this thing.

http://www.hdfury.com/

With that you can connect any HDMI source (with HDCP or not) to your set and enjoy maximum resolution.