US politics general thread

[Pitbull]

He called for re introduction of death penalty for ALL murderers, and more policing as the city had become a haven for crime. He made reference to them yes, that being the current news outrage at the time

? And ? Was he a judge? Was he calling for trials and law to not take their coarse? Was the trial being skipped? Again, how do you connect 'bring back the death penatly' to 'no due process'?

Ie, who is saying, 'bring back the death penatly, without due process, just start executing people at will'? See what I'm asking?

You must understand what Cerebus is saying.

You get due-process and you get due-process. Similar to how you get guilty and guilty. It's all about creating a public opinion on a matter and then let the cards fall where they will. So guilty or not guilty doesn't make a difference as he's still guilty in the eyes of some in the public and thus life is ruined no matter what a court says.

But remember the difference between guilty and guilty.

 

[Pitbull]

Can you prove whether I shoplifted razor blades when I was at Uni?

No, nor can I prove you being innocent. That is why someone is innocent till proven guilty. That is how law works. According to your reasoning it's fine to assume you have stolen razor blades back then thus I can then use that to create an opinion on you. And deny you a job as an example because I, myself am convinced you stole those blades irrespective of what a court or investigation says.

 

[Emjay]

It isn't the law. Lack of evidence means that someone isn't necessarily guilty, but it's preposterous to suggest that it means they're innocent. Especially when there hasn't been a proper investigation. Can you prove whether I shoplifted razor blades when I was at Uni?

I can go to the police now and demand that they investigate you for killing babies. Because, you know, you are a baby killer, and I remember you making bad jokes about babies. I have no corroborating evidence, no bodies, no crime scene, no dates, etc. My friends however can come forward and testify that I told them you kill babies, and this should be labelled "witness testimony". And you should lose your job, friends, no longer be allowed any interaction with children and have everyone in your life (private and professional) made aware of the allegations, as you are not innocent because you cannot prove you are innocent.

Obligatory /s

 

[scudsucker]

I can go to the police now and demand that they investigate you for killing babies. Because, you know, you are a baby killer, and I remember you making bad jokes about babies. I have no corroborating evidence, no bodies, no crime scene, no dates, etc. My friends however can come forward and testify that I told them you kill babies, and this should be labelled "witness testimony". And you should lose your job, friends, no longer be allowed any interaction with children and have everyone in your life (private and professional) made aware of the allegations, as you are not innocent because you cannot prove you are innocent.

You could ask that an investigation is started into the allegations, which would either incriminate or exonerate the accused.

Wait... wasn't that what the "libtards" were asking for?





Edit - and a nice strawman there; the point is justice, not people losing their jobs or whatever other nonsense you feel is worthy of typing.

 

[Temujin]

You must understand what Cerebus is saying.

You get due-process and you get due-process. Similar to how you get guilty and guilty. It's all about creating a public opinion on a matter and then let the cards fall where they will. So guilty or not guilty doesn't make a difference as he's still guilty in the eyes of some in the public and thus life is ruined no matter what a court says.

But remember the difference between guilty and guilty.

I'm honestly trying to understand how people can read something, and add there own ending to it. If it were one person I'd say foff, but its multiple, I can't see the links between their 'claims', and their 'evidence'. So either I'm not being clear on what I'm asking(very possible, I'm very short with people), or missing something(even after reading all the articles they're parroting), or theres been some sort of mass brainwashing(doubtful, the collectives combined humanities courses wouldn't cover that) thats taken place and when they see for example 'hillary must go to jail', they honestly believe they're seeing 'without due process' on the end of it. I don't know /shrug

 

[scudsucker]

I'm honestly trying to understand how people can read something, and add there own ending to it.

I agree. Case in point:

I'm honestly trying to understand how people can read something, and add there own ending to it. If it were one person I'd say foff, but its multiple, I can't see the links between their 'claims', and their 'evidence'. So either I'm not being clear on what I'm asking(very possible, I'm very short with people), or missing something(even after reading all the articles they're parroting), or theres been some sort of mass brainwashing(doubtful, the collectives combined humanities courses wouldn't cover that) thats taken place and when they see for example 'hillary must go to jail', they honestly believe they're seeing 'without due process' on the end of it. I don't know /shrug

 

[Emjay]

Or.. you could ask that an investigation is started into the allegations, which would either incriminate or exonerate the accused.

Wait... wasn't that what the "libtards" were asking for?

I have never used the term "libtards", so please don't put words in my mouth.

My point is, only credible claims are fully investigated. Actually, I have a lot more points which I think were clear in my sarcastic monologue.

Do you believe that the GOP have ignored Swetnick and Ford? There is a lot more going on behind the scenes. Grassley has asked for more evidence from Ford's legal team, which would have been provided to the FBI as well (the therapy notes, and details of the polygraph), but they are refusing providing this information. There is also other evidence out now refuting some of Ford's testimony around her claustrophobia claims, which also talk to the reasons for her talking to her therapist and the timing around her coming out with these allegations. Grassley asked Ford's legal team (and I believe for some further information from Avenatti), as the Senate has far more powers than the FBI.

There was an investigation. The FBI found that there is no corroborating evidence for any of the claims. The sexual crimes prosecutor that questioned Ford even found that Ford's evidence does not even satisfy a 50/50 evidentiary requirement (one for a civil case), never mind any actual criminal activity.

Kavanaugh has a very strong defamation case against these women, that is how weak these claims are.

 

[scudsucker]

There was an "investigation".

It was by no means a complete investigation, and only occurred because the Republican's hand was forced.

Let's wait and see how the Kavanaugh defamation suits go.

I'm guessing, he will not start even one.

 

[Cray]

No interpretation, you even used Ford as an example in that post. When I pointed out that there is no case of tampering of evidence you claimed it to be hypothetical and asking me if I know what it means... Please show to me where I have been dishonest here? You should own up to the fact that you was referring to the Kavanaugh case and when I pointed out that there is no case, you cried.

Now you are telling me what I meant? I have stated the intent of my post, I clarified it yet you insist that you know better than I what I meant to say? I have no answer for this, If you cannot take my posts at face value then you are all but calling me a liar, in which case you have no desire for civil discourse and you are the troll that I took you for.

 

[cerebus]

He called for re introduction of death penalty for ALL murderers, and more policing as the city had become a haven for crime. He made reference to them yes, that being the current news outrage at the time

Rot and piss. He was calling for their execution.

I want to hate these muggers and murderers. They should be forced to suffer, and, when they kill, they should be executed for their crimes.

Here he is in 2014, doubling down on his ad despite them having been cleared and awarded an enormous settlement:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...al-park-settlement-disgrace-article-1.1838467

Here he is in 2016, reaffirming his belief that they were guilty despite all evidence to the contrary:

https://edition.cnn.com/2016/10/06/politics/reality-check-donald-trump-central-park-5/

The police doing the original investigation say they were guilty. The fact that that case was settled with so much evidence against them is outrageous. And the woman, so badly injured, will never be the same.

 

[Pitbull]

Now you are telling me what I meant? I have stated the intent of my post, I clarified it yet you insist that you know better than I what I meant to say? I have no answer for this, If you cannot take my posts at face value then you are all but calling me a liar, in which case you have no desire for civil discourse and you are the troll that I took you for.

O right, you talk about Kavanaugh/Ford and then didn't mean anything with regards to the tapering of evidence.

Edit: correction, your "destroying of evidence" was Hypothetical ...

Ok

 

[Emjay]

There was an "investigation".

It was by no means a complete investigation, and only occurred because the Republican's hand was forced.

Let's wait and see how the Kavanaugh defamation suits go.

I'm guessing, he will not start even one.

You, and others in this thread, will never be satisfied up until the point the Democrats have said "there is insufficient evidence". This will never happen, therefore you will never be convinced.

You and I both know Kavanaugh will not proceed with any civil claims as this will drive further sentiment against him. Don't be glib.

 

[greg0205]

In other news, Nikki Haley just resigned.

And?

Before someone shouts "Trump!", I am just going to leave this here:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1049807440592719872

Which Nikki Haley retweeted.

The thread is called "US politics general thread", so I'mma let you work that one out for yourself.

See my edit.

Well, if you could just point me to where I baselessly speculated on *why* she resigned, and not just posted that she *had* resigned as a statement of fact, I’ll happily engage with you. Mmkay?

I have never used the term "libtards", so please don't put words in my mouth.

Priceless lack of self awareness. Priceless I say!

 

[Pitbull]

There was an "investigation".

It was by no means a complete investigation, and only occurred because the Republican's hand was forced.

Let's wait and see how the Kavanaugh defamation suits go.

I'm guessing, he will not start even one.

And here it is again...

If Kavanaught don't institute defamation suit he is guilty!

 

[Temujin]

Rot and piss. He was calling for their execution.



Here he is in 2014, doubling down on his ad despite them having been cleared and awarded an enormous settlement:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...al-park-settlement-disgrace-article-1.1838467

Here he is in 2016, reaffirming his belief that they were guilty despite all evidence to the contrary:

https://edition.cnn.com/2016/10/06/politics/reality-check-donald-trump-central-park-5/

As per your quote, rot and piss

I want to hate these muggers and murderers. They should be forced to suffer, and, when they kill, they should be executed for their crimes.

Seeing what you want to see again... How does saying killers should be executed apply to the 5 who were not killers?
How was he 'calling for their execution.'? What has 'death penalty', 'executing murderers' got to do with the 5?

 

[scudsucker]

And here it is again...

If Kavanaught don't institute defamation suit he is guilty!

This is not an accurate reflection of my argument.

 

[Aquila ka Hecate]

Priceless lack of self awareness. Priceless I say!

Well I dunno - looks more like a priceless lack of joined-up thinking.

 

[Pitbull]

This is not an accurate reflection of my argument.

Yea, ofc not

 

[Emjay]

Priceless lack of self awareness. Priceless I say!

I make a snarky observation about your post, and that equals me calling everyone here libtards, without actually calling them libtards?

Yeah. I am just going to leave it at that.

 

[cerebus]

Seeing what you want to see again... How does saying killers should be executed apply to the 5 who were not killers?

Why do I persist in debating with people when I know perfectly well I'm not going to get an honest response? You're telling me in all honesty that you think he wasn't applying that sentence to the Central Park Five, who were the subject of the whole article?