Enough reason right there for me to stay away!
http://www.techworld.com/opsys/news/index.cfm?newsid=7675
http://www.techworld.com/opsys/news/index.cfm?newsid=7675
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Vista DRM
- Thread starter Syndyre
- Start date
doobiwan
Executive Member
First people complain that Windows is not secure enough, then when they harden it they b!tch that the security measures may affect performance.
Guess what? Security carries a performance penalty, you can't have both, so stop complaining.
The DRM effects discussed are also only in the presence of dodgy content, so unless you're a pirate or thief you have nothing to worry about.
Guess what? Security carries a performance penalty, you can't have both, so stop complaining.
The DRM effects discussed are also only in the presence of dodgy content, so unless you're a pirate or thief you have nothing to worry about.
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DRM in vista and this new high def "copy protection" system is seriously screwed up. Your basicaly going to havto buy new graphics cards, with specific drivers (no more unified sollutions like detonator etc because graphics cards are getting "finger printed" now). Not to mension if your graphics card is found to have some sort "security exploit" it will be permanently disabled untill/If a fix is found for the copy protection cercumvension. Not to mension that you'll need a new monitor also.
Security is one thing but advocates of DRM are shooting themselves in the foot. The next Media Disc battle is over and neither Blu-Ray nore HD-DVD won. Piracy has won due to user friendlyness.
Security is one thing but advocates of DRM are shooting themselves in the foot. The next Media Disc battle is over and neither Blu-Ray nore HD-DVD won. Piracy has won due to user friendlyness.
nthdimension
Senior Member
Bull****.
Funny how that only applies to MS. I wonder what the hardware requirements for routers and firewalls etc would be if they ran windows?
What a load of Crap-ola. Trying to remove and restrict my right to use my stuff the way I want and am entitled to is the real thievery going on.
RichardP
Banned
LOL! .. look at the other Operating systems.. there are others out there that are FAST and Secure.
The Question I have is... Who controls the DRM? Is there a Microsoft Certificate server? If yes, who secures the details in the database? Who can access it? Are your details for sale by MS ?
Look at the year in review... you will notice a ton of headlines saying "DRM a non-starter" - all due to Apple, Napster , Microsoft etc etc all making different systems ... and NONE are compatable. e.g. I buy a Music track using windows, and my iPod wont play it! (DRM incompatable)
R
lilDeath
Executive Member
The first part mentions nothing about DRM and then only later there is mention of DRM. This article isn't just about DRM.
Just don't make use of DRM material. Like RichardP mentions above, DRM aint the way to go.
It is more concerning that certain device channels are disabled or quality scaled down if it is found to be incompatible, it being required to be sent over secure channels and it cannot.
I think the vendors will do what is necessary to make sure the products will work. Or maybe even Vista SP1 is around the corner
Just don't make use of DRM material. Like RichardP mentions above, DRM aint the way to go.
It is more concerning that certain device channels are disabled or quality scaled down if it is found to be incompatible, it being required to be sent over secure channels and it cannot.
I think the vendors will do what is necessary to make sure the products will work. Or maybe even Vista SP1 is around the corner
It's pretty much about DRM right from the beginning.
This is what Microsoft has been doing instead of implementing useful features, like a database filesystem. None of these measures are of any benefit to the user, only as a means for the media industry to control users. The ultimate goal is to be able to sell you the same thing over and over.
This is what Microsoft has been doing instead of implementing useful features, like a database filesystem. None of these measures are of any benefit to the user, only as a means for the media industry to control users. The ultimate goal is to be able to sell you the same thing over and over.
let me just state that I think drm is evil.
however, I am in contact with folks at microsoft and none of them think it is a good idea either.
so, howcome does it exist in windows?
well, the media conglomerates say "we have this new standard, bluray/hddvd/whatever, and if you want to play it on your pc we REQUIRE this this this and that."
so, microsoft oblige, as they are not in a position right now to be the folks/operating system who cannot playback the new media.
sure, they could get on their high horses and refuse to implement the drm that the media houses require, but the amount of lost sales/potential damage is huge. people have got the ability to playback dvd's on our pc's, and we like it...so we want to playback the new stuff also. and windows will have to oblige.
however, I am in contact with folks at microsoft and none of them think it is a good idea either.
so, howcome does it exist in windows?
well, the media conglomerates say "we have this new standard, bluray/hddvd/whatever, and if you want to play it on your pc we REQUIRE this this this and that."
so, microsoft oblige, as they are not in a position right now to be the folks/operating system who cannot playback the new media.
sure, they could get on their high horses and refuse to implement the drm that the media houses require, but the amount of lost sales/potential damage is huge. people have got the ability to playback dvd's on our pc's, and we like it...so we want to playback the new stuff also. and windows will have to oblige.
Not really, Microsoft is probably in a more dominant position than the music labels/movie studios, if they refused to support DRM it would collapse pretty quickly.
Do yourself a favour and educate yourself. That way you will stop making a fool of yourself on a public forum.
Security and performance have nothing to do with each other. They are independent concepts and there is no relationship between them. So yes, you can have both and you have a right to both.
DRM's effects are about much more than dodgy content. DRM is about what you do with the media you purchase, what rights and uses you have over that media. DRM is about not being able to make a backup of the music you buy, not being able to play it on a different device, not being to play it on a different operating system - it is about not being in control of the purchase you executed.
Would you buy a car that would not allow you to open the bonnet? Would you buy a car that would not allow you to drive on non-approved roads? Would you buy a car that will not run if you install a non-approved sound system?
The answer to all of the above is an obvious no. In the case of DRM it is also should be no. The good news is that DRM is almost dead, Vista is going to come out trying to flog a dead horse. Consumers the world over have resisted DRM because they do not like it, since it is their money the DRM advocates want, they should listen to them. My gut feel is that in 2 years Microsoft will come out with a DRM free version of Vista.
that's what i thought initially too. unfortunately, the media guys got other outlets for their products. so they couldnt give two hoots if ms support them or not. however, the current vista+drm marriage works for both parties. whether the consumer is happy we will only find out once a critical mass of consumers have knowledge of drm and decide to resist.
For movies maybe, but if Vista were to e.g. not support iTunes DRM how long would it last? There aren't that many Macs out there,
RichardP
Banned
I like the new Vista look and feel... I just dont like what is under the bonet.
syndyre, in the context of vista the only new drm "features" are to do with hddvd and bluray and cablecard (there are a few more, but they arent important for this topic right now). we have already swallowed the itunes+playsforsure junk when we decided to use xp. so, i'm only talking in the bluray/hddvd context
The_Unbeliever
Honorary Master
Seconded.
Also, what about my right to make a backup copy of the expensive game I've just purchased?
Also, what about those kiddie DVD's which you'll need to make a backup as these scratch like nothing in the hands of kiddies... and then said kiddies go cry when their fave movie doesn't want to work anymore...
DRM is restricting MY rights, while giving the pigopolists a licence to print money.
Pirates and thieves will find ways and means of bypassing DRM and copy-protection schemes, leading to more grief and sadness for us honest people.
Case in point - I recently purchased Evil Genius - which refused to work on my system because of the secuROM copyprotection scheme.
Switching Evil Genius to Win2k mode solved the problem.
DRM is the worst idea ever.
lilDeath
Executive Member
Have to disagree. The 2 are directly linked in that performance is affected when more and more security overhead is added / enabled.
Like I said, Vista SP1
I disagree, but let me clarify. I mean security in terms of an OS which is robust and not full of bad programming techniques, hence it has very few exploits. This has nothing to do with performance but with design and construction techniques.
I agree with you on DRM, but that in my mind is not security. The fact that the video output for premium content is encrypted does not make the OS secure, it does not protect the consumer from malware, viruses, trojans, spyware and the like. All it does is allow the content owner to control content distribution at a fine grained level.
Last time I checked, this is NOT what consumers where crying out for. They asked for security against malware, viruses, trojans, spyware and the like - this type of security affects performance in a negligable manner.
WRT Vista SP1 DRM Free, I agree with you, I would even go out on a limb and suggest that Linux might even gain a bit more of a foothold in the desktop market thanks to Vista. I think the consumer backlash against this OS is going to teach MS a lesson they will never forget.