Will you stick with Whatsapp?

[newby_investor]

Moxie is currently the reason Signal makes the most ridiculous claims and decisions as to why the service can't be taken seriously for many privacy activists, instead of letting true contributions flourish with good ideas, and there might be underlying reasons for them in the long run but we'll have to wait and see.

Citation needed. I don't necessarily agree with Marlinspike's every opinion, but he's certainly not stupid. Brian Acton on the show also lends a bit of a hand.

Exactly for that reason. I'm not conspiracy theorising, but how long would it take for him to sell out, same as Whatsapp does. He may well be hailed as the best for now, but history shows that these guys eventually end up "partnered" with someone. Signal was relatively unknown to the general public until whatsapp's ridiculous way of announcing their plans which caused a public outcry. That puts them in the spotlight and therefore garners attention from major corps.

The Signal Foundation is registered as a non-profit, and can't legally "sell out". It could in principle close down and have the developers (Marlinspike included) go and work somewhere else for more money.

But he's already turned down lots of money elsewhere in order to do what he's currently doing. I don't think there's a risk of that happening very soon.

But then - it's all open-source. It's all on github. You could probably host a Signal-esque server on your home fibre connection if you were bothered to try and set it up.

 

[Crumbl0x]

Citation needed. I don't necessarily agree with Marlinspike's every opinion, but he's certainly not stupid. Brian Acton on the show also lends a bit of a hand.


The Signal Foundation is registered as a non-profit, and can't legally "sell out". It could in principle close down and have the developers (Marlinspike included) go and work somewhere else for more money.

But he's already turned down lots of money elsewhere in order to do what he's currently doing. I don't think there's a risk of that happening very soon.

But then - it's all open-source. It's all on github. You could probably host a Signal-esque server on your home fibre connection if you were bothered to try and set it up.

Reflections: The ecosystem is moving

At Open Whisper Systems, we’ve been developing open source “consumer-facing” software forthe past four years. We want to share some of the things we’ve learned while doing it.As a software developer, I envy writers, musicians, and filmmakers. Unlike software, whenthey create something, it is re...

signal.org

GitHub - LibreSignal/LibreSignal: LibreSignal • The truly private and Google-Free messenger for Android.

LibreSignal • The truly private and Google-Free messenger for Android. - LibreSignal/LibreSignal

github.com

First source, the most utterly ridiculous reasoning for not embracing decentralized services and federation, and forgoes MITM intrusions, your goverment blocking access outright and reproducible integrity as well as scaling effectively without a central bottleneck. It also doesn't help that their server relies on third parties that may track metadata on their own accord:

The case against Signal

With WhatsApp changing its privacy policy, Signal has been getting a lot of attention over the past few days.

xiu.io

Second source is proof enough to show that Signal does not like anyone forking their software outright to use their own infrastructure with, or use in tandem with the main deployed server.

My main issue is that Signal / Moxie prouds themselves on being FOSS, when in reality they are only OSS, with a "look but don't touch" attitude, where valued inputs and pull requests are usually rejected if the vision doesn't suit the bill, instead of basic argumention taking place. Starting a new project from the base would be a waste of time as a result, as support would be constricted, and stuff like Session is just crypto scheming again.

I've already responded above how the non-profit motif can be a façade if the record books aren't publically available for scrutiny, and it only defends them from being bought outright, not to secretly acquire profits from the main, closed source binaries on the app stores.

Finally don't get me wrong, as a centralised, secure chatting application, it's hands down the best you can get, and I hope they keep morals and vision in check for as long as possible, but one shouldn't make the mistake (you didn't) of claiming it's the ultimate form. They've still got a long way to go before becoming peak-optimal and I'd most definitely welcome drastic changes they employ in the future.

 

[newby_investor]

Finally don't get me wrong, as a centralised, secure chatting application, it's hands down the best you can get, and I hope they keep morals and vision in check for as long as possible, but one shouldn't make the mistake (you didn't) of claiming it's the ultimate form. They've still got a long way to go before becoming peak-optimal and I'd most definitely welcome drastic changes they employ in the future.

I mean you're not wrong about a lot of what you say (though I think some things you have read a bit out of context), but I think this comes down to a difference of opinions as to what is important and what isn't. I don't really think this is the place to debate all the finer points you make, but I will say this:

The way that I understand The Signal Foundation's priorities is to give an excellent level of privacy to the general public in a format that they are able to use conveniently. They even have some high-profile users such as the Democratic National Convention, and endorsements from Edward Snowden, Bruce Schneier and others.

Some of us nerds might get a kick out of doing nerdy things, but most folks don't want to self-host a federated Matrix server, or attend key-signing parties, or wear tinfoil hats. They just want to be able to message their friends.

I think Signal strikes the best balance there. Very, very good security but still accessible for people who just want to get on with their lives.

I have come to believe that there is no "ultimate form" of secure, private communication in this day and age. Everything is a compromise. But having everyone on Signal (and donating a bit towards the costs) would be a hell of a lot better than having everyone on Facebook Messenger, while there's this super-duper-ultra-app that is so secure but it's irrelevant because most people refuse to go to the trouble to use it.

 

[vmessa786]

From February Whatsapp users will be presented with a choice... agree to share their data with the Facebook et al, or stop using Whatsapp. What are your plans? Will you stop using WhatsApp, or does it not concern you? Will you seek out an alternative or have you found one already?

which company in the world doesnt have our data, from banking apps, to delivery to credit records, you name it we are all in the data world!

 

[borjah]

Yes - I have no concerns/I don't care​

 

[My Dog Charlie]

Going to use Signal for the majority of my messages, but will require to keep WA going in the back ground until all my contacts has seen the light.

 

[redspark]

Forced to use WhatsApp (for now) due to school comms, parents group, etc Ideally, I would like to move to Signal or Telegram.

 

[phLOx]

Your whatsapp usage data has been shared with the facebook group since 2014. You simply didn't get a notice asking you to know and accept this change before now.

 

[pinball wizard]

Deleted my WA account this morning. Not just the app, the entire thing, backup all of it, gone.

 

[pinball wizard]

Forced to use WhatsApp (for now) due to school comms, parents group, etc Ideally, I would like to move to Signal or Telegram.

Yeah, I am/was on a bunch of WA groups. I figure now I'm free of WA, I'll just have to make do without those groups. I mean, I was alive before them, right, I'll somehow carry on without them now.

 

[Maximar]

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