Outrageous cellphone fees on the cards

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Hexsist

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I've been browsing the net this week and managed to find something rather paculiar about Vodacom. It's Regarding Possible exorbitant price tags 4 using vodacom data services - It's an interview from "Radio702- The world at Six"
Here you go : http://business.iafrica.com/transcripts/397547.htm



Please Respond Vodacom3G
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This has been publicised before with MTN, first I've heard about it from Vodacom, at the moment they're not implementing it, not sure whether they have the technology to do the packet sniffing at this stage. There'll always be a way around it anyway, e.g. if you're using Skype from your laptop you could make a VPN connection to your computer at home and run the connection over that.
 
The fee for VOIP data is insane. Thats the end of story.
 
I wonder if any of our phone companys will ever lower their rates, or ever give us more value for money, even if we get 10 new networks. I mean not vodacom or mtn lowered their data rate of R2/meg even when virgin came up with 50cents per meg. Telcom never upgraded their service even when cellular companys started in SA, they even got worse. When will someone come up with an idea on how to stand up against this people?
 
If Virgin offered a similar level of service to them they'd probably be forced to lower their rates, unfortunately they don't so the other companies are safe for now.
 
For Vodacom and MTN to be publishing those rates they'd have to have been approved by ICASA so apparently not.
 
To me skype data and the data I am sending while posting this look exactly the same and have exactly the same impact on the network ... there must be some sort of legal leg consumers can stand on with this issue?
 
I would strongly suggest Bruce Whitfield and Aki Anastasiou get their facts rights and check up on the actual situation before they start making false assumptions and getting everyone up in arms.

This topic was widely discussed on this forum more than a year ago. They should rather come here for definitive answers, rather than using retail shop sales people (or rather overhearing them) as authorative sources of information!

Firstly, this is not something new, now suddenly introduced because the mobile operators are getting worried about revenues. The reality is that these tariffs were lodged before the 3G service even launched and at a time when VoIP was just made legal. No one had any idea at that time (two years ago) what the VoIP world would look like, so Vodacom lodged a R10/M rate and MTN followed with a R25/M rate. I can't speak for MTN, but Vodacom is not charging these rates.

I would suggest Aki check up on this instead of quoting another journo (Goldstucks) who obviously also did not do his homework.

Secondly, using a conversation eavesdropped on in a retail shop does not constitute investigative journalism and we all know the kind of info that can come from these shops!

Thirdly, even thought Dot Field told him these rates are not in use (although lodged), they seem to still think Vodacom is going to charge these rates. On what is this assumption based? Vodacom have made no statements to the effect.

Lastly, we do track all VoIP calls, and can even look inside Skype if we want to, got some fancy sniffers for this, but don't do it. The policy have always been to not shape data of any sort and this will be the policy for as long as possible
 
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vodacom3g said:
Thirdly, even thought Dot Field told him these rates are not in use (although lodged), they seem to still think Vodacom is going to charge these rates. On what is this assumption based? Vodacom have made no statements to the effect.
Click to expand...

Would Vodacom be prepared to make a statement that they view all data traffic as just data and have no plans to apply differential charging or shaping based on the protocol or purpose of the data transfer and as such will no longer lodge tariffs with ICASA that allow for such a policy? I know its probably not your role to make such policies, just asking.

vodacom3g said:
Lastly, we do track all VoIP calls, and can even look inside Skype if we want to, got some fancy sniffers for this, but don't do it. The policy have always been to not shape data of any sort and this will be the policy for as long as possible
Click to expand...

Be careful, you'll get the conspiracy theorists going again. :D What do you mean, look inside Skype anyway? I assume that doesn't mean breaking the encryption to hear the actual conversation?
 
V3G, clearly this is something that touches a chord with you (as it should with any loyal employee). If I may offer a perspective which you may not be taking into consideration here-

There is a general consumer mistrust of telecos the world over, and SA is of course no exception. Confusing marketing, misleading statements, and what could be described as a generalised unresponsiveness all serve to benefit telecoms companies. These actions benefit a teleco in that they unquestionably increase revenue. But, as a side effect, it is patently obvious that within such actions the seed of mistrust is planted and unwittingly nurtured.

Mistrust comes to fruition in the form of what we see here with The World At Six. Consumers have been burnt before, over and over and over. Thus, is what we see here any wonder?

My opinion on this can best be formulated into a question which I'd like to put to you:

Poor-quality journalism aside, does Vodacom shoulder any responsibility here?
 
Personally I think out of all the Telcos in South Africa Vodacom have, up to now anyway, probably been the least misleading and gone out of their way to help their customers in some instances too, e.g. offering a free HSPDA card swop when that was launched. Sure they're not perfect but generally they don't seem to be doing too badly, especially compared to other companies.
 
Syndyre, I would definitely agree with your sentiment that Vodacom is 'less misleading' (by local and international standards). However, I stand by my point of view that telecos create these problems for themselves.

I'm sure I could dig up numerous deceptive adverts, statements and information officially propagated by Vodacom, if needs be.
 
I'm sure you could, I just meant on a comparative basis. I actually find Virgin to be more misleading than most despite their promises to cut out the fine print and complications etc.
 
http://business.iafrica.com/transcripts/397547.htm

Bruce Whitfield:
So you have been onto the websites of Vodacom and of MTN and what have you found?

Aki Anastasiou:
Absolutely, I found that the tariff charges are quite expensive. Firstly, I found that on the MTN website, I have noticed that there is an addition to their terms and conditions and it says here, please note, that these tariffs in the MTN GPRS, edge or 3G technology may not be used to transfer or generate voice over internet protocol VOIP traffic. Should it be found that VOIP traffic is carried over the MTN network using these tariffs or technologies, MTN reserves the right to cancel the agreement that you have with MTN with immediate effect.

...

There is a normal per megabyte rate for MTN for example, if you don’t have a bundle which is two rand per megabyte when you use it for voice over IP, they want to charge 25 rand per megabyte. Vodacom is 1.50 per megabyte if you don’t have a contract, what they call out of bundle, but the moment it is a voice over IP call, and they can detect that, they are going to charge you 10 rand per megabyte, which is quite outrageous. It is an example for contempt for the consumers, the moment the consumer tries to save a few cents, they find ways to load the costs onto a consumer”

Bruce Whitfield:
An unhappy Arthur Goldstuck and one sms coming through saying it is another way the two big operators milk the consumer and that is what Arthur Goldstuck was saying a moment ago. Aki, is this a dead cert? If I start making voice over internet protocol calls using 3G on my cell phone, am I going to be landed with an enormous bill at the end of this month?

Aki Anastasiou:
I called Dot Field from Vodacom earlier, she says it is on their rate card, but they are not necessarily charging for it yet. My question is, why have MTN got it on their website and why have Vodacom got it on their charge sheet even though they are not charging you yet, we don’t know, but why is it there?
Click to expand...
More wonderful inventions from the country that has introduced port shaping and 3rd world bandwidth cap as a standard.
 
vodacom3g said:
... No one had any idea at that time (two years ago) what the VoIP world would look like, so Vodacom lodged a R10/M rate and MTN followed with a R25/M rate. I can't speak for MTN, but Vodacom is not charging these rates.

...Lastly, we do track all VoIP calls, and can even look inside Skype if we want to, got some fancy sniffers for this, but don't do it. The policy have always been to not shape data of any sort and this will be the policy for as long as possible
Click to expand...

The fact that Vodacom has a policy in place with regards to VOIP pricing even though it is not being implemented does present the possibility that it could come into effect in future:rolleyes:
 
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