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Question of the Day: If you were buying a TV today, which brand would you choose?
Obeying Microsoft: Is wine the way?
- Thread starter rpm
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LCBXX
Honorary Master
IMO, you can bitch all you like about how dumbass Microsoft allegedly is etc.
If you want to go all rebellious and load a Linux-based OS instead of Windows (I'm using Linux as and example), you have to be content with the limitations that comes with such a decision. To date you could have wangled around those limitations and get apps from MSoft to run as you needed, albeit slow and emulated. But that was OK, since you got rid of "Turd Gates's creaky, buggy, hack-magnet OS".
Don't hate Microsoft because its now starting to tighten its grip on the market. Linux fanboys always brag about how their OS is light-years ahead etc. Why not make a Linux version of, for example, MS Visio?
Oh...could it be that development of such and application "might" cost millions of Dollars/Rands? That simple technicality would result in Linux users having to start paying premiums for software, just like us so-called "dumbass Micorsoft tiffys" have to. And with that goes lekker open-source out the door as well since your Linux-Visio developers want to protect their software, as well as be able to offer constant support for one flavor application...and make the installment on their new Merc SL55AMG's.
P.S: I'm sure if Apple stops wasting money on marketing their Workstations against anything that runs Windows, they might try to forge a licensing partnership with Microsoft to get MS business Apps for Mac OS. I have no issues with Mac's; they are awesome machines for particularly graphics, but I feel Steve Dobbs is focusing too much on his I-Range of devices (IPOD, IPhone etc) that he as forgotten about his devoted Mac desktop users.
If you want to go all rebellious and load a Linux-based OS instead of Windows (I'm using Linux as and example), you have to be content with the limitations that comes with such a decision. To date you could have wangled around those limitations and get apps from MSoft to run as you needed, albeit slow and emulated. But that was OK, since you got rid of "Turd Gates's creaky, buggy, hack-magnet OS".
Don't hate Microsoft because its now starting to tighten its grip on the market. Linux fanboys always brag about how their OS is light-years ahead etc. Why not make a Linux version of, for example, MS Visio?
Oh...could it be that development of such and application "might" cost millions of Dollars/Rands? That simple technicality would result in Linux users having to start paying premiums for software, just like us so-called "dumbass Micorsoft tiffys" have to. And with that goes lekker open-source out the door as well since your Linux-Visio developers want to protect their software, as well as be able to offer constant support for one flavor application...and make the installment on their new Merc SL55AMG's.
P.S: I'm sure if Apple stops wasting money on marketing their Workstations against anything that runs Windows, they might try to forge a licensing partnership with Microsoft to get MS business Apps for Mac OS. I have no issues with Mac's; they are awesome machines for particularly graphics, but I feel Steve Dobbs is focusing too much on his I-Range of devices (IPOD, IPhone etc) that he as forgotten about his devoted Mac desktop users.
bekdik
Honorary Master
The option of Unix and more lately Linux has been there for something like 20 years.
That option has, in the main, not been taken.
The business comunity, who are not stupid and who have to pay the biggest bucks have voted with their feet.
So, I guess, democracy rules.
That option has, in the main, not been taken.
The business comunity, who are not stupid and who have to pay the biggest bucks have voted with their feet.
So, I guess, democracy rules.
Xarog
Honorary Master
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Funny how the OS is open source, but the programs running ON it don't have to be. Unless you're suggesting piracy, and unless I'm very much mistaken, a Linux user will be paying the same premium to use Visio on his Linux system.
So yeah, maybe you should check your facts before you put your foot in your mouth.
Little trip in to O/T land but we need to get out of this mindset - IMO when you refer to a "Mac" these days its hardware with a side dish of operating system because these days Mac's run OsX, Windows, Linux, etc either natively or virtualised.
As for focusing on 'i' devices instead of computers well that simply isnt true. They may have taken 'computer' out of the name but thats because they are expanding into other areas without detriment to the computer side.
Whether M$oft likes it or not if I had to run vista it would be the cheap version and it would be virtualised
Well, I made the switch about a year ago
I think that the article is spot-on. I switched from Win2k to Ubuntu about a year ago. I run lots of Windows apps using Wine and haven't really had any problems.
The only real restriction is that I can't always play the latest games. I have to wait about 6 months until Wine catches up. Not really a big deal though.
I think that the article is spot-on. I switched from Win2k to Ubuntu about a year ago. I run lots of Windows apps using Wine and haven't really had any problems.
The only real restriction is that I can't always play the latest games. I have to wait about 6 months until Wine catches up. Not really a big deal though.
You mean like Dia? Maybe not as polished as Visio, but you can get the basics done without a problem. You can even import some of the Visio diagrams (after exporting it as .vxd files).
Linux mostly have a solution for almost every commercial product. Having the source of that application means, you can assist in making it better.
LCBXX
Honorary Master
I'm not trying to trample toes here. The point I'm making is that any OS alternative to Windows only appeals to enthusiasts at the moment.
As mentioned by bekdik, the option to chose something other than Windows has always been there, yet the Business Community have no taken up on the opportunity. And there is a reason for that is simply the fact that competitors like Apple and all the Linux flavors have simply not offered what Microsoft could.
I read an article the other day that all the Linux developers are so caught up in the struggle for space in the market that their are actually competing with one another, instead of against the dominant forces.
People don't want a revolution when it comes to OS's or Apps, nor do they want to compromise. Look at what Mozilla did with Firefox - it didn't revolutionize the way the web is browsed; it simply did a "Microsoft", taking a already great idea and refining it so such an extent that Microsoft went and copied many of its features with IE7.
Will I ever load a Linux-based OS? Probably not. It's like those cars from Korea, Malaysia and China: Proton, Hyundai, Kia, etc. Sure, they have wheels and engines and all the bells and whistles a European and Japanese car has, but the fact remains; they are not European or Japanese. And, ironically, the top execs and achievers in those countries don't want Kia's or Chanas; they want Mercs/BMWs/Audi/VW/Lexus/etc.
And that bring me back to bekdik's post:
As mentioned by bekdik, the option to chose something other than Windows has always been there, yet the Business Community have no taken up on the opportunity. And there is a reason for that is simply the fact that competitors like Apple and all the Linux flavors have simply not offered what Microsoft could.
I read an article the other day that all the Linux developers are so caught up in the struggle for space in the market that their are actually competing with one another, instead of against the dominant forces.
People don't want a revolution when it comes to OS's or Apps, nor do they want to compromise. Look at what Mozilla did with Firefox - it didn't revolutionize the way the web is browsed; it simply did a "Microsoft", taking a already great idea and refining it so such an extent that Microsoft went and copied many of its features with IE7.
Will I ever load a Linux-based OS? Probably not. It's like those cars from Korea, Malaysia and China: Proton, Hyundai, Kia, etc. Sure, they have wheels and engines and all the bells and whistles a European and Japanese car has, but the fact remains; they are not European or Japanese. And, ironically, the top execs and achievers in those countries don't want Kia's or Chanas; they want Mercs/BMWs/Audi/VW/Lexus/etc.
And that bring me back to bekdik's post:
kilps
Expert Member
The amazing thing is that my wireless and system in general is far more reliable than people I know who run Windows - quite honestly, linux for me is far more reliable and does everything almost just as easily
Obviously there is still room for improvement - but if you want to see were things are going try Ubuntu - just make sure you install network-manager and all your video and audio codecs ... and try beryl - desktop effects more impressive than os x and vista put together
Obviously there is still room for improvement - but if you want to see were things are going try Ubuntu - just make sure you install network-manager and all your video and audio codecs ... and try beryl - desktop effects more impressive than os x and vista put together
diabolus
Executive Member
I agree with Icbxx's sentiment there. If you change OS to get away from Microsoft and then complain because Microsoft don't port their software to your new OS , don't complain about Microsoft..complain to whoever is maintaining your new OS. If it's Apple, complain to THEM for not having a MS Visio equivalent.
You missed the part where Microsoft put a little part on all their boxes in existence . "Requirements: MS Windows [version] and above" . Show me where it says "Runs on Linux!" ANYWHERE on MS Products. It's common sense for MS to optimize and develop their software to run on "their" OS and not -wanting- you to use it somewhere else, Windows is after all a cashcow.
There's a bunch of Linux apps that doesn't run on MS either...should i start sending hate mail to Linus Torvalds? or Mark Shuttleworth?
I used Wine on Linux when i was very anti-MS , i got over it [too much hassles, nothing works 100%]...I also don't see why on earth people want to run a "virtual" Windows inside Linux to use Visio anyway..i am at loss for words. That's like purposely making your OS super slow so you can run two on top of each other...Windows is not THAT bad alone. You have to pay for
for Windows anyway if you do that....
EDIT: Of course if you are developing and testing your software [which must run on MS OS], different story....but why do that ? MS isn't doing it for Linux
Xarog said:
You missed the part where Microsoft put a little part on all their boxes in existence . "Requirements: MS Windows [version] and above" . Show me where it says "Runs on Linux!" ANYWHERE on MS Products. It's common sense for MS to optimize and develop their software to run on "their" OS and not -wanting- you to use it somewhere else, Windows is after all a cashcow.
There's a bunch of Linux apps that doesn't run on MS either...should i start sending hate mail to Linus Torvalds? or Mark Shuttleworth?
I used Wine on Linux when i was very anti-MS , i got over it [too much hassles, nothing works 100%]...I also don't see why on earth people want to run a "virtual" Windows inside Linux to use Visio anyway..i am at loss for words. That's like purposely making your OS super slow so you can run two on top of each other...Windows is not THAT bad alone
. You have to pay for for Windows anyway if you do that....
EDIT: Of course if you are developing and testing your software [which must run on MS OS], different story....but why do that ? MS isn't doing it for Linux
Last edited:
Googlesque
Or just go the Google route where we get most applications to work in the online environmnet.
The Visio equivalent is here:
http://www.gliffy.com/
Or just go the Google route where we get most applications to work in the online environmnet.
The Visio equivalent is here:
http://www.gliffy.com/
devnull
Well-Known Member
virtualisation is the way of the future. you don't want microsoft running your grid/blade/cluster/peta storage system. its weak, unreliable, inflexible and much more expensive. but you do want windows on the desktop for your technophobe users. so linux backend providing virtual windows desktops, the way to go.