Afrihost ISPA ruling upheld

MagicDude4Eva said:
From my records ISPA dealt with about 200 COCs in the past two years.
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I wonder who the other 198 were ... :)

MagicDude4Eva said:
TBH - none of the consumer organisations have either the willpower or legal power to process compliance violations against companies (think ISPA, ICASA, CPA, NCR, FICA, RICA and very soon POPI)
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+1

Well done so far, MagicDude4Eva! Seems you and I are constantly testing the same theoretical protections we have. ;)

I really wonder why nobody has been ever prosecuted under Sect 45 of the ECT Act? It's not as if there hasn't been formal charges (Incidentally the ECT Act was used as defence by none other than ISPA - Kettler vs ISPA, Hall of Shame). I notice one of the ex-ISPA office bearers also got edgy with the spammer Web9.co.za earlier this year ;)

I wonder how the OOB shark came about? It's not as if people have not complained using the channels.

I wonder how bandwidth can disappear (SIM card in device that is off, locked away, people on leave).

Personally I can vouch for the ISPA processes, they work. Apart from the CoC complaint procedure, I've tested the take-down procedure against a seminar spammer not responding to ECT Act Sect 45 requests. Yet understand what's possible for ISPA and what's not, what in ISPA's remit and what not.

Not being affiliated with ISPA, I can independently vouch that ISPA really wishes to look out for us. But we have to trust them and give them a chance.

Likewise I also tested the WASPA processes a few year back. Needless to say a certain Spanish provider that tried accusing me of libel (I said they were manufacturing records) was not so happy. I was proven right.

Here is the thing, as MagicDude4Eva said: Many experienced the same problem and we only have to look at the forums. Yet it took so long until somebody complained. It makes you wonder if some consumers actually enjoy being bent over a barrel?
 
You might recall that I appealed ISPA's adjudicator's initial ruling and I am satisfied with the final findings from ISPA (hat off to ISPA for the detailed explanation)

You should read the report in it's entirety and while I am personally not happy with the fines issued, I do think ISPA covered the ethics and conduct of Afrihost:

The member has acknowledged that its DSL services, including its Business Uncapped DSL service, did not perform at these advertised levels over an extended period of time during 2014 and 2015.
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The member may not have communicated immediately on becoming aware of the technical issues it was experiencing, but the panel is prepared to accept the member’s explanation that it required time to investigate and gain a better understanding of the problems before it communicated with its customers.
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The member should have immediately stopped promoting its services at the advertised levels and standards stated on its website to new customers, and some form of reasonable refund should have been offered to its existing customers
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The panel is also of the view that the member has used exaggeration, innuendo or ambiguity to advertise its Business Uncapped DSL service on its website in a manner which may be misleading.
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View attachment coc.875.appeal.dismissed_.pdf
 
The member is fined the following amounts, which are payable immediately to
the ISPA Management Committee on receipt of this report:
34.3.1 The sum of R24 000.00 for its breach of clause 7 of the ISPA Code;
and
34.3.2 The sum of R6 000.00 for its breach of clause 9 of the ISPA Code.
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Thirty gorillas .....

Hats off to the OP for standing his ground.
 
Well done, and interesting ruling...

There are a lot of references to customerS - i.e. not explicitly the complainant.

I'm wondering now - based on this ruling by the ISPA, how would this open a can of worms for AH in terms of other customerS lodging complaints for refunds? As I read parts of the ruling, AH should have refunded, whether complaints was lodged or not....
 
savage said:
Well done, and interesting ruling...

There are a lot of references to customerS - i.e. not explicitly the complainant.

I'm wondering now - based on this ruling by the ISPA, how would this open a can of worms for AH in terms of other customerS lodging complaints for refunds? As I read parts of the ruling, AH should have refunded, whether complaints was lodged or not....
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The only problem I have with the whole complaint is that the initial ruling from ISPA took until end of September. I then lodged the appeal to the ruling as I believed that not all my issues had been covered by the adjudicator and it took then from November until now to come up with the final result.

Although ISPA has done a very good job in all of it, one should not forget that a lot of time had lapsed when I raised the issue with ISPA in June 2015. By then consumers had already been affected by the AH issues for more than a year (since Aug 2014). You can read between the lines of where ISPA quotes Afrihost that AH has denied any wrong-doing and felt that it was sufficient that they offered me a refund (they did not do the same for many other customers). There was also the lack of transparency and AH made the excuse that "it was all over the media". I do think that the fine is inadequate, but I do understand that ISPA issued the maximum fine per breached CoC. The interesting part is that the first ruling is still upheld and I could have challenged AH on the first ruling even during 2016, but I felt it would be unethical as I am not a customer of AH anymore.

While I do think that there are hardworking people at AH, I equally feel that the company (especially from the top down) is lacking a moral compass and is not the same transparent, honest company I used to know from back in 2012. I would have preferred a honest and sincere apology over anything else, but that has actually never come from anyone at the company (and sadly recent unrelated support issues with AH show the same arrogant and condescending attitude).

Although I hoped that the ISPA complaint would change behaviour and "realign AH's moral compass", this has not happened and companies like them will continue operating the way they do - after all, they did not even incur any financial losses, as most of the customers complaining on MyBB stuck it out well into late 2015 (and were "ecstatic" about the occasional bandwidth freebee).
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
Although I hoped that the ISPA complaint would change behaviour and "realign AH's moral compass", this has not happened and companies like them will continue operating the way they do - after all, they did not even incur any financial losses, as most of the customers complaining on MyBB stuck it out well into late 2015 (and were "ecstatic" about the occasional bandwidth freebee).
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Exactly. And "bandwidth freebies" means nothing to uncapped customers - whom suffered JUST as much as capped users. But yes, there's definitely a "I don't give a f..." attitude from them, and it more than likely has to do with the fact that they have more customers than what is good for them.

I am busy with them at the NCC (National Consumer Commission) as well - separate issue not related to this.
 
FWIW - there seems to be some misunderstanding that Afrihost can appeal this ruling. This is not the case. The ISPA complaints process is complete with the scenario where:
1) I lodged the complaint in June 2015 and Afrihost was afforded time to respond.
2) ISPA published the ruling in September 2015 and complainant (me) and member (Afrihost) had the opportunity to appeal/respond
3) Afrihost decided not to appeal in the 30 day period
4) I appealed the ISPA ruling by November 2015 as I felt that aspects of my original complaint had not been ruled correctly by the adjudicator
5) ISPA informed kept me in the loop from December onwards
6) ISPA obviously asked Afrihost to respond to my appeal
7) ISPA made the final ruling this month

This is the end of the ISPA complaints process as it reached the Appeals Panel and you can not appeal an appeal (doh) - par 14 of the ISPA complaints procedure:
A complaint can only be appealed once to the Management Committee. If the Management Committee rejects an appeal, that is the end of this procedure.
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It is also not true what some Afrihost-members said that I appealed because I was seeking a "harsher" sentence. I appealed because I disagreed with the ruling of the adjudicator on clauses 6, 7 and 9. I am satisfied that ISPA overturned the ruling of the adjudicator for 7 and 9.

I could not make a strong enough case for 6 (AUP) when I appealed in November 2015, as I had had lost a portion of my AUP evidence (I stupidly deleted PDFs which served as archives of the various T&Cs) and webarchive did not help me to recover it. Due to that mishap, I knew that appealing clause 6 and having it overturned would have been a stretch. No train-smash, as I am sure AH knows that they wronged in clause 6 as well since April 2014 (you will know why this date is significant).

It was never about punishing Afrihost (if I wanted that, I would have dragged them through a civil case and would have won), but to show consumers that it is very well possibly to use existing frameworks to highlight that companies can not act irresponsible and remain untouchable.
 
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MagicDude4Eva said:
/Snip
Although I hoped that the ISPA complaint would change behaviour and "realign AH's moral compass", this has not happened and companies like them will continue operating the way they do - after all, they did not even incur any financial losses, as most of the customers complaining on MyBB stuck it out well into late 2015 (and were "ecstatic" about the occasional bandwidth freebee).
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Congratulations with your victory. :)

It is however unfair to say that a company is incapable of change. Did you know that uncapped customers didn't receive bandwidth freebees and that they were the ones who mostly complained?
 
LaraC said:
Congratulations with your victory. :)

It is however unfair to say that a company is incapable of change. Did you know that uncapped customers didn't receive bandwidth freebees and that they were the ones who mostly complained?
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Did you know that Business Uncapped users (like myself) lost a ton of business during that period? My wife alone had two design-projects cancelled because she could not dropbox her proofs to a client.

Afrihost was very well aware of all the issues since August 2014 and then continued to blame everything and everyone for the various problems. It was either IPC or then it was some "mysterious" bug in some "high-end" device which required some unnamed consultants to fly in and fix (let's not forget that those "high-end devices" have been used by their competitors for years. In the end it turned out to be poor network architecture and design and although not directly mentioned, indirectly MTN was blamed for all of it.

When you look back at the company's conduct since 2014, absolutely nothing has changed (literally 4 weeks ago I had to deal with this level of incompetence).

So honestly, it is highly unprofessional for any company to treat their customers like idiots, patronise them and lie to them. While I appreciate that everyone makes mistakes (myself included), I expect at least to own up to it and be sincere and honest about it. AH has not demonstrated that level of maturity and it is deeply entrenched within their company culture (with a few exceptions of hard-working engineers who will have to shut up and knuckle down when told). Do yourself a favour and read the Disqus comments of the AH rep on this article - seems to be a big laugh for everyone and reflects exactly my sentiment about the company which will never have their customers back when it counts.
 
Some are just born more delusional; exceedingly gullible.

If only more did what M4eva did. There is quite a few entities here in needing of a good spanking.
 
LaraC said:
Congratulations with your victory. :)

It is however unfair to say that a company is incapable of change. Did you know that uncapped customers didn't receive bandwidth freebees and that they were the ones who mostly complained?
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Business uncapped customer here, got nothing but excuses for the entire problem period.
 
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