Afrihost Uncapped ADSL Feedback (Pt2)

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Smokey_sa said:
Well I can't jusge the eintire night, seeing that I was in bed for a protion of it. But what I can say is that every time I check my shaping it is at 12.5/6.25 for days now.

I did 130 Gb lst month on a 10 Mbit line.

Seeing that I must assume that I am concidered a download power user. Futhermore the ones doing 3 TB most have lost their connection entirely as it was mentioned that the shaping is put in place as per usage pattern.

@ AfriMan: Up to now I did not have a reason to complain about the shaping policy as you guys usually only shaped when really required or if there was a problem with the network, and only for a limited time. Now we are looking at quite servere shaping over a long period of time without any prospect of improvement.
Would it be possible to give us a idea what is going on and whether there is any ETA of when the shaping will be redduced?
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I'm afraid we can't give any ETAs at this stage :(
 
Chris83 said:
It's not the same thing.
First you say people aren't shaped according to their usage, now you say heavy users get shaped first.
First you say you use a blanket shaping method, now you say based on individual usage patterns not just totals.
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Here's what we're saying -

If there is available capacity on the network - we won't shape anyone, no matter what their totals are.

If there is high demand to the point where we're close to capacity, we'll start shaping, starting with the heaviest users.

So if we don't need to shape, we don't and we give all clients, regardless of their usage patterns or totals full line speed on all services. If we do need to shape, we try to shape the least number of clients, to the least extent, based on their individual usage profiles.

So we don't shape according to your individual stats, but the network stats. But once the network tells us we need to shape, we use your stats as a guideline to determine who gets shaped first.

Is this making more sense now?
 
AfriMan said:
This is still saying the same thing. We determine by how much demand is exceeding available resources. We then use that to calculate how many users need to be shaped and start applying shaping from the heaviest users (based on their usage patterns, not just their totals). It does say experience may differ, but lighter users are unshaped much faster than heavier users. So very aggressive users are shaped quicker and ushaped much slower - and lighter users the opposite.

When demand is so heavy that every user will need to be shaped - that can occur - but the lightest users will be unshaped first, with the heaviest users unshaped last - depending on when and how much demand decreases in real time -so each user will always have a slightly different experience based on their usage patterns and shaping profile.
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I thought individual usage has nothing to do with shaping irrespective on what you use. It's only got to do with what's available in terms of capacity, this confused me :/
 
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Chris83 said:
The fact that the Afrihost Network Status reports "All systems are performing within specified parameters".
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Our network is working correctly. Notices are put up the moment we spot a latency - as an example, the Cape Town latency we saw on Monday (I think it was)
Because we saw increased shaping doesn't mean our network isn't working as it should :)
 
AfriMan said:
Here's what we're saying -

If there is available capacity on the network - we won't shape anyone, no matter what their totals are.

If there is high demand to the point where we're close to capacity, we'll start shaping, starting with the heaviest users.

So if we don't need to shape, we don't and we give all clients, regardless of their usage patterns or totals full line speed on all services. If we do need to shape, we try to shape the least number of clients, to the least extent, based on their individual usage profiles.

So we don't shape according to your individual stats, but the network stats. But once the network tells us we need to shape, we use your stats as a guideline to determine who gets shaped first.

Is this making more sense now?
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Yes :)
 
AfriGuy said:
Our network is working correctly. Notices are put up the moment we spot a latency - as an example, the Cape Town latency we saw on Monday (I think it was)
Because we saw increased shaping doesn't mean our network isn't working as it should :)
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So are you saying that having a network running at 100% capacity for days is "working as it should" and "within specified parameters"? Because I'm shaped for days (and nights) now.
 
Type RSA said:
Yes he did, still doesn't mean you never denied it. But anywho. Just saying. Thanks for the feedback regarding the capacity upgrades. Looking forward to it :) Want my 10mb home uncapped account :)
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I don't think we'll get anywhere with this :)
We were always transparent about the fact that we had an increase in demand and we'd had to increase shaping. The intention was never to blindfold our clients :)
 
Chris83 said:
So are you saying that having a network running at 100% capacity for days is "working as it should" and "within specified parameters"? Because I'm shaped for days (and nights) now.
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Not at all, while we definitely saw a higher demand during the day - shaping did ease off after hours (although a bit later than what we'd hoped)
If our network was running at the ceiling of our capacity latency would go through the roof. This is why shaping was implemented.
 
This that and everything else, the fact of the matter is that you only shape because you are hitting capacity limits, that is why shaping exists, guys in this thread can moan all they want nothing is going to change unless one of two things happen, Afrihost brings more IPC capacity online or usage subsides on their network...period

They shaping because they have too, bandwidth is bandwidth you can't artificiality create extra capacity, there is no magic here
 
eddief1 said:
This that and everything else, the fact of the matter is that you only shape because you are hitting capacity limits, that is why shaping exists, guys in this thread can moan all they want nothing is going to change unless one of two things happen, Afrihost brings more IPC capacity online or usage subsides on their network...period

They shaping because they have too, bandwidth is bandwidth you can't artificiality create extra capacity, there is no magic here
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Remember we didn't hit our limits, just needed shaping in place so we didn't have the network freak out :)
Thanks for being so understand though, it's much appreciated!
 
any news on what your pricing will be after the Telkom line upgrades?
 
AfriGuy said:
Remember we didn't hit our limits, just needed shaping in place so we didn't have the network freak out :)
Thanks for being so understand though, it's much appreciated!
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Lets put it this way rather, you need to shape so you don't hit your limits :-)

EDIT: Correction...limits for that bandwidth pool
 
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AfriGuy said:
I think there is a lot more that actually goes into a consideration, and a network of this size. Simply posting "we're waiting for more capacity" isn't something we decide on, on the way to work. It's way, way more complicated than that :(
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I don't see how your response addresses my post at all...?
 
Chris83 said:
The fact that the Afrihost Network Status reports "All systems are performing within specified parameters".
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That's the thing. Their system IS performing within their parameters. Given current demand, capacity etc if they did NOT shape the contention would get so damn high that browsing would become painful!

Go and read in the openweb thread on how their shaping shapes browsing when there is load.

If you prefer that...then move ISPs.

People think that the current shaping is a network problem...it's not. It's purely based on available capacity, demand for the aforementioned and the system in place to ensure that real time services run optimally around the clock.
 
HapticSimian said:
I don't see how your response addresses my post at all...?
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I think it's been answered before though?
We saw an increase in demand here, and looked at what we could. The solution here wasn't just to increase capacity off the bat.

The more time went on, and the more we looked at the results - we got pointed in the right direction.
 
Probably not the time to do this. But we all kinda told you so from day 1...

But I do understand you can't just order more capacity without knowing for sure. You okes should give us all jobs... :)
 
Type RSA said:
Probably not the time to do this. But we all kinda told you so from day 1...

but I do understand you can't just order more capacity without knowing for sure. You okes should give us all jobs... :)
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Haha, if only it was that simple :( Again, initially we needed to look at a lot more options that were on the cards. The more we looked at the results, the more we saw the need for additional capacity. Not every IPC glitch can be solved with additional capacity I'm afraid :)
 
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