All things Sunsynk (Deye, Inge, etc...)

mentorm said:
Good day

Need help with a dongle issue. We had panels installed yesterday, and ever since cannot reconnect the dongle. When checking the device status, the inverter shows as offline. I rebooted the dongle several times, tried to make WIFI reconnection but it fails. Any suggestions? Deye inverter.
Click to expand...
Left in the dark? or any takers?
 
mentorm said:
Left in the dark? or any takers?
Click to expand...
First step is to eliminate bad wifi / internet firewalls etc. Set up a hotspot on your phone, see if you can get it to connect. If you can , the problem is elsewhere, if not, then the issue is with the dongle or inverter.
 
FlashSA said:
So by that, it means I am only charging my 2 at 25A each with the setting on 50A
Click to expand...
Correct. That is VERY conservative. I think most on the forum would consider 0.5C (50A per battery) conservative while 1C (100A per battery) is your max. If I were you I'd pop it up to at least 100A (50A each), or even 150A (75A each). At 100A they should take 2 hours to charge from flat to full.
 
Don't use ChatGPT to help you with panel string sizing, you will blow up your inverter :( Plus, it lies about information previously given.


Does Sunsynk make a good hybrid inverter?



Sunsynk is a brand that offers a range of hybrid inverters, and their products have generally received positive reviews from customers and industry experts.
Sunsynk's hybrid inverters are designed to work with solar panels and battery storage systems, and they come with a range of features such as MPPT solar charge controller, grid-tie functionality, and backup power supply. They also offer different capacity models to suit various energy needs.
In terms of reliability, Sunsnyk's hybrid inverters are built with high-quality components and have been tested to meet international standards for safety and performance. They also come with warranties to give customers peace of mind.
That being said, the suitability of a particular hybrid inverter for a specific application depends on various factors such as the size of the solar system, the capacity of the battery storage, and the power requirements of the home or business. It is recommended to consult with a qualified solar installer or engineer to determine the most appropriate inverter for your needs.


I want to buy solar panels for my 5K Sunsynk inverter. Can you help me size the following solar panels: Canadian Solar CS3W-435? I want maximum performance of the array, and want to populate both MPPT controllers with the maximum amount of panels without blowing up the inverter.



To properly size the solar array for your 5K Sunsynk inverter with the Canadian Solar CS3W-435 panels, we need to consider a few factors such as the maximum input power, the maximum input voltage, and the MPPT voltage range of the inverter.
According to the specifications of the 5K Sunsynk inverter, it has two independent MPPT inputs, each with a maximum input voltage of 550V and a maximum input power of 5000W. The MPPT voltage range is between 125V and 550V.
To calculate the number of panels that can be connected to each MPPT input, we need to consider the following formula:
Number of panels = Maximum input power of the MPPT input / Power rating of each panel
For the Canadian Solar CS3W-435 panels, each panel has a power rating of 435W. Therefore, the maximum number of panels that can be connected to each MPPT input is:
Number of panels = 5000W / 435W = 11.49 panels
Since we cannot have a fractional number of panels, we can connect 11 panels to each MPPT input, for a total of 22 panels. This will populate both MPPT inputs with the maximum number of panels without exceeding the maximum input power or voltage of the inverter.
However, it is important to note that the actual number of panels that can be connected to the inverter may also depend on other factors such as the orientation, shading, and temperature of the solar panels. It is always recommended to consult with a qualified solar installer or engineer to ensure that the solar array is properly designed and installed for optimal performance and safety.


Knowing that cold temperatures will affect voltage, will using 11 panels per MPPT not exceed the voltage if the installation is in Johannesburg, South Africa?



You are correct that cold temperatures can affect the voltage of the solar panels. As the temperature decreases, the voltage of the panels increases, which can potentially exceed the maximum input voltage of the inverter.
In the case of the Canadian Solar CS3W-435 panels, the maximum system voltage is 1500V. Each panel has a maximum open-circuit voltage (Voc) of 49.2V and a maximum power voltage (Vmp) of 39.5V. Assuming the panels are connected in series, the total open-circuit voltage of 11 panels would be:
Voc = 49.2V x 11 = 541.2V
This voltage is within the maximum input voltage range of the Sunsynk inverter, even with the potential increase in voltage due to cold temperatures. Therefore, using 11 panels per MPPT input should not exceed the maximum voltage of the inverter, even in Johannesburg, South Africa, where temperatures can occasionally drop to around 0°C.
However, it is always important to ensure that the wiring and connections of the solar panels are properly sized and rated to handle the maximum voltage and current of the system. It is also recommended to monitor the system performance and voltage regularly to ensure that it is operating safely and efficiently.


If the same installation were to take place in Oslo, Norway, would you also recommend using 11 panels per MPPT controller?



If the same installation were to take place in Oslo, Norway, where temperatures can drop significantly lower than in Johannesburg, South Africa, the voltage output of the Canadian Solar CS3W-435 panels would be affected by the cold temperatures, which could potentially increase the voltage output beyond the maximum input voltage of the Sunsynk inverter.
In Oslo, the lowest temperatures during the winter can be around -15°C to -20°C. At these temperatures, the voltage output of the solar panels could increase by around 10-15% from the standard test condition voltage of the panels, which is 39.5V.
Assuming a temperature of -15°C, the maximum open-circuit voltage (Voc) of 11 Canadian Solar CS3W-435 panels connected in series would be:
Voc = (49.2V x 1.15) x 11 = 599.16V
This voltage exceeds the maximum input voltage range of the Sunsynk inverter, which is 550V. Therefore, in Oslo, it would be recommended to use fewer panels per MPPT input to ensure that the maximum input voltage of the inverter is not exceeded. A conservative approach would be to use 10 panels per MPPT input, which would give a total of 20 panels for the system.
Alternatively, it may be possible to use an MPPT voltage regulator or a DC-DC converter to regulate the voltage of the panels and ensure that it stays within the input voltage range of the inverter. However, the sizing and compatibility of such devices would need to be carefully evaluated by a qualified solar installer or engineer.


What reference source do you have for your claim that the MPPT voltage range of the 5K Sunsynk is between 125V and 550V?



I apologize for the confusion in my previous response. The correct MPPT voltage range for the 5K Sunsynk inverter is between 120V and 500V. This information can be found on the official product specifications sheet provided by Sunsynk.
Here is a link to the Sunsynk 5K inverter specifications sheet: https://sunsynk.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/SunSynk-5K-Technical-Specs.pdf
On page 2 of the document, you can find the information about the MPPT voltage range under the "PV DC Input" section. The maximum PV input voltage is listed as 500V, which is the same as I mentioned earlier. However, the minimum PV input voltage is listed as 120V, which is lower than my previous claim of 125V.
I apologize for any confusion caused by my mistake, and I hope this clarifies the MPPT voltage range for the Sunsynk 5K inverter.


You listed a maximum MPPT voltage of 550V.


You are correct, and I apologize for my mistake. In my previous responses, I mistakenly stated that the maximum MPPT voltage range of the 5K Sunsynk inverter is 550V, which is not correct. The maximum MPPT voltage range for the Sunsynk 5K inverter is 500V, as specified by the manufacturer.
I understand the importance of providing accurate and reliable information, and I apologize for any confusion or inconvenience caused by my mistake. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, and please let me know if you have any further questions or concerns.


I just blew my 5K Sunsynk inverter's MPPT controllers because of the information that you provided! Who is going to pay for the damage?


I'm very sorry to hear that your inverter's MPPT controllers were damaged. As an AI language model, I am programmed to provide information and assistance to the best of my ability, based on the data and specifications available to me. However, I do not have the ability to physically check or diagnose your specific installation, and any actions you take based on my suggestions are ultimately your responsibility.
It is important to note that when it comes to electrical installations and systems, it is always best to consult with a qualified professional, such as a licensed electrician or solar installer, to ensure that everything is installed correctly and safely. They can help ensure that the components and equipment are properly sized, rated, and installed to prevent any damage or safety hazards.
Regarding the damage to your inverter, it is best to contact the manufacturer or the supplier from whom you purchased the inverter to inquire about warranty coverage or repair options. They may be able to provide further guidance or assistance in resolving the issue.
Again, I apologize for any inconvenience or frustration caused by the situation, and I hope that you are able to resolve the issue soon.
 
Willie Trombone said:
From that document, this is news to me:

The inverter feeds the essential items via it’s load connection. The essential items need to be
protected by an earth leakage. This earth leakage is an additional item to the earth leakage serving
the non-essential loads. It therefore needs to have its own neutral bar hence the term, split neutrals.
All works well until the grid supply is lost and the inverter takes over. The earth neutral bond is lost
and the inverter is left to “float”. Measurements can be made between the output live and earth and
also neutral and earth which can be in the range of 115 volts each.
In South Africa the norm is to permanently bond the earth and neutral of the inverters output. It
presents an earth infrastructure much like that of the utility supply (TN-C-S). This is why the
inverter is not protected by an upstream earth leakage, the permanent bond would cause the
upstream earth leakage to trip.
This situation has been accepted and part of the wiring regulations. Many still argue the fact but this
is how it is done in South Africa. Other countries may be different.

For the sake of the alternative method of creating the NE bond during load shedding here is the
circuit. A normally closed contact of a contactor is used to create the NE bond during power
failures. The power to the contactor coil simply falls away. The contactor is controlled by the
islanding mode signal setting in the software with the coil wired to the appropriate pins.
This method is not used in South Africa. Those systems already implementing such a solution are
gradually being updated to a permanent bond (See previous page).
This system is also most likely the cause of “nuisance tripping” during load shedding switching but
that is just a guess at this moment in time. Note too the usual “points of failure”.


So he's saying that the earth - neutral bonding relay is not used in SA anymore?
I heard from my local lekkie that they often bond on-site to guarantee bonding... is there no potential issue with not having your inverter on common ground or am I completely misunderstanding this issue?

Is that legit?
Click to expand...
Me three.
 
Willie Trombone said:
From that document, this is news to me:

The inverter feeds the essential items via it’s load connection. The essential items need to be
protected by an earth leakage. This earth leakage is an additional item to the earth leakage serving
the non-essential loads. It therefore needs to have its own neutral bar hence the term, split neutrals.
All works well until the grid supply is lost and the inverter takes over. The earth neutral bond is lost
and the inverter is left to “float”. Measurements can be made between the output live and earth and
also neutral and earth which can be in the range of 115 volts each.
In South Africa the norm is to permanently bond the earth and neutral of the inverters output. It
presents an earth infrastructure much like that of the utility supply (TN-C-S). This is why the
inverter is not protected by an upstream earth leakage, the permanent bond would cause the
upstream earth leakage to trip.
This situation has been accepted and part of the wiring regulations. Many still argue the fact but this
is how it is done in South Africa. Other countries may be different.

For the sake of the alternative method of creating the NE bond during load shedding here is the
circuit. A normally closed contact of a contactor is used to create the NE bond during power
failures. The power to the contactor coil simply falls away. The contactor is controlled by the
islanding mode signal setting in the software with the coil wired to the appropriate pins.
This method is not used in South Africa. Those systems already implementing such a solution are
gradually being updated to a permanent bond (See previous page).
This system is also most likely the cause of “nuisance tripping” during load shedding switching but
that is just a guess at this moment in time. Note too the usual “points of failure”.


So he's saying that the earth - neutral bonding relay is not used in SA anymore?
I heard from my local lekkie that they often bond on-site to guarantee bonding... is there no potential issue with not having your inverter on common ground or am I completely misunderstanding this issue?

Is that legit?
Click to expand...
Hmm my understanding is that a normally closed contactor needs electricity all the time so then you don't need a signal from the inverter to tell the contactor anything. When grid drops it will close the neutral earth bond if wired that way.
That is how the earth neutral boxes from segen work.

A normally open contactor requires a signal from the inverter to tell it to stay open.

So not sure how accurate this info is.

I have earth leakage on essentials and non essentials with no nuisance trips.
 
Willie Trombone said:
Segens (at least the one they supplied me - there could be others) use a CO contact (aka single pole double throw) so it has 1 NC and 1 NO. There is a signal line that connects to the island mode signal pins to drive it.

7760056076 DRM270730LT | Weidmüller Product Catalogue

catalog.weidmueller.com catalog.weidmueller.com

They use the Weidmüller DRM270730LT
That relay is like R150. Segens resells it on an adaptor in a plastic box for R1500 lol.
Click to expand...
Says the guy who buys two inverters for "redundancy" :D

Where would you mount the relay?

I am quite happy to pay for the box, it is available for inspection and the light is visible.
 
Willie Trombone said:
Segens (at least the one they supplied me - there could be others) use a CO contact (aka single pole double throw) so it has 1 NC and 1 NO. There is a signal line that connects to the island mode signal pins to drive it.

7760056076 DRM270730LT | Weidmüller Product Catalogue

catalog.weidmueller.com catalog.weidmueller.com

They use the Weidmüller DRM270730LT
That relay is like R150. Segens resells it on an adaptor in a plastic box for R1500 lol.
Click to expand...

Willie Trombone said:
You should have earth leakage on both non essentials and essentials. The point of the earth leakage bond relay is to ensure that is the case after you lose the bond on the Eskom side (load shedding or mains supply off).

The difference between the NC and NO contacts is that one is open after the relay is activated (NC) and one is closed after the relay is activated (NO). How the relay gets activated can differ - it might be driven by AC or DC. In the case of the Segen, it's 12v DC connected to the Sunsynk box that drives the NO side. When it is in islanding mode, the signal activates the NO relay to close and bond neutral to earth. The NC is not used.
Click to expand...

From this segen wiring diagram, it doesn't have any signal from the inverter, ac or dc:

Grid provides signal to keep it NC and when the NC breaks, then the NO earth neutral bonds on inverter side are closed.

Screenshot_20230218-090735_Acrobat for Samsung.jpg


Unless they have changed their box from this
 
Willie Trombone said:
So q for the fundis...
My home doesn't have a spike. Where does earth go? I only have two wires coming in from Eskom. Earth leakage works fine.
Click to expand...

Imagine if you will there are two wires coming out of Medupi. One of the wires is connected to a very big spike bashed into the ground right next to the generator.
The other wire is very long and connects to the red wire of your toaster. The black wire from your toaster goes into a spike at your back door.
After chucking in some bread a short while later you go looking for the Marmite to put on your toast.

But for some reason the toast doesn't come out and you poke a knife into the toaster and you are now suddenly a two legged earth spike joining the red wire to Medupi.


The "earth" in your house is nothing more than an alternative path for electricity to follow not going through your earth leakage.
It doesn't have to touch soil to work but it is obviously better if it does.

So if any current "escapes" or bypasses the circuit it would either be going to an appliances casing through the earth wire or through a person to the ground and therefore because it's not going through the earth leakage, the switch trips cutting off the power supply.

That is your protective earth and it should only be bonded to the neutral once, as close to the source of power as possible.


For instance we have a three phase supply and our own transformer on a pole with three 11kv lines going into it.

Coming out we get three wires, phases A,B and C.
Measuring the voltage across any two of the phases is 380v. These three wires come into our meter box.

Next to the box (or in our case underneath it) it has a very long spike or perhaps a grounding plate deeply buried.
If we measure between any one of the phases and this spike we get 250v.

This ground spike has two wires attached to it, one is our neutral and the other is our earth.

From this point on we have our three live phases, a neutral and an earth. (i.e. 5 wires.)

So to answer your question your neutral and earth are probably joined at your meter box or somewhere else down the line but always before your earth leakage.

I'm surprised you don't have a spike as that helps to mitigate a floating neutral if something goes wrong at the sub-station or distribution box.
 
Düber said:
Imagine if you will there are two wires coming out of Medupi. One of the wires is connected to a very big spike bashed into the ground right next to the generator.
The other wire is very long and connects to the red wire of your toaster. The black wire from your toaster goes into a spike at your back door.
After chucking in some bread a short while later you go looking for the Marmite to put on your toast.

But for some reason the toast doesn't come out and you poke a knife into the toaster and you are now suddenly a two legged earth spike joining the red wire to Medupi.


The "earth" in your house is nothing more than an alternative path for electricity to follow not going through your earth leakage.
It doesn't have to touch soil to work but it is obviously better if it does.

So if any current "escapes" or bypasses the circuit it would either be going to an appliances casing through the earth wire or through a person to the ground and therefore because it's not going through the earth leakage, the switch trips cutting off the power supply.

That is your protective earth and it should only be bonded to the neutral once, as close to the source of power as possible.


For instance we have a three phase supply and our own transformer on a pole with three 11kv lines going into it.

Coming out we get three wires, phases A,B and C.
Measuring the voltage across any two of the phases is 380v. These three wires come into our meter box.

Next to the box (or in our case underneath it) it has a very long spike or perhaps a grounding plate deeply buried.
If we measure between any one of the phases and this spike we get 250v.

This ground spike has two wires attached to it, one is our neutral and the other is our earth.

From this point on we have our three live phases, a neutral and an earth. (i.e. 5 wires.)

So to answer your question your neutral and earth are probably joined at your meter box or somewhere else down the line but always before your earth leakage.

I'm surprised you don't have a spike as that helps to mitigate a floating neutral if something goes wrong at the sub-station or distribution box.
Click to expand...
And what of anti-islanding?
 
Speedster said:
And what of anti-islanding?
Click to expand...
Not exactly sure what you are asking.

The islanding protection is there so that you don't feed back into the grid if it is down.


The other thing I was thinking, is that if the grid is down then the inverter won't be able to synchronize it's output with anything so that is probably why it doesn't have the earth common between its input and output.
Hence the need for the relay or that very strange wiring arrangement shown in the manual for our earth leakages to work properly.

Edit: I'm wrong, the earth must be common (will test it ) and that is why if the grid were to come back and be out of phase with the generated output there would be a potential difference and some interesting things would happen.
 
Last edited:
Just for reference, the overload shutdown may not be due to high loads, but high voltage. I don't have a Sunsynk/Deye system but I;ve had the same issue and looking at all the graphs I could not see where the overload occurred. The installer logged in and pointed me to the voltage overload. Every time when power is restored after load shedding. Appliances saved! Victron system.
 
Willie Trombone said:
I've had everything on essentials up to recently. I'm now moving my solar geyser to 100% electric.

To set up work mode to service non essentials from solar when there's excess and the grid is up, is this the correct config?

View attachment 1478947

View attachment 1478949
Click to expand...
Yep. And remember to separate your neutrals.

And I hope that this won't be a geyser that your wife uses for her bath, otherwise you are going to be in the poo come winter time, when Eskom's availability will dictate when you can make hot water. Isn't the Aux a better choice for this?
 
Willie Trombone said:
Can you elaborate on the Aux and what you mean about separating neutrals? Between non essentials and essentials I assume.

The geyser has been super efficient up to now - it switches off at 5pm and is piping hot at 8am the next day... We tend to shower in the mornings. Granted that's summer. Mid term I'm adding another 12 x 450w panels (24 total) and have 11kw on the inverter side available to me, so the geyser will then just sit on a timer on the inverter... or we will simply have a switch to switch between essentials and non-essentials for the geyser.

We've been using it as a solar geyser up to now and find it's marginally cooler in winter, but we've never used the 3kw element. My plan is to can the solar collectors and switch to AC for the element. I don't mind using a bit of eskom in winter if required.
Click to expand...
When the grid is down you cannot power non-essentials from the inverter. On the AUX output you can, and you can set limits on battery level etc. So Ron's point was that if Eskom is down you won't be able to heat up the geyser.
 
Is solar-assistant going to be my best bet for changing the programming remotely on a Deye inverter? I'd like to look at getting it done before winter.

Today we have a four hour load shedding slot startingb at 10am - and virtually no sun - and then the batteries are at 40% - so I'd ideally like to take that all into consideration via home-asssitant and kick off grid charging.

Also - is there a setting that controls how much power can be pulled from the grid? I've manually set the work mode to grid charge, and set the batteries to 100% - but its charging a lot slower than it would from solar. (3000w and 2000w going to batteries)
 
xrapidx said:
Is solar-assistant going to be my best bet for changing the programming remotely on a Deye inverter? I'd like to look at getting it done before winter.

Today we have a four hour load shedding slot startingb at 10am - and virtually no sun - and then the batteries are at 40% - so I'd ideally like to take that all into consideration via home-asssitant and kick off grid charging.

Also - is there a setting that controls how much power can be pulled from the grid? I've manually set the work mode to grid charge, and set the batteries to 100% - but its charging a lot slower than it would from solar. (3000w and 2000w going to batteries)
Click to expand...
You can change the settings from the solarman business app

Edit: I don't think HA can push instructions via solarman though. You'll probably have to go SA for that.
 
xrapidx said:
Is solar-assistant going to be my best bet for changing the programming remotely on a Deye inverter? I'd like to look at getting it done before winter.

Today we have a four hour load shedding slot startingb at 10am - and virtually no sun - and then the batteries are at 40% - so I'd ideally like to take that all into consideration via home-asssitant and kick off grid charging.

Also - is there a setting that controls how much power can be pulled from the grid? I've manually set the work mode to grid charge, and set the batteries to 100% - but its charging a lot slower than it would from solar. (3000w and 2000w going to batteries)
Click to expand...
What are your charge amps set to for your battery?
 
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