ANCYL brands Afrikaners

[Mila]

My parents were self employed and, yes it would have been easy for me to walk into a job as a laaitie

People that worked at parastatals had jobs meerly because Pa or Oom worked there - ESKOM, ISCOR, TELKOM, to name a few

Try that with HR and company policy. I do not think so, they even nail you on Common law relationships as well as sex with an co worker.
I disagree. Strongly.

I couldn't find work at all in my line of study. After 10+ years of doing other stuff, it is useless to even try and get back into that.

The fact is, there was NO job reservation. You had to compete with another white oke, if you wanted a job. You still got that job based on merit. The job seeker market was just smaller.

Today, you not only have to compete with other white guys based on merit, but you also have to figure in AA policies and BEE targets. Even if the position is available to you, you still won't get appointed as your appointment will screw up the BEE target for that company. Not what AA is all about, but this is how it works in practice.

+10

 

[Jola]

Ok, so the Personnel departments were recruiting young black guys during apartheid days. Sorry, I was wrong.

OK, so give facetious meaningless answers to everything - just the way to conduct a discussion !

Sorry I bothered, have better things to do than to trade drivel with someone who clearly doesn't know much about the past !

 

[grayston]

Cr@p, all of those places [Eskom, Telkom] had independent personnel departments that were in charge of recruitment.

I wonder why people think corruption started in 1994.

It didn't.

Giving jobs to pals/family is not something unique to the ANC. If it was then we would have had the term 'nepotism' to describe it, would we? It wouldn't even be in the English dictionary, let alone the Pedi one...

And before you start... ... a small country in the middle of nowhere who has had sanctions placed on it is the *perfect* breeding ground for corruption, because who will notice? The only difference is that now the media is (sort of) allowed to report on corruption; the old Nats were pretty twisted too.

According to Andrew Feinstein, a lot of them started teaching the ANC the ins and outs of corruption when the NNP merged with the ANC in 2000.

Just sayin.

 

[Mila]

My parents were self employed and, yes it would have been easy for me to walk into a job as a laaitie

People that worked at parastatals had jobs meerly because Pa or Oom worked there - ESKOM, ISCOR, TELKOM, to name a few

Bolox dude - the whole system was set up to help the white afrikaaner - do you think that Sipho Gumede or Koos Van Den Burgh would get the job at Oom Jannie's Paneel Kloppers?

Ok, so the Personnel departments were recruiting young black guys during apartheid days. Sorry, I was wrong.

I wonder why people think corruption started in 1994.

It didn't.

Giving jobs to pals/family is not something unique to the ANC. If it was then we would have had the term 'nepotism' to describe it, would we? It wouldn't even be in the English dictionary, let alone the Pedi one...

And before you start... ... a small country in the middle of nowhere who has had sanctions placed on it is the *perfect* breeding ground for corruption, because who will notice? The only difference is that now the media is (sort of) allowed to report on corruption; the old Nats were pretty twisted too.

According to Andrew Feinstein, a lot of them started teaching the ANC the ins and outs of corruption when the NNP merged with the ANC in 2000.

Just sayin.

Well maybe in guavament but I know for a fact that not even a distant relitive of your wife was allowed to work for the same company. This is experience. My dad was in trouble because my mothers stepmother's distant cousin was a panel beater in a different company that the business he was working for did business with that panel beater and there were hearings held.

But are we talking past or now. Now you would be lucky to get a blow from the secretary and not get re assigned.

As for THe panel beater thing. Of course you look after family but if he is a crap panel beater you would be stupid not to employ a different person. It would not make business sense to employ a futnut.

 

[Captain Slog]

OK, so give facetious meaningless answers to everything - just the way to conduct a discussion !

Sorry I bothered, have better things to do than to trade drivel with someone who clearly doesn't know much about the past !

What can one say to that - clearly I am of far lower intelect than Jola. I made a throw away comment as I left work - was going to continue the discussion when I got home. (Is this guy always like this?)

I was there in the 80s and 90s and was witness to the corruption, nepotism and racism practised by the parastatals and thir ilk - I DO know about the past as I was there experiencing it at the time, first hand.

 

[Mila]

I was there in the 80s and 90s and was witness to the corruption, nepotism and racism practised by the parastatals and thir ilk - I DO know about the past as I was there experiencing it at the time, first hand.

But was apartheid not still on so hence the racism?
The nepotism in guavament not much different from now IMO they just did not kill the goose too.

 

[grayston]

What can one say to that - clearly I am of far lower intelect than Jola. I made a throw away comment as I left work - was going to continue the discussion when I got home. (Is this guy always like this?)

He's lost a few arguments recently. That might explain his mood.

 

[Jola]

He's lost a few arguments recently. That might explain his mood.

Don't recall any - care to elaborate ?

 

[Captain Slog]

It's 13 years too late for that now. He was a C3 tech. in Telkom all that time. He's kept himself busy and sustained us for the last 13 years doing handy man work.



So I landed my waitering and bar tending jobs because of my skin colour? I highly doubt it. Also - I went to a black technikon (no lush student life driving daddy's BMW) because my parents couldn't send me to varsity. I paid my own fees. Out of a class of 65 who started their engineering course, I was one of only 2 who finished. Was it because I'm white?

When I wasn't working at the bar until 3am on weekdays, I'd be at tech until 9pm every night to be on top of my work along with another black dude. I couldn't get a job at a firm for my practical due to their BEE status. So I offered to work there for free just as long as I could get the experience and have my logbook signed and then worked at night to sustain it.

Guess I am generalising too much here.

As for the name calling, I'm referring to those self-entitled prats who want everything to be handed to them, not you. My apologies if I offended you.

Sorry dude, I mean not to lessen the blow that your father had being kicked out of Telkom - it happened to many and was unfair. I knew a guy that was ruined by a similar experience and ended up killing himself with Klippies. At the time (ie 13 years ago) there was loads of work for good telecoms engineers outside SA, pity I did not know him.

As for your experience, I again apologise, you, it would appear, are the exception to the norm. There are MANY self made whities in SA. I am actually referring to the advantaged borebond type advantaged white. I still wonder where you would be if your father was a farm labourer and you uneducated.

 

[Jola]

I still wonder where you would be if your father was a farm labourer and you uneducated.

You are clearly uninformed and/or have a chip on your shoulder !

Due to the size of the economy, the population growth, the migration into SA there is bound to be large numbers of uneducated farm labourers in SA. That is not going to change for a long time, if ever, especially with the ANC corruption and inefficiency.

And there were many poor whites in SA in the 1930's / 40's, living in garages or in the streets, after the great depression and the drought in the 1930's. They were uneducated, and many came from the farms. This was before Apartheid, yet they managed to pull themselves up by their bootlaces. It can be done, but you have to persevere - I don't see many instances of this today, it's all a culture of entitlement !

As for the stories about highly skilled people dumped by the parastatals since the ANC came to power, I suppose that we all know of stories. Heard one the other day about a nuclear power station worker who was dumped at Koeberg - he now maintains nuclear power stations in the UK. This was a year or two before someone left a bolt in one of the Koeberg generators and almost destroyed it - well, if the skills are gone what do you expect ?

 

[Voicy]

As for your experience, I again apologise, you, it would appear, are the exception to the norm. There are MANY self made whities in SA. I am actually referring to the advantaged borebond type advantaged white.

No worries chief, I also have zero time for the rich snobs who were given everything by their parents and don't appreciate a single thing. Not the UCT studies, or the brand new car when they're 18, or the digs/res being paid for in full/ or the spending money.

You can have everything in the world - as long as you appreciate it. To me a poor person who does nothing other than blame the world and feel sorry for himself will gain no more respect from me than a rich brat who takes everything for granted.

 

[Jola]

You can have everything in the world - as long as you appreciate it. To me a poor person who does nothing other than blame the world and feel sorry for himself will gain no more respect from me than a rich brat who takes everything for granted.

I agree with that, and we all know some of the latter - but there are way too many of the former !!!

 

[grayston]

Don't recall any - care to elaborate ?

Of course you don't. ;-)

 

[Jola]

Of course you don't. ;-)

You are just trying to obfuscate your losses ;-)

 

[grayston]

And there were many poor whites in SA in the 1930's / 40's, living in garages or in the streets, after the great depression and the drought in the 1930's. They were uneducated, and many came from the farms. This was before Apartheid, yet they managed to pull themselves up by their bootlaces. It can be done, but you have to persevere - I don't see many instances of this today, it's all a culture of entitlement !

The South African poor white problem in the early 20th century
http://www.ekon.sun.ac.za/wpapers/2006/wp142006/wp-14-2006.pdf

A number of causes have been suggested for the observed increase in white poverty at the start of the
previous century. Poor whites tended to find scapegoats for their situation and thereby implicated the
“capitalists, the Jews, the locusts and the droughts” (Lewis, 1973:10).

Bit o' light reading for you.

 

[Jola]

You left this out :

"Later explanations for the poor
white problem, including those contained in Afrikaner nationalist propaganda, tended to blame exogenous
factors, such as the colonial exploitation of the British, the Anglo-Boer war, the rinderpest of 1896-97 or
cheap imports of maize from the American South. Although these factors did contribute to white poverty,
the poor white problem - as is the case for black poverty today - developed due to a multitude of different
factors, both exogenous and endogenous. Growing poverty is not a sudden event; Pelzer (1937:4) noted in
1937 the importance of a long-term perspective in investigating the determinants of the poor white
problem. Historical factors, educational attainment, labour policies, environmental and demographic
changes, language, culture and political development all shaped a society that experienced an increase in
absolute poverty but an even sharper increase in inequality."

Sounds very similar to today ! Note that historical factors (ie Apartheid in today's scenario) is only one of a multitude of factors. To blame only, or even mainly, Apartheid for the poor black problem of today is just idiotic !

 

[Jola]

The rest :

"Similar to the poor white problem, black poverty today has been explained as the result of various factors.
Apartheid-policy as well as the policies of segregation that preceded it are often seen collectively as a main
cause of black poverty. Yet, without suggesting that segregationist policies did not contribute to black
poverty, it is argued here that there are other underlying reasons for the magnitude of black poverty today.
Similarly to the poor white problem, black poverty is caused by a mix of exogenous and endogenous
factors, including historical factors, education, discriminatory labour policies, shifting demographic trends,
language, culture and, of course, politics. This section investigates the causes of both the poor white
problem and black poverty today, and identifies the links between the two periods."

May be a good idea to read your own links before posting them.

 

[TKD01]

I wonder why people think corruption started in 1994.
Giving jobs to pals/family is not something unique to the ANC.

Agreed. And though that doesn't make it right - there is still one BIG difference between Pre and Post '94 nepotism:

Buddy if you didn't perform YOU WERE OUT! The word "Accountability" still had meaning Pre '94 - again I'm not saying it makes it right but at least work got done!

 

[Jola]

Was just listening to John Robby today on 702 : Prime Minister John Vorster was fired for his role in the information scandal. Note that he did not gain personally from this, but it was of course an abuse of state funds (spending it on the Citizen so that they could support the government).

Now compare that to JZ ! Hmm.. Fired, what for ?

 

[sister]

Bolox dude - the whole system was set up to help the white afrikaaner - do you think that Sipho Gumede or Koos Van Den Burgh would get the job at Oom Jannie's Paneel Kloppers?

my guess is that Sipho would get the job.
cheap labour ....