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BidOrBuy combats online fraud
- Thread starter rpm
- Start date
*sighs*
Escrow - The holding of funds, documents, securities, or other property by an impartial third party for the other two participants in a business transaction. When the transaction is completed, the escrow agent releases the entrusted property.
If not available then don't risk it...
Escrow - The holding of funds, documents, securities, or other property by an impartial third party for the other two participants in a business transaction. When the transaction is completed, the escrow agent releases the entrusted property.
If not available then don't risk it...
Securities
Well, the ONLY thing for BidOrBuy to do is to cover those 100k and pay back the bidders who have not received the goods.
After all the seller was VERIFIED by the bid or buy and confidence of buying was provided by that verification.
Lets see if bid or buy has enough business sense to stand up and put the money where the mouth is.
Well, the ONLY thing for BidOrBuy to do is to cover those 100k and pay back the bidders who have not received the goods.
After all the seller was VERIFIED by the bid or buy and confidence of buying was provided by that verification.
Lets see if bid or buy has enough business sense to stand up and put the money where the mouth is.
Natas
Expert Member
I once tried to buy somehtign off soem idiot on BOB....the item would have costed over R3000 so i suggested we make use of a Bank guarantee. SLightly better than an escrow situation as a Bank guanratee is a liquid document. The seller had no idea what I was talking about and thought I was a scammer.
I think the problem is getting people to accept this these mechanisms.
stoke
Honorary Master
I hate pure advertising articles.
Solution:
When you register as a seller, you have to go to the police and open a speciality docket where you prove your CK number / ID number as well as leave your fingerprints behind.
This will require the police to play along, but in return the police get some cool new fingerprints to play with.
Oh hang on ... isn't there an organization that does this already?
What do you mean business opportunity?
WHERE?
NOOOOOOOOOOOO!
We don't actually want to help the community.
Solution:
When you register as a seller, you have to go to the police and open a speciality docket where you prove your CK number / ID number as well as leave your fingerprints behind.
This will require the police to play along, but in return the police get some cool new fingerprints to play with.
Oh hang on ... isn't there an organization that does this already?
What do you mean business opportunity?
WHERE?
NOOOOOOOOOOOO!
We don't actually want to help the community.
Last edited:
Perkalgifts dotcoza
New Member
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
- Messages
- 2
- Reaction score
- 0
In response to your article, I think it is an absolute disgrace and strongly suggest you speak to some of the buyers involved such as myself before you portray bidorbuy as heros when they have -up to date- failed there members and the entire community wrt this fraudulent activity which happend on their watch.
I am both a reputable bidorbuy sellers (with over 4500 net positive ratings) and a trustworthy bidorbuy buyer.. truly your ideal bidorbuy customer who was always looking up to bidorbuy as a sort of big brother for our company www.perkalgifts.co.za.
I, together with +- 60 other bidorbuy buyers purchased well over R150000 worth of products for this verified seller on bidorbuy username DFO and name Dewald Viljoen. These auctions all closed 26 January and stated to allow the seller for 7 days to disppatch the parcel (this is normal bidorbuy practice)
I purchased SONY HDTV LCD tv/monitor for R250000 , as according to the bidorbuy terms I paid, was promised a tacking number by friday 2 Feb and still sit here with no tv and no tracking number and no compensation from bidrobuy who according to your article have closed this matter??
I can confirm the following:
1)I Philip Kalinko, together with Warren Barkhuizen and Renato Valentini went to Dewalds home address in Benoni as listed on his bidorbuy form on Wednesday 7 feb. Intially he wasnt there and then we returned his father answerd the door. His father said that Dewald has left the country and that he has no idea where dewald is. He said that Dewald is a 30 year old adult and anything he has/hasnt done has got nothing to do with him as his father. We informed his father of the going ons, asked the father to contact Dewald asap and try resolve this for us and left. UPDATE: To date we have from a very reliable source that Dewald is still in S.A and we dont think the fathers story holds much water...
2)Prior to that we went to the Benoni police station and laid a charge for fraud and theft against Dewald. the case has been opened and is being transferred to the Sandton Police. Once this has happend we will email all the buyers who have been scammed with the case number and everyone who wishes to lay a charge can add it onto the case that I Philip Kalinko, together with Warren Barkhuizen and Renato Valentini have succesfully opened. UPDATE This has been dones and buyers are opening cases daily and attaching to one main case again Dewald.
3)Regardless of the terms of the buyer protection program (which only covers buyers for up to R3000 in this case regardless of how much they where taken for ) the 3 of us and every other buyer we have spoken thus far, believes that bidorbuy should/and will compensate all of us for the losses sustained here. they have done to much good in instilling a trust in buying online and the bidorbuy process, that to loose that trust now, would be suicide and isnt in their nature as an organisation UPDATE: This article seems to point to the contry and so unfortunitly if this is so, this is going to be a very long and public thing and not the short and sweet sega that bdirobuy is trying to sweap under the carpet.
4)So far we have estimated at least R150000 from the confirmed victims. Just from 6 people out of the 40 so far that I have personaly spoken with we are talking about around R70000
5)We have had his bank accounts checked in the interest of freezing his accounts and can confirm that he had a balance of under R100 UPDATE: according to relaibale source his account has been frozen already.
6)We have confirmed that Dewald is a South African citizen and as such should dewald indeed be out of S.A (doubtfull but anythings possible here) we will be able to expeditite him with ease.
7)DEWALD WHEN YOU READ THIS, DO YOURSELF A FAVOUR AND TURN YOURSELF IN BECAUSE THE POLICE RAE LOOKING FOR YOU AND WHEN THEY FIND YOU,YOU ARE GOING TO BE LIABLE TO FIT THE BILL!!!! YOU CAN STILL MAKE IT GOOD NOW, BUT I PROMISE 1 OR 2 WEEKS FROM NOW, EITHER WAY YOU WILL BE FOUND AND BE LIABLE FOR YOUR ACTIONS.
8)We will be speaking to bidorbuy tommorow to get a better idea of how to integrate the legal side with the bidorbuy side of things and particulary whose going to take responsibility for this. We will be requesting full restitiion from bidorbuy regardless of the terms of the buyer protection service. Bidorbuy in turn then will have a claim against Dewald in which we will all be asked to testify. But this hasnt been discussed at all with bidorbuy and us as of yet we have no info..UPDATE Still waiting????!!!!
ALOT OF PEOPLE ARE ANGRY AND WE ARE NOT LETTING THIS STAND!! DEWALD WILL BE FOUND AND JUSTICE WILL BE DONE.
We have agreed to made it our top prioirty -until this is resolved to- to be restitituted and to bring Dewald to justice for this crime. We will stop at nothing to do so.
Speaking in my own capacity as a verified seller on bidorbuy and someone who is very close to bidorbuy and knows them well, I couldnt imagine that they wouldnt come to the party here and take responsibility for what has happend on there website and set a precedent in the industry like they have continually done until now.
This is an opportunitly for them to take responsibility for there verified sellers actions as who can ever have confidence to buy or sell from bidorbuy if when the users they verify end up defrauded there buyers, they act as they seem posed to here by shrugging it off and putting a spin on it to reflect well on bidorbuy..
There are many things which bother us in your article here, to mention a few:
1)this article is giving Bidorbuy good publicity for this theft to its members
2)Much of the information is not correct? To mention a few:
a)
Quote:
Whilst many e-commerce sites turn a blind eye, Bidorbuy has taken proactive steps to nip this in the bud.
How has bidorbuy done this, the moeny is still missing, DFO is still missing, noone has been compensated??[/quote]
b)
Quote:
Unfortunately for the buyers, the goods have not yet been delivered and the seller is unreachable.
Unfortunitly for the buyers..... UNFORTUNITLY FOR THE WHOLE ECOMMERCE COMMUNITY, WHY ARE BIDORBUY ISOLATING US ASIF IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM? WE PAY BIDORBUY A SUCCESS FEE ON EVERY AUCTION WE CLOSE... WHY DO WE PAY THIS? ITS BECAUSE THEY PROVIDE US WITH A SAFE TRANSACTION ENVORMENT?? NOW WHEN THERE IS A PROBLEM, FURTHERMORE WITH A VERFIED USER its
Quote:
Unfortunate for those buyers
c)
Quote:
Andy Higgins, Bidorbuy Managing Director, said that members should always look at a member’s trading history, make use of the buyer protection program and even just give the seller or buyer a call to verify their credentials.
Most of the buyers defrauded by Dewald did all these things and more, yet are all sitting here without there money and without there products???
d)
Quote:
In this specific fraud case, Bidorbuy dealt with the police and even hired a private detective to try and locate the seller. Their attempts to track down the suspect were not successful but it does show dedication from the online auction website.
This all blew up mid last week and bidorbuiy is already righting it off as them doing there bit?? THE BUYERS AFFECTED STILL HAVENT RECEIVED ANY INFORMATION FROM BIDORBUY, WE HAVE TO STAMBLE ACROSS FALSE ARTICLES ABOUT US THAT EVEN WE DONT KNOW YET!!
3)Bidorbuy is being portrayed as has resolving this issue when still up date to date we have no formal answer from bidorbuy who very well may be limited its compensation per buyer to R3000
4)Bidorbuy has spoken to the press before speaking to the buyers involved about it???
5)I think bidorbuys article speaks for itself and once I (and any other bueyr who chooses to join) get confirmation from Andy himself that he is only paying me R3000 compensation for a R25000 purchase I will do everything in my power to make this public knowledge and expose bidorbuy for the shortsighted organistation it would be if it decided to go this route.
6)This pruchase was from a verified user who had 100% feedback until this crime, after i personally called Samantha Naidoo - a bidorbuy staff member BEFORE bidding to ensure that if there where problems the fact that he was verified coverd me, to which I was told that he is a verfiied seller and if anything went wrong I would be compensated for the full amount.. Now something does goes wrong and the story changes???
This article was truly an eye opener as to how bidorbuy plans to twist this to the press...
Yours truly and extremly concerned.
Philip Kalinko
www.perkalgifts.co.za
If we dont get bidorbuys support we will be forced to go public with this which is really uneccesary and not what we want todo. BUT BELIEVE ME IF BIDORBUY USE SOME FINE PRINT TO DEFAULT ON RESTITITUTION, WE WILL TAKE THEM TO THE CLEANERS!!! We will launch a media caimpiagn detailing how we have been screwed over on/by bidorbuy and air it in a caimpaign that makes fnbs crime one that was scheduled for last wknd look like a joke.We will then additionally be forced to take class action against Dewald ourselves, even though its not our duty..
But lets see what happens and we will keep you informed..
I am both a reputable bidorbuy sellers (with over 4500 net positive ratings) and a trustworthy bidorbuy buyer.. truly your ideal bidorbuy customer who was always looking up to bidorbuy as a sort of big brother for our company www.perkalgifts.co.za.
I, together with +- 60 other bidorbuy buyers purchased well over R150000 worth of products for this verified seller on bidorbuy username DFO and name Dewald Viljoen. These auctions all closed 26 January and stated to allow the seller for 7 days to disppatch the parcel (this is normal bidorbuy practice)
I purchased SONY HDTV LCD tv/monitor for R250000 , as according to the bidorbuy terms I paid, was promised a tacking number by friday 2 Feb and still sit here with no tv and no tracking number and no compensation from bidrobuy who according to your article have closed this matter??
I can confirm the following:
1)I Philip Kalinko, together with Warren Barkhuizen and Renato Valentini went to Dewalds home address in Benoni as listed on his bidorbuy form on Wednesday 7 feb. Intially he wasnt there and then we returned his father answerd the door. His father said that Dewald has left the country and that he has no idea where dewald is. He said that Dewald is a 30 year old adult and anything he has/hasnt done has got nothing to do with him as his father. We informed his father of the going ons, asked the father to contact Dewald asap and try resolve this for us and left. UPDATE: To date we have from a very reliable source that Dewald is still in S.A and we dont think the fathers story holds much water...
2)Prior to that we went to the Benoni police station and laid a charge for fraud and theft against Dewald. the case has been opened and is being transferred to the Sandton Police. Once this has happend we will email all the buyers who have been scammed with the case number and everyone who wishes to lay a charge can add it onto the case that I Philip Kalinko, together with Warren Barkhuizen and Renato Valentini have succesfully opened. UPDATE This has been dones and buyers are opening cases daily and attaching to one main case again Dewald.
3)Regardless of the terms of the buyer protection program (which only covers buyers for up to R3000 in this case regardless of how much they where taken for ) the 3 of us and every other buyer we have spoken thus far, believes that bidorbuy should/and will compensate all of us for the losses sustained here. they have done to much good in instilling a trust in buying online and the bidorbuy process, that to loose that trust now, would be suicide and isnt in their nature as an organisation UPDATE: This article seems to point to the contry and so unfortunitly if this is so, this is going to be a very long and public thing and not the short and sweet sega that bdirobuy is trying to sweap under the carpet.
4)So far we have estimated at least R150000 from the confirmed victims. Just from 6 people out of the 40 so far that I have personaly spoken with we are talking about around R70000
5)We have had his bank accounts checked in the interest of freezing his accounts and can confirm that he had a balance of under R100 UPDATE: according to relaibale source his account has been frozen already.
6)We have confirmed that Dewald is a South African citizen and as such should dewald indeed be out of S.A (doubtfull but anythings possible here) we will be able to expeditite him with ease.
7)DEWALD WHEN YOU READ THIS, DO YOURSELF A FAVOUR AND TURN YOURSELF IN BECAUSE THE POLICE RAE LOOKING FOR YOU AND WHEN THEY FIND YOU,YOU ARE GOING TO BE LIABLE TO FIT THE BILL!!!! YOU CAN STILL MAKE IT GOOD NOW, BUT I PROMISE 1 OR 2 WEEKS FROM NOW, EITHER WAY YOU WILL BE FOUND AND BE LIABLE FOR YOUR ACTIONS.
8)We will be speaking to bidorbuy tommorow to get a better idea of how to integrate the legal side with the bidorbuy side of things and particulary whose going to take responsibility for this. We will be requesting full restitiion from bidorbuy regardless of the terms of the buyer protection service. Bidorbuy in turn then will have a claim against Dewald in which we will all be asked to testify. But this hasnt been discussed at all with bidorbuy and us as of yet we have no info..UPDATE Still waiting????!!!!
ALOT OF PEOPLE ARE ANGRY AND WE ARE NOT LETTING THIS STAND!! DEWALD WILL BE FOUND AND JUSTICE WILL BE DONE.
We have agreed to made it our top prioirty -until this is resolved to- to be restitituted and to bring Dewald to justice for this crime. We will stop at nothing to do so.
Speaking in my own capacity as a verified seller on bidorbuy and someone who is very close to bidorbuy and knows them well, I couldnt imagine that they wouldnt come to the party here and take responsibility for what has happend on there website and set a precedent in the industry like they have continually done until now.
This is an opportunitly for them to take responsibility for there verified sellers actions as who can ever have confidence to buy or sell from bidorbuy if when the users they verify end up defrauded there buyers, they act as they seem posed to here by shrugging it off and putting a spin on it to reflect well on bidorbuy..
There are many things which bother us in your article here, to mention a few:
1)this article is giving Bidorbuy good publicity for this theft to its members
2)Much of the information is not correct? To mention a few:
a)
Quote:
Whilst many e-commerce sites turn a blind eye, Bidorbuy has taken proactive steps to nip this in the bud.
How has bidorbuy done this, the moeny is still missing, DFO is still missing, noone has been compensated??[/quote]
b)
Quote:
Unfortunately for the buyers, the goods have not yet been delivered and the seller is unreachable.
Unfortunitly for the buyers..... UNFORTUNITLY FOR THE WHOLE ECOMMERCE COMMUNITY, WHY ARE BIDORBUY ISOLATING US ASIF IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM? WE PAY BIDORBUY A SUCCESS FEE ON EVERY AUCTION WE CLOSE... WHY DO WE PAY THIS? ITS BECAUSE THEY PROVIDE US WITH A SAFE TRANSACTION ENVORMENT?? NOW WHEN THERE IS A PROBLEM, FURTHERMORE WITH A VERFIED USER its
Quote:
Unfortunate for those buyers
c)
Quote:
Andy Higgins, Bidorbuy Managing Director, said that members should always look at a member’s trading history, make use of the buyer protection program and even just give the seller or buyer a call to verify their credentials.
Most of the buyers defrauded by Dewald did all these things and more, yet are all sitting here without there money and without there products???
d)
Quote:
In this specific fraud case, Bidorbuy dealt with the police and even hired a private detective to try and locate the seller. Their attempts to track down the suspect were not successful but it does show dedication from the online auction website.
This all blew up mid last week and bidorbuiy is already righting it off as them doing there bit?? THE BUYERS AFFECTED STILL HAVENT RECEIVED ANY INFORMATION FROM BIDORBUY, WE HAVE TO STAMBLE ACROSS FALSE ARTICLES ABOUT US THAT EVEN WE DONT KNOW YET!!
3)Bidorbuy is being portrayed as has resolving this issue when still up date to date we have no formal answer from bidorbuy who very well may be limited its compensation per buyer to R3000
4)Bidorbuy has spoken to the press before speaking to the buyers involved about it???
5)I think bidorbuys article speaks for itself and once I (and any other bueyr who chooses to join) get confirmation from Andy himself that he is only paying me R3000 compensation for a R25000 purchase I will do everything in my power to make this public knowledge and expose bidorbuy for the shortsighted organistation it would be if it decided to go this route.
6)This pruchase was from a verified user who had 100% feedback until this crime, after i personally called Samantha Naidoo - a bidorbuy staff member BEFORE bidding to ensure that if there where problems the fact that he was verified coverd me, to which I was told that he is a verfiied seller and if anything went wrong I would be compensated for the full amount.. Now something does goes wrong and the story changes???
This article was truly an eye opener as to how bidorbuy plans to twist this to the press...
Yours truly and extremly concerned.
Philip Kalinko
www.perkalgifts.co.za
If we dont get bidorbuys support we will be forced to go public with this which is really uneccesary and not what we want todo. BUT BELIEVE ME IF BIDORBUY USE SOME FINE PRINT TO DEFAULT ON RESTITITUTION, WE WILL TAKE THEM TO THE CLEANERS!!! We will launch a media caimpiagn detailing how we have been screwed over on/by bidorbuy and air it in a caimpaign that makes fnbs crime one that was scheduled for last wknd look like a joke.We will then additionally be forced to take class action against Dewald ourselves, even though its not our duty..
But lets see what happens and we will keep you informed..
Can't believe Bid or Buy wants to come out of this looking good!!
Thay have not phoned any of the buyers involved in this scam! I had to go to their offices. I find it very funny how they state that the police has looked for Dewald Viljoen, when one of their staff members phone me from the Sandton police office on Tuesday the 13th. That was when Bid or buy went to open a police case! Now did the search only last 1 day? Damn, never new SAP was that fast!!
Clearly they are lying to the public, trying to make them look good. They have not handled this situation good at all, not following up with buyers and not really being sympathetic towards us as buyers involved in this matter. \
They can take the time typing out a news statement like this, but not to phone the involved parties!!
Shame on you Bid or Buy!!!!!!!!
Thay have not phoned any of the buyers involved in this scam! I had to go to their offices. I find it very funny how they state that the police has looked for Dewald Viljoen, when one of their staff members phone me from the Sandton police office on Tuesday the 13th. That was when Bid or buy went to open a police case! Now did the search only last 1 day? Damn, never new SAP was that fast!!
Clearly they are lying to the public, trying to make them look good. They have not handled this situation good at all, not following up with buyers and not really being sympathetic towards us as buyers involved in this matter. \
They can take the time typing out a news statement like this, but not to phone the involved parties!!
Shame on you Bid or Buy!!!!!!!!
I have been following this case since Phillip and leagle_eagle started the posts in the Bid or Buy Forums, and can really agree with them here. Bid or Buy has not responded to any of the claims, posts etc. they have made.
Surely, just by the size of this crime, over R150 000, BoB should give priority to it, and not priority to the press releases thereof!
Surely, just by the size of this crime, over R150 000, BoB should give priority to it, and not priority to the press releases thereof!
AndyHiggins
BidorBuy CEO
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2005
- Messages
- 145
- Reaction score
- 8
Dear All,
We would like to correct some of the statements that were made in this post.
For the record following are the actions bidorbuy has taken to date:
On Thursday 8th February 2007 it was made clear to us by our community members that the seller in question was likely to have committed fraud.
We immediately blacklisted the seller’s bidorbuy account and notified all buyers that had purchased something from him not to make payment if they had not done so already.
Within hours we called the seller’s bank to find out the procedure for getting his bank account frozen.
Having the seller’s bank details we also immediately attempted to debit his account for the maximum amount allowable by our bank (subsequently this debit bounced as the user’s bank account had already been frozen).
We also made contact with a number private investigators and people tracing companies to find out the procedure for tracing a person in such a case. We found that one needs to wait a number of working days for the relevant information to filter through the various systems before one can get reliable results (if a person has left the country for example) and even then it is not 100% as the person could have left the country illegally through an unmanned border (or under a false identity).
We are currently drafting communication to all the affected buyers to update them today on what is happening. Besides the buyers that have filed a case with the police, bidorbuy has also filed a case and we expect to be put in contact with a SAPS detective by tomorrow. We have also been informed by the police that if our private investigator finds this person, upon informing the SAPS detective, he will be able to be arrested immediately.
We would like to assure every one that we are being proactive on this case and we are continuing to do what we can to resolve the matter.
The buyers affected by this case are protected up to R3,000 by the bidorbuy Buyer Protection Programme. There is no small print here and we will be expediting all claims made by buyers (buyers will not need to wait the normal 30 days to be reimbursed and in the case of Philip he will still be eligible to make a claim even though his purchase was over R10,000).
We are also currently fast tracking plans to offer an escrow service to our users, as has been suggested by some forum members, to try and prevent this type of thing from happening in the future.
Any suggestions on what more we should be doing will be welcomed.
Andy Higgins
Managing Director
bidorbuy (Pty) Ltd
We would like to correct some of the statements that were made in this post.
For the record following are the actions bidorbuy has taken to date:
On Thursday 8th February 2007 it was made clear to us by our community members that the seller in question was likely to have committed fraud.
We immediately blacklisted the seller’s bidorbuy account and notified all buyers that had purchased something from him not to make payment if they had not done so already.
Within hours we called the seller’s bank to find out the procedure for getting his bank account frozen.
Having the seller’s bank details we also immediately attempted to debit his account for the maximum amount allowable by our bank (subsequently this debit bounced as the user’s bank account had already been frozen).
We also made contact with a number private investigators and people tracing companies to find out the procedure for tracing a person in such a case. We found that one needs to wait a number of working days for the relevant information to filter through the various systems before one can get reliable results (if a person has left the country for example) and even then it is not 100% as the person could have left the country illegally through an unmanned border (or under a false identity).
We are currently drafting communication to all the affected buyers to update them today on what is happening. Besides the buyers that have filed a case with the police, bidorbuy has also filed a case and we expect to be put in contact with a SAPS detective by tomorrow. We have also been informed by the police that if our private investigator finds this person, upon informing the SAPS detective, he will be able to be arrested immediately.
We would like to assure every one that we are being proactive on this case and we are continuing to do what we can to resolve the matter.
The buyers affected by this case are protected up to R3,000 by the bidorbuy Buyer Protection Programme. There is no small print here and we will be expediting all claims made by buyers (buyers will not need to wait the normal 30 days to be reimbursed and in the case of Philip he will still be eligible to make a claim even though his purchase was over R10,000).
We are also currently fast tracking plans to offer an escrow service to our users, as has been suggested by some forum members, to try and prevent this type of thing from happening in the future.
Any suggestions on what more we should be doing will be welcomed.
Andy Higgins
Managing Director
bidorbuy (Pty) Ltd
Last edited:
So sue them? It certainly seems as if you have grounds especially if you were told by a BoB employee that you were covered.
Just to clarify --- did a BoB employee really state that Phillip was covered for the full amount?? 
Andy, you really need to look at that statement and Speak to your Samantha Naidoo - cause that statement will surely cost BoB thousands!
I hope you record all your telephone conversations
Andy, you really need to look at that statement and Speak to your Samantha Naidoo - cause that statement will surely cost BoB thousands!
I hope you record all your telephone conversations
AndyHiggins
BidorBuy CEO
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2005
- Messages
- 145
- Reaction score
- 8
Dean MF, Samantha is on leave at the moment so I haven't been able to hear from her exactly what was said. However, if she did comment on it, I sincerly doubt she used the exact words Philip claimed she used (as I have heard her explaining how it works to other users and she certainly did not give false information as has been claimed here).
Furthermore, I know for certain with Philip being a long standing seller on our site and a verified user himself he knew exactly what the terms of the Buyer Protection Program are (these have been unchanged for a number of years now).
Andy
Furthermore, I know for certain with Philip being a long standing seller on our site and a verified user himself he knew exactly what the terms of the Buyer Protection Program are (these have been unchanged for a number of years now).
Andy
Andy - i really hope you guys can sort out this matter and everyone is happy in the end - except DFO of course 
I too am a buyer / seller on Bid Or Buy and have sold and bought quite a lot of items on your site. Luckily I have never fell victim of any scam seller - I just cant wait for you guys to implement the escrow-type service, this will really help us all when buying bigger items.
I too am a buyer / seller on Bid Or Buy and have sold and bought quite a lot of items on your site. Luckily I have never fell victim of any scam seller - I just cant wait for you guys to implement the escrow-type service, this will really help us all when buying bigger items.
Perkalgifts dotcoza
New Member
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2007
- Messages
- 2
- Reaction score
- 0
There is much to respond to here:
1)Samantha definitly said this and in those words (not exact, but to the exact affect).
2)I have it from a very relaiable source that Digital Mall (where bidorbuy is housed) records all conversations. We are currently legally trying to obtain these conversations.
3)I wouldnt be surprised if they go missing from the way in which bidorbuy is acting here..
4)Andy your response you say
5)Andy in your response you say:
6)Andy in your response you say
7)In response to the mail we where sent on the 8th: The auctions in question closed on the 26 January. According to the terms of the auction we all had to make payment before 29 January. How does sending us an email on the 8th feb after every buyer has already paid help?? Its just so that bidorbuy can come on posts like this and say... we told everyone not to pay him... Again bid or buy too late and not helping the real situation at all, just trying to come out of this looking okay. ANDY WHAT YOU NEED TO REALISE IS THAT THE WAY YOU COME OUT OF THIS WILL BE DETERMINED BY YOUR ACTIONS AND NOT YOUR PROPOGANDA TACTICS AND FALSE WORDS!
8)We are currently in talks with attorneys and as sad as this is for me, it seems as though we will definitly be taking class action against bidorbuy and also personally pending attorneys advice.
9)Unfortunitly I dont have the time to sit here responding to all the false information, but i urge everyone to look at all the facts and carefully because regradless of what the article/bidorbuy says FROM EVERY BUYERS PERSPECTIVE WHO WAS SCAMMED HERE FOR MORE THAN R3000 I CAN TELL YOU THAT WE ARE ALL DISGUTED WITH BIDORBUY WHO HAS ACTED SHAMELESSLY HERE.
10)Sam Naidoo the only person who knows whats going on here was allowed to go on leave this week, when Andy knew that we where all dealing with here in this matter. Another example of how proactive Bidorbuy is being She will be away for a month for the record.. Shows how concerned bidorbuy is..
11)In response to DF:
12)I love the way that Andy says:
First of all and in true andy style it makes it sortof unclear that he is saying that I will be compensated R3000 of my R25000 theft. Which is a joke anyway, how can the most protection you offer be 15% of my bid. Thats not protection??!! Its untrue to call it a buyer protection program, it should be called a buyer rape program, where you screw your bread and butter.
Secondly what about all the other buyers who paid over R10000. There was 2 buyers who paid +- R10500 each for smaller screens, 2 buyers who paid R17000+ for laptops and these are just the ones I know of?! Again shows your style, because im making a noise you will assist me(i use the word assist with sarcasism), but not the others in my boat.. Dont worry, we will be making a very big noise very soon!!
Yours truly and extremly concerned.
Philip Kalinko
www.perkalgifts.co.za
1)Samantha definitly said this and in those words (not exact, but to the exact affect).
2)I have it from a very relaiable source that Digital Mall (where bidorbuy is housed) records all conversations. We are currently legally trying to obtain these conversations.
3)I wouldnt be surprised if they go missing from the way in which bidorbuy is acting here..
4)Andy your response you say
Does this mean that after the few days needed o wait for information, you plan to act any ifferently? Private invistigators are supposed to be hired to find someone, Noone has tried to do this??? You are quoted as saying you hired private invistigators however is any investigator you spoke to getting paid for these services?? Andy i cannot believe how low you are going here and think it is truly a sad day to see you dragging bidorbuy into the ground. Your actions here affect me as seller too as by exposing your company for the proganda filled bubble it is, you are in turn destroying a company that www.perkalgifts.co.za relies on
5)Andy in your response you say:
Here you admit that you are still drafting communication to the buyers currently, however on the 13th you placed this article in question, statiung how wonderfull you are in resolving this??? In your mind and from your response this hasnt ben resolved and so why did you okay this false article. We all know bidorbuy purchased shares in Jump and I come on to this site to find Jump sponsorship, is this how you where able to organise a false articel on an otherwise reliable site?
6)Andy in your response you say
Andy how is this being proactive? Actions speak louder than words. How is paying R3000 to buyers who where taken for more than R25000 being proative? How does that send the right message to future scammers thinging of doing the same thing? Hell had we known we could just accept money and not send anything on bidorbuy we wouldnt have sat here for 4 years working tirously to keep everyone of our bidorbuy clients satisfied! How can any future buyer or seller trust bidorbuy when a verified seller with only positive feedback and has been a member for years (all the things that you say are needed to ensure that he is legit) defrauds us all and when this nightmare happens and you fail us like you have here? BEING PROACTIVE MEANS TAKING OWNERSHIP OF THE SITUATION, IT MEANS THAT WHEN SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAPPENS YOU USE AT AS AN OPPORTUNITY TO SET A PRECEDENT AND CLAMP DOWN ON THIS FROM HAPPENING. You want to be considerd an industry leader in online shopping in S.A however when the time has come for you to lead us, you act as you have here..
7)In response to the mail we where sent on the 8th: The auctions in question closed on the 26 January. According to the terms of the auction we all had to make payment before 29 January. How does sending us an email on the 8th feb after every buyer has already paid help?? Its just so that bidorbuy can come on posts like this and say... we told everyone not to pay him... Again bid or buy too late and not helping the real situation at all, just trying to come out of this looking okay. ANDY WHAT YOU NEED TO REALISE IS THAT THE WAY YOU COME OUT OF THIS WILL BE DETERMINED BY YOUR ACTIONS AND NOT YOUR PROPOGANDA TACTICS AND FALSE WORDS!
8)We are currently in talks with attorneys and as sad as this is for me, it seems as though we will definitly be taking class action against bidorbuy and also personally pending attorneys advice.
9)Unfortunitly I dont have the time to sit here responding to all the false information, but i urge everyone to look at all the facts and carefully because regradless of what the article/bidorbuy says FROM EVERY BUYERS PERSPECTIVE WHO WAS SCAMMED HERE FOR MORE THAN R3000 I CAN TELL YOU THAT WE ARE ALL DISGUTED WITH BIDORBUY WHO HAS ACTED SHAMELESSLY HERE.
10)Sam Naidoo the only person who knows whats going on here was allowed to go on leave this week, when Andy knew that we where all dealing with here in this matter. Another example of how proactive Bidorbuy is being She will be away for a month for the record.. Shows how concerned bidorbuy is..
11)In response to DF:
100% DF and this will be prooved in a court of law.
12)I love the way that Andy says:
First of all and in true andy style it makes it sortof unclear that he is saying that I will be compensated R3000 of my R25000 theft. Which is a joke anyway, how can the most protection you offer be 15% of my bid. Thats not protection??!! Its untrue to call it a buyer protection program, it should be called a buyer rape program, where you screw your bread and butter.
Secondly what about all the other buyers who paid over R10000. There was 2 buyers who paid +- R10500 each for smaller screens, 2 buyers who paid R17000+ for laptops and these are just the ones I know of?! Again shows your style, because im making a noise you will assist me(i use the word assist with sarcasism), but not the others in my boat.. Dont worry, we will be making a very big noise very soon!!
Yours truly and extremly concerned.
Philip Kalinko
www.perkalgifts.co.za
Last edited:
bidorbuy's Original Press Release and Actions
I am Gillian Meier, Business Manager at bidorbuy.co.za. In a prior post, Philip wanted to know who put the press release together. It was prepared by myself and as such, I consider Philip's numerous attempts to insult the accuracy of the information contained therein rather upsetting. Philip and I have met before, and I personally do not believe that he is the type of person to try to shoot himself in the foot by creating false interpretations of our media release in an attempt to drive potential buyers away from bidorbuy which may ultimately affect not only your own bottom line, but the bread and butter of other sellers as well.
I think the time has come for me to publish the press release on this thread so that everyone can see that in no way did bidorbuy publish false claims.
1. bidorbuy did at no point claim to 'close the matter'.
2. bidorbuy takes this matter very seriously
3. bidorbuy has itself instructed all buyers involved to lay a charge in support of the case.
4. bidorbuy has hired private investigators, is making use of tracing services and has itself laid a charge of fraud against DFO with SAPS.
We are making every possible effort to resolve the issue and to track DFO in order to make sure that justice prevails. The bidorbuy users are extremely important to us, which is why we immediately drafted a letter stating our assumptions at the time and actions taken on the very day that it was brought to our attention that fraud had been committed.
I immediately drafted a press release in order to illustrate that bidorbuy will NOT hide this very serious issue and in fact, as harmful as the press release may have been to bidorbuy, we have been completely honest in all our claims within the release as we believe that in this instance we have to be transparent and proactive and make it known that we WILL DO everything in our power to resolve this and to find DFO.
No matter what has been said between bidorbuy and Philip, the truth is that we are working around the clock to resolve this and as such, having to spend time on threads, posting replies to incorrect claims by our users is distracting our focus from the real issue at hand. However, since so many of our actions have been twisted so badly, we have no choice but to respond to them.
So please note that at no stage did bidorbuy say that we had closed the matter. We are very proactive in this instance and believe that it is of the highest priority for us to look after the best interests of our traders (Philip included) and to protect not only the bidorbuy business model, but the online industry in general.
So Philip (and all other affected parties), we take this matter as seriously as humanly possible. We are doing everything to track DFO in order to serve justice! We urge all buyers affected to please submit your documentation to us as requested in order for us to supply the investigators with the information needed in order to bring DFO to justice.
Any information in support of the direct incident involved must please be sent to bidorbuy as soon as possible so that we have all the supporting documentation to have a stronger case against DFO.
I agree that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I understand that when you walk into a real store in the attempt to buy something from them and a thief walks past and steals your wallet, that you are angry. I know that your initial instinct and anger is directed towards the store. However, when the store does everything possible to try to assist you in catching that thief, you should grab hold of that and work together with them to catch the criminal. Spending every waking moment trying to knock their credibility and to twist their "words" is not going to do anyone any good.
So for the benefit of those who believe the bidorbuy press release was anything but honest and in support of trying to find DFO, please see the initial press release issued to all major publications countrywide. In a telephonic interview with MyADSL, we were asked about our actions to which Andy responded that we had hired a private investigator to assist us, however that at THAT POINT IN TIME we had not yet tracked him down. Nowhere did we say that we were not still trying! We did not say that we hired an investigator for 3 days and the matter is now closed.
In fact, bidorbuy has subsequently increased its efforts in trying to find DFO. We do not believe it is in the financial interest of every individual buyer to hire their own investigator since bidorbuy is prepared to take on this and hence, we ask you for your support in providing us with case numbers, documentation and the like.
Philip's "joking" comment that Andy Higgins (MD of bidorbuy) is in fact DFO is not only a very heated comment in support of his frustration, it is also defamatory. Furthermore, his comment that bidorbuy 'creates' online fraud as opposed to 'combats' online fraud, is against everything that we believe in and it should be evident from our actions to date that we are in fact doing everything to combat fraud - for goodness sake, if we didn't we would be killing our own business and damaging the businesses of so many sellers and buyers who rely on bidorbuy - such as Perkal gifts.
We care about our customers (buyers and sellers alike) and in situations like this it is important that our community stand together to fight crime as opposed to attack one another when the enemy is the criminal!
We continue to do everything possible to find DFO and to serve justice. Not only has those buyers who bought from him been affected, so has bidorbuy. So it's without saying that this matter gets our utmost highest priority in every area!!!
Click here to view the press release posted on the bidobuy.co.za forum.
I am Gillian Meier, Business Manager at bidorbuy.co.za. In a prior post, Philip wanted to know who put the press release together. It was prepared by myself and as such, I consider Philip's numerous attempts to insult the accuracy of the information contained therein rather upsetting. Philip and I have met before, and I personally do not believe that he is the type of person to try to shoot himself in the foot by creating false interpretations of our media release in an attempt to drive potential buyers away from bidorbuy which may ultimately affect not only your own bottom line, but the bread and butter of other sellers as well.
I think the time has come for me to publish the press release on this thread so that everyone can see that in no way did bidorbuy publish false claims.
1. bidorbuy did at no point claim to 'close the matter'.
2. bidorbuy takes this matter very seriously
3. bidorbuy has itself instructed all buyers involved to lay a charge in support of the case.
4. bidorbuy has hired private investigators, is making use of tracing services and has itself laid a charge of fraud against DFO with SAPS.
We are making every possible effort to resolve the issue and to track DFO in order to make sure that justice prevails. The bidorbuy users are extremely important to us, which is why we immediately drafted a letter stating our assumptions at the time and actions taken on the very day that it was brought to our attention that fraud had been committed.
I immediately drafted a press release in order to illustrate that bidorbuy will NOT hide this very serious issue and in fact, as harmful as the press release may have been to bidorbuy, we have been completely honest in all our claims within the release as we believe that in this instance we have to be transparent and proactive and make it known that we WILL DO everything in our power to resolve this and to find DFO.
No matter what has been said between bidorbuy and Philip, the truth is that we are working around the clock to resolve this and as such, having to spend time on threads, posting replies to incorrect claims by our users is distracting our focus from the real issue at hand. However, since so many of our actions have been twisted so badly, we have no choice but to respond to them.
So please note that at no stage did bidorbuy say that we had closed the matter. We are very proactive in this instance and believe that it is of the highest priority for us to look after the best interests of our traders (Philip included) and to protect not only the bidorbuy business model, but the online industry in general.
So Philip (and all other affected parties), we take this matter as seriously as humanly possible. We are doing everything to track DFO in order to serve justice! We urge all buyers affected to please submit your documentation to us as requested in order for us to supply the investigators with the information needed in order to bring DFO to justice.
Any information in support of the direct incident involved must please be sent to bidorbuy as soon as possible so that we have all the supporting documentation to have a stronger case against DFO.
I agree that everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I understand that when you walk into a real store in the attempt to buy something from them and a thief walks past and steals your wallet, that you are angry. I know that your initial instinct and anger is directed towards the store. However, when the store does everything possible to try to assist you in catching that thief, you should grab hold of that and work together with them to catch the criminal. Spending every waking moment trying to knock their credibility and to twist their "words" is not going to do anyone any good.
So for the benefit of those who believe the bidorbuy press release was anything but honest and in support of trying to find DFO, please see the initial press release issued to all major publications countrywide. In a telephonic interview with MyADSL, we were asked about our actions to which Andy responded that we had hired a private investigator to assist us, however that at THAT POINT IN TIME we had not yet tracked him down. Nowhere did we say that we were not still trying! We did not say that we hired an investigator for 3 days and the matter is now closed.
In fact, bidorbuy has subsequently increased its efforts in trying to find DFO. We do not believe it is in the financial interest of every individual buyer to hire their own investigator since bidorbuy is prepared to take on this and hence, we ask you for your support in providing us with case numbers, documentation and the like.
Philip's "joking" comment that Andy Higgins (MD of bidorbuy) is in fact DFO is not only a very heated comment in support of his frustration, it is also defamatory. Furthermore, his comment that bidorbuy 'creates' online fraud as opposed to 'combats' online fraud, is against everything that we believe in and it should be evident from our actions to date that we are in fact doing everything to combat fraud - for goodness sake, if we didn't we would be killing our own business and damaging the businesses of so many sellers and buyers who rely on bidorbuy - such as Perkal gifts.
We care about our customers (buyers and sellers alike) and in situations like this it is important that our community stand together to fight crime as opposed to attack one another when the enemy is the criminal!
We continue to do everything possible to find DFO and to serve justice. Not only has those buyers who bought from him been affected, so has bidorbuy. So it's without saying that this matter gets our utmost highest priority in every area!!!
Click here to view the press release posted on the bidobuy.co.za forum.
drowssap
Well-Known Member
one question has not been answered ... has DFO paid BoB for the successful auction (sellers fees)?
BoB,
If you are able to purchase 22% share in jump.co.za then certainly you have the financial reserves to cover DFO's (and any other wannabe DFO) fraudulent sales and give us your 'bread and butter' customer peace of mind ... R3000 for R10000+ spend via BoB VERIFIED SELLER is an insult!
"If you were gaurenteed a return of R1,000,000 for R100,000 spend" Would you do it BoB? You stand to lose far more if you don't. PUT YOUR CUSTOMER FIRST AND NOT YOUR PURSE! The BIG reward will come.
Hopefully ZA's online community will learn and grow from this.
BoB,
bizcommunity.com said:
If you are able to purchase 22% share in jump.co.za then certainly you have the financial reserves to cover DFO's (and any other wannabe DFO) fraudulent sales and give us your 'bread and butter' customer peace of mind ... R3000 for R10000+ spend via BoB VERIFIED SELLER is an insult!
"If you were gaurenteed a return of R1,000,000 for R100,000 spend" Would you do it BoB? You stand to lose far more if you don't. PUT YOUR CUSTOMER FIRST AND NOT YOUR PURSE! The BIG
reward will come.Hopefully ZA's online community will learn and grow from this.
Seeing that the success fese are only debited to your credit card one month after the sales has gone through - i doubt BoB is getting anything from the DFO sales.
Buy yeah, could a member of the BoB admin please answer the question for us.