Bitcoin Thread

[SaiyanZ]

For those on bitmex kindly clarify something for me. Suppose one goes short at 12k with a take profit limit at 11k. Then sets a stop limit later once the trade has been going on for a while for say 11.9k just incase price retraces - does the stop limit cancel out the take profit and will the stop limit even work when it is set after the entry price. I.e would a stop limit work when set at 11.9k or does it have to be set below entry at say 12.1k? Hope I make sense.

Whichever stop is hit first will always work. Then if you have ticked "close on trigger", the 2nd one won't work. If you have not ticked "close on trigger", the 2nd one will open a new position (if it is hit later).

PS. I don't recommend using limit stops. It's risky as the order may never close. I always use market stops.

 

[phly]

Whichever stop is hit first will always work. Then if you have ticked "close on trigger", the 2nd one won't work. If you have not ticked "close on trigger", the 2nd one will open a new position (if it is hit later).

PS. I don't recommend using limit stops. It's risky as the order may never close. I always use market stops.

That's the problem I had. The stop did not work and so my tiny account got wiped out. It's the first time this is happening so I was trying to find out if it was something I did wrong on my end - or I was a victim of an order that did not fulfill. I have heard horror stories that it can happen but never thought I would witness it in my short life. Sigh ... back to the drawing board.

 

[SaiyanZ]

That's the problem I had. The stop did not work and so my tiny account got wiped out. It's the first time this is happening so I was trying to find out if it was something I did wrong on my end - or I was a victim of an order that did not fulfill. I have heard horror stories that it can happen but never thought I would witness it in my short life. Sigh ... back to the drawing board.

You have to have un-ticked "post only" for the limit stop order not to fail most of the time. It might still fail then if the price bounces quickly.

Market stops will always force close your position at whatever the price is when the stop is hit.

 

[phly]

You have to have un-ticked "post only" for the limit stop order not to fail most of the time. It might still fail then if the price bounces quickly.

Market stops will always force close your position at whatever the price is when the stop is hit.

nothing had changed - close on trigger is ticked as usual and post only is unticked - so i do not know how it happened. In any case - I have learnt my lesson. I am not one to use stops due to how volatile things can be and using cross margin is due to knowing that my stops will execute irrespective of what happens.

In any case it's a lesson learnt. A painful one but a lesson nevertheless.

 

[SaiyanZ]

nothing had changed - close on trigger is ticked as usual and post only is unticked - so i do not know how it happened. In any case - I have learnt my lesson. I am not one to use stops due to how volatile things can be and using cross margin is due to knowing that my stops will execute irrespective of what happens.

In any case it's a lesson learnt. A painful one but a lesson nevertheless.

If the price bounces quickly whilst the exchange is overloaded then the stop limit will fail. That's probably what happened.

 

[phly]

If the price bounces quickly whilst the exchange is overloaded then the stop limit will fail. That's probably what happened.

So annoying to have to start again from scratch - they are the most liquid yes but I see why people are migrating over to the alternatives. I'll give Bybit a chance but then again there is the old saying - rather the devil you know ...

Thanks though for shedding light on what probably happened as it had me confused.

 

[Swa]

Gotta love how this thing just keeps going against everyone's TA.

TA has been completely out the window since the last few months. Nothing happens as predicted. Could mean one of three things. Either everyone's gotten wise to it and is trading more naturally, it's being manipulated more than usual, or just complete fomo.

 

[Swa]

Yeah what a train wreck. If on Bitmex I still think it's safest to look for a short around here with stop loss at entry. If the price goes up you still score in USD. If it goes down you score from your position. Can't lose either way. I've just 1x short my entire balance here to lock in USD profit until I have time to trade later.

If you long and it goes down then it's possible to lose a lot of USD/ZAR equivalent.

So you're saying if you short your entire balance it doesn't matter how much it goes up you'll still have the same USD value on close?

 

[SaiyanZ]

So you're saying if you short your entire balance it doesn't matter how much it goes up you'll still have the same USD value on close?

Yeah. 1x short on Bitmex is like holding USD. Liquidation is at $100mill so that doesn't matter too. Whenever the price rises a lot like this morning and I know I'm not going to be able to trade, I just go 1x short.

It's also an easy way to see how much your BTC is worth in USD.

 

[Swa]

Yeah. 1x short on Bitmex is like holding USD. Liquidation is at $100mill so that doesn't matter too. Whenever the price rises a lot like this morning and I know I'm not going to be able to trade, I just go 1x short.

It's also an easy way to see how much your BTC is worth in USD.

That's good to know. I was irked about the BTC thing as it doesn't come naturally for me and I'm mainly interested in keeping my value rather than hodling BTC. This may be an option for me but then I'd have to always be in some trade.

 

[SaiyanZ]

That's good to know. I was irked about the BTC thing as it doesn't come naturally for me and I'm mainly interested in keeping my value rather than hodling BTC. This may be an option for me but then I'd have to always be in some trade.

If you are concerned about preserving USD then you could also go 2x short with half your BTC balance and then trade with the other half. The short will ensure you preserve your USD value whilst you can still trade with the other half.

 

[phly]

If you are concerned about preserving USD then you could also go 2x short with half your BTC balance and then trade with the other half. The short will ensure you preserve your USD value whilst you can still trade with the other half.

But two accounts needed in this instance right? Coz I doubt you can have both a long and a short position open.

 

[SaiyanZ]

But two accounts needed in this instance right? Coz I doubt you can have both a long and a short position open.

Yep two accounts. Not much of a problem with Bitmex and transfers between accounts are free and instant.

 

[Knyro]

Yep two accounts. Not much of a problem with Bitmex and transfers between accounts are free and instant.

Still dumb though. On forex platforms you can have a long and a short open simultaneously on the same account. Even multiple longs and shorts from the same price or different prices on the same trading pair.

Don't know why bitmex doesn't implement this.

 

[John Tempus]

Still dumb though. On forex platforms you can have a long and a short open simultaneously on the same account. Even multiple longs and shorts from the same price or different prices on the same trading pair.

Don't know why bitmex doesn't implement this.

Ive asked bitmex why there is no isolated trading positions and they told me in summary "Our liquidity system does not work well this way bla bla bla but we might consider it in the future"

I hate the fact I have to run multiple accounts where if they simply allowed split and isolated trading positions anything and everything could be done multiple ways in a single account.

Call me suspicious but I almost feel they force it this way for the vast majority of traders who cannot fund multiple accounts to just keep filling a losing trading margin even though the trade is going to get squeezed out eventually.

Think of this way. If someone open a short with $xxx and the short is turning into a losing direction the only thing they can do is either exit with a loss or add even more to the same position to increase its margin in hopes it survives. This inevitably ensures much more liquidations than if the same trader could "writeoff" the losing short and just open a new isolated short or long to offset potential short getting liquidated.

So yes tinfoil hat or not, this is designed this way for a good reason, it ensures easier market liquidations long term for the vast majority of traders and Bitmex rake in much more profit from liquidations because they are all market orders so liquidations of $10million+ all at market orders just do the math each day bitmex raking in due to a broken design in my mind on purpose.

I was considering using PrimeXBT since they allow isolated trading but god that site looks like a money trap scam platform so pretty much stuck with Bitmex.

 

[Weasley]

I see we can use card on poloniex.com to buy btc

 

[4cer]

I see we can use card on poloniex.com to buy btc

If you like to live dangerously

 

[Countcrypto]

Well the 13k from the inverted head and shoulders was reached, but we're making higher highs and lows again, so shouldn't yet me the end of the current uptrend.

 

[SaiyanZ]

Lots of fomo and pushing yesterday. The only thing you can be fairly sure of now is that if it goes above $14k it's going to keep going.

 

[Swa]

Tether selling off again. People seem to have chosen $13k as the cashing out point.