Car finance

creeper said:
And that is why I have a nice spreadsheet that determines the best combo of deposit, discount and rate. Interesting thing is that discount is not given on the car I'm buying. Seems like it is a command from HQ. I tried 4 different dealerships.
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True - last year a Nissan dealer accidently left the deal-book open while attending to a customer and in that example a Nissan Murano was listed with RRP of 570K, dealerprice 480K and wholesale price of 390K. That alone should give you an idea of the margins across the fulfilment chain. I doubt that this is any different from other car dealerships and I also doubt that any car-dealer will honestly give you the wholesale and dealerprice.

Don't get me wrong, a dealership will still need to factor in operational costs, but it is not as bad as people make it out to be...
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
True - last year a Nissan dealer accidently left the deal-book open while attending to a customer and in that example a Nissan Murano was listed with RRP of 570K, dealerprice 480K and wholesale price of 390K. That alone should give you an idea of the margins across the fulfilment chain. I doubt that this is any different from other car dealerships and I also doubt that any car-dealer will honestly give you the wholesale and dealerprice.

Don't get me wrong, a dealership will still need to factor in operational costs, but it is not as bad as people make it out to be...
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So you hacked the dealership book :whistle; ;)
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
True - last year a Nissan dealer accidently left the deal-book open while attending to a customer and in that example a Nissan Murano was listed with RRP of 570K, dealerprice 480K and wholesale price of 390K. That alone should give you an idea of the margins across the fulfilment chain. I doubt that this is any different from other car dealerships and I also doubt that any car-dealer will honestly give you the wholesale and dealerprice.

Don't get me wrong, a dealership will still need to factor in operational costs, but it is not as bad as people make it out to be...
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I'm pretty sure that your figures are incorrect. Wholesale is always quoted with and without VAT on the list that you saw, i.e Dealerprice and Wholesale should be the same price with and without VAT, so if Dealer = 480, wholesale should be 421 and some change.

If the RRP price is correct, then Nissan is working on a 15% margin (more than double ours) and they can afford to give you crazy discounts or "Trade Assist" which will boost your trade in...
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
True - last year a Nissan dealer accidently left the deal-book open while attending to a customer and in that example a Nissan Murano was listed with RRP of 570K, dealerprice 480K and wholesale price of 390K. That alone should give you an idea of the margins across the fulfilment chain. I doubt that this is any different from other car dealerships and I also doubt that any car-dealer will honestly give you the wholesale and dealerprice.

Don't get me wrong, a dealership will still need to factor in operational costs, but it is not as bad as people make it out to be...
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Not sure what you saw, but those figures make no sense. Wholesale price? On a car? What, 25% off if you buy a 12-pack? :wtf: There's no way any car is sold at an 18.75% profit margin. A third of that would be closer to the truth.
 
HapticSimian said:
Not sure what you saw, but those figures make no sense. Wholesale price? On a car? What, 25% off if you buy a 12-pack? :wtf: There's no way any car is sold at an 18.75% profit margin. A third of that would be closer to the truth.
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I agree - that is why I tried to make sense of it in the post above - you will see that "a customer" saw it, not him. Could this be another one of those third and fourth hand fairy stories overheard in a pub, that suddenly become Gospel Truth?? ;)
 
Fazda said:
I agree - that is why I tried to make sense of it in the post above - you will see that "a customer" saw it, not him. Could this be another one of those third and fourth hand fairy stories overheard in a pub, that suddenly become Gospel Truth?? ;)
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Don't you just love how matter-of-factly such horse**** stories are recounted, though?

"I don't have a goddamn clue about this industry, but a friend of a friend of someone in my book club heard of someone who once saw a random sheet of paper upside-down, and dealers are thieves." :rolleyes:
 
HapticSimian said:
Don't you just love how matter-of-factly such horse**** stories are recounted, though?

"I don't have a goddamn clue about this industry, but a friend of a friend of someone in my book club heard of someone who once saw a random sheet of paper upside-down, and dealers are thieves." :rolleyes:
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Absolutely!

And that, dear friends, is how many of the "stealership" stories are spread, and in this particular case, "I read it on the internet" means that it is definitely true! ;) :p
 
I could quote the markups on parts some dealers charge ;)
 
Sinbad said:
I could quote the markups on parts some dealers charge ;)
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Parts pricing has no rhyme or reason to it. The agents want R12k for my car's clutch kit, which is beyond insane, but R400 ea. for vented front brake discs, which is so cheap I almost feel I should buy 5 sets.

However I've been 'round enough blocks to state with fair confidence that new cars are priced with fairly consistent margins between manufacturers.
 
HapticSimian said:
Not sure what you saw, but those figures make no sense. Wholesale price? On a car? What, 25% off if you buy a 12-pack? :wtf: There's no way any car is sold at an 18.75% profit margin. A third of that would be closer to the truth.
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No, figures were correct and prices were ex VAT. I was originally able to negotiate a 20K discount (i.e. 550K instead of RRP) but once I questioned the dealerprice of 480K I was able to push it down to 520K and adding a few extras. I am not saying that all dealerships work that way, but the price-sheet certainly looked official enough (it had all the models and variations in it and was in a branded folder, so not something I think I dealer individually make up). Needless to say, the sales guy was mightily pissed about me "rummaging" through his stuff (i.e. an open folder right in front of me, didn't even have to turn it around).
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
No, figures were correct and prices were ex VAT. I was originally able to negotiate a 20K discount (i.e. 550K instead of RRP) but once I questioned the dealerprice of 480K I was able to push it down to 520K and adding a few extras. I am not saying that all dealerships work that way, but the price-sheet certainly looked official enough (it had all the models and variations in it and was in a branded folder, so not something I think I dealer individually make up). Needless to say, the sales guy was mightily pissed about me "rummaging" through his stuff (i.e. an open folder right in front of me, didn't even have to turn it around).
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Maybe he played you and made you think you got a good deal but you actually didn't.
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
No, figures were correct and prices were ex VAT. I was originally able to negotiate a 20K discount (i.e. 550K instead of RRP) but once I questioned the dealerprice of 480K I was able to push it down to 520K and adding a few extras. I am not saying that all dealerships work that way, but the price-sheet certainly looked official enough (it had all the models and variations in it and was in a branded folder, so not something I think I dealer individually make up). Needless to say, the sales guy was mightily pissed about me "rummaging" through his stuff (i.e. an open folder right in front of me, didn't even have to turn it around).
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Nope, sorry. Still doesn't make sense. You either glimpsed figures which excluded the Murano's service plan - the vehicle and service plan are separate items on most manufacturers' dealer invoices - or you saw numbers pertaining to some incentive scheme. I'll be quite comfortable in taking a bet that no normal vehicle at normal price is retailed in SA at anything even close to those margins.
 
If we did work with margins like that, the faiytales about how much we earn might actually come true! :D
 
HapticSimian said:
Nope, sorry. Still doesn't make sense. You either glimpsed figures which excluded the Murano's service plan - the vehicle and service plan are separate items on most manufacturers' dealer invoices - or you saw numbers pertaining to some incentive scheme. I'll be quite comfortable in taking a bet that no normal vehicle at normal price is retailed in SA at anything even close to those margins.
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I would agree with you if it was anything else but a Murano - AFAIK there was really only one model (I don't even think there was a diesel variant or different engine sizes then) and it came with pretty much everything standard. The list had a ton of other variants in the Nissan stable including bakkies etc). Can't really say what the purpose of this list was, other than by the headings of the columns being RRP, DEALER, W/SALE - the "W/SALE" was my interpretation of "wholesale", but perhaps means something completely different - either way there were different price points as I mentioned.

I did try to find an electronic copy of the dealer quote and upload it here, but could only find my finance application (in which BTW over various emails SBSA beat ABSA with a prime -2%)
 
MagicDude4Eva said:
I would agree with you if it was anything else but a Murano - AFAIK there was really only one model (I don't even think there was a diesel variant or different engine sizes then) and it came with pretty much everything standard. The list had a ton of other variants in the Nissan stable including bakkies etc). Can't really say what the purpose of this list was, other than by the headings of the columns being RRP, DEALER, W/SALE - the "W/SALE" was my interpretation of "wholesale", but perhaps means something completely different - either way there were different price points as I mentioned.

I did try to find an electronic copy of the dealer quote and upload it here, but could only find my finance application (in which BTW over various emails SBSA beat ABSA with a prime -2%)
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I'm unsure of the relevance of there only being one Murano variant, which is incidentally still the case even with the current model. Regardless, a quote given to you wouldn't be of much help without seeing the dealer billing at the time... Long & short: If Nissan were working on those types of profits everyone in the industry would know it, and all salespeople would aspire to work for Nissan.

Prime -2%... which they subsequently declined. Must've been an appy that loaded your application. :p
 
Fazda said:
No. ;)

Those people getting deals below prime from Land Rover etc, is because the manufacturer has a scheme running with the bank.

Basically the bank is getting the discount, and not the buyer, but he scores on the lower interest rate - the car will be sold at full price - no discount.

In many cases, you would actually be better off taking a discount and getting interest at prime.
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This is truth, so much so that the specials where you get serious discounts are subject to brand financing (ie. BMW /ford /vw /whatever), they make up for the big discounts by loading the interest.
Does no favours for those of us who can organise prime less 2.5% or 3%.
 
So this is what I got this week. 9.25% Linked or 10% Fixed, going for the linked

By the way, what the hell is trade in assist?
 
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