Carte Blanche 29 July 2007

[mancombseepgood]

No-One is saying it doesnt work

He who alleges, must supply proof... until that state, IT DOES NOT WORK

Of course I can. I'll say it again: it doesn't work.

that machine is just a load of rubbish

It's bogus and does not work

He who alleges, has the burden of proof

Exactly my point, which brings me back to your earlier quote...

IT DOES NOT WORK

?

 

[icyrus]

Im convinced you don't understand Noxibox, no need to post lol

Your committed stance against logic and reason on this topic might lead some to wonder if you have a vested interest here.

 

[Ricard]

Exactly my point, which brings me back to your earlier quote...
?

Keep in Context... you seem to miss the point..

No-One is saying it doesnt work

He who alleges, must supply proof... until that state, IT DOES NOT WORK

It does not work until he proves to work! I did not say "IT WONT WORK". You fail to grasp the concept of basic logic. All I am saying is "Until there is an independent scientific audit on the black box, it doesnt even exist never mind work!"

I really am not bothered if you believe in pixies/fairies/goblins and such, but would you hand of R1 000 000 for him to further his device based on what you have read and see?

 

[mancombseepgood]

And similarly until there is proof that it doesn't work, you cannot claim point blank that it doesnt... even simpler logic to grasp. Something doesn't have to be passed by the scientific community before it exists... on the contrary - science is about discovery of things already there... at least that's what it should be about.
Why bring money into the equasion?

 

[mancombseepgood]

Your committed stance against logic and reason on this topic might lead some to wonder if you have a vested interest here.

Lol - do you not see my logic?
I imagine galileo et al had the same kind of critics...
the world was flat until proven otherwise...
to some it is still flat.
lol

 

[Ricard]

And similarly until there is proof that it doesn't work, you cannot claim point blank that it doesnt... even simpler logic to grasp. Something doesn't have to be passed by the scientific community before it exists... on the contrary - science is about discovery of things already there... at least that's what it should be about.
Why bring money into the equasion?

Its an easy way to extort money from corporations, thats why. Look at the recent Mega Diamond case.. the diamond didnt Exist! but people bought shares in it... now whats the difference in the Magical black box?

Draw some lines between Mega Diamond and MOS ... only 1 person has touched it, 3 people have seen it... and its never been analysed by any auditor.

If the MOS is a scientific breakthrough, then share it with the scientific world! .. why isnt he sharing it? Why let the world suffer heartache and pain when there is such a device that can show us all where loved ones / criminals are.

Why isnt he sharing his fantastic device? Waiting for the highest bidder? realised his practical joke went too far ?

 

[noxibox]

And similarly until there is proof that it doesn't work, you cannot claim point blank that it doesnt... even simpler logic to grasp.

So far there is no evidence that it works. His explanation of what is involved is vague at best. And that is being generous.

 

[chiskop]

Lol - do you not see my logic?
I imagine galileo et al had the same kind of critics...
the world was flat until proven otherwise...
to some it is still flat.
lol

Difference is that Galileo was able to prove he was right. This guy seems to avoid any opportunity of doing so.

 

[mancombseepgood]

So what? That's his prerogative...
Unless anyone can prove he is extorting money, don't let it get to you. My word people, surely no-one who is able to make a million bucks is about to fork it out on unproven "science".
If you feel so strongly about it, then ignore him and the gaget - noone is asking you to part with money or sing anyone's praises AFAIK.

 

[mancombseepgood]

Difference is that Galileo was able to prove he was right. This guy seems to avoid any opportunity of doing so.

And not without detractors either way - how long did this take?

he geocentric view had been dominant since the time of Aristotle, and the controversy engendered by Galileo's opposition to this view resulted in the Catholic Church's prohibiting the advocacy of heliocentrism as potentially factual, because that theory had no decisive proof and was contrary to the literal meaning of Scripture.[6] Galileo was eventually forced to recant his heliocentrism and spent the last years of his life under house arrest on orders of the Inquisition.

The last years of his life - i.e. after he died, it was accepted by the powers that be...

None of this is to say that the gadget works, but there is no point in declaring it a con until it has been proven to not work.

 

[chiskop]

<gives up arguing backwards logic with bradbowllama>

 

[JayM]

but there is no point in declaring it a con until it has been proven to not work.

I suppose you think the same of Nigerian 419 scams.

 

[Geriatrix]

This reminds me, what happened to that retired fellow and his anti gravity engine?

 

[mancombseepgood]

I suppose you think the same of Nigerian 419 scams.

Lol - elaborate and I'll tell you if I do or don't.
Do I think they are scams? Yes.

 

[Highflyer_GP]

I discovered proof of the tooth fairy and garden gnomes by using quantum mechanics. However I don't want to reveal any details - that must mean that Brad believes me

 

[icyrus]

I discovered proof of the tooth fairy and garden gnomes by using quantum mechanics. However I don't want to reveal any details - that must mean that Brad believes me

Amazing stuff quantum mechanics isn't it? As I have just discovered how to use it to make an ordinary rock protect you from any kind of harm. I will be selling it to the highest bidder, but unfortunately I can't reveal how it works. Trade secrets you know.

Brad, when will I be receiving your bid?

 

[Ricard]

said stuff....

back on to the money aspect... from a transcript of Carte Blanche..

Ruda: “Now imagine this: A person disappears, you find a few strands of hair left on a brush, you put those hairs into a gadget and that points out on a map where in the world that person may be.”

That’s exactly what a group of Bloemfontein businessmen claim they are able to do.

Steering the project is Danie Krugel, former police superintendent and current Director of Health and Safety at the Central University of Technology of the Free State.

Buisnessmen... the key word. Danie Krugel make/aquired this device in 2004. There is a rumour that some "Company" is bidding R13 Million for the gizmo.


Take a look at
http://skepdic.com/quadro.html
http://skepdic.com/refuge/dkl.html
http://www.randi.org/library/dowsing/


and some more

Varenda Gouws, 45, said Krugel led her and husband Willem on a wild goose chase after son Rayno, 20, went missing last year during a hiking holiday.

She gave Krugel a hair from Rayno's razor. He fed it into his Matter Orientation System, that he claims combines DNA testing and GPS - satellite technology to track down missing people anywhere in the world.

She said: "I can't say this machine doesn't work - but I know for a fact it didn't work for us."

Rayno had last been seen taking a bus to Knysna in South Africa's Western Cape region.

Varenda said: "First Krugel told us Rayno was still in Knysna so we went to Knysna. Then he said he was in Port Elizabeth 150 miles away so we went to Port Elizabeth. Then he was in East London so we went there. Then he told us 'No, he's in the Transkei.'

"It was an endless track. We drove through South Africa for 4,300 miles. He absolutely convinced us saying 'Rayno is moving'. He said he must be in a truck or a car because he was moving so fast.

"Every time we left our jobs and packed up and went to these places and put articles in the newspapers. It cost us a fortune.

"But it's not the money, it's the mental torture. Being told your child is all right, he's moving around. We thought, 'Why doesn't he contact us?'"

Rayno's remains were eventually found eight months after he vanished in a forest outside Knysna. It is thought he died from a snake bite.

Varenda said: "It was clear that he had been dead for eight months because there was no flesh on the bones and there were ferns growing through the body.

"But when I phoned Danie to tell him, he was really aggressive. He said it was not possible. He blamed me.

"He said 'This is a lie. Nobody can tell you how long a body is dead'.

"He didn't want to hear he had made a mistake."

Varenda said that after her experience she would never recommend Krugel to anyone. She added: "He told us he could definitely find Rayno and we believed him. We trusted him. He told us he can find anybody, anywhere in the world.

"I feel betrayed. Eight months is one hell of a time to look for a child - to be told he is alive.

and some other Quantum Inventions
http://www.belt.demon.co.uk/product/quantum/quantum.html

The P.W.B. Quantum Clip is capable of manipulating certain inanimate material into a condition that mimics the quantum state of our living senses. To understand the importance of such a technique, it is necessary to realise that the human senses evolved in a world long before most of the materials within the modern environment existed. The human senses evolved to interact with certain, specific, energy patterns - namely other relevant forms of life.

The “YellO Power” is indeed a 30 quid power cable, of the type that you might colloquially identify as a kettle lead. It’s about a metre long and has a 3 pin 240v plug. This is their claim for efficacy, verbatim: “Replacing the mains cable to any of your hi-fi or home cinema components means they perform better, giving you less distortion, clearer pictures, and more musicality, so that you enjoy your music and movies even more!”

and to add some icing...
http://www.unicorn-dream.co.uk/destrier/

The site dedicated to Human-Equine Transformation

 

[JayM]

Do I think they are scams? Yes.

But why? You surely don't have proof that they are *all* scams?

 

[Highflyer_GP]

Amazing stuff quantum mechanics isn't it? As I have just discovered how to use it to make an ordinary rock protect you from any kind of harm. I will be selling it to the highest bidder, but unfortunately I can't reveal how it works. Trade secrets you know.

Yeah truly amazing. Unfortunately patents won't protect intellectual property either, further strengthening the case to keep it secret.

 

[mancombseepgood]

But why? You surely don't have proof that they are *all* scams?

Nope, I don't have proof, but I have my opinion, and I'm comfortable calling it that... I don't have a desire to prove something I don't care about... you form your own opinon.
I don't however claim "they" are all scams, whatever "they" may be that you have in mind.