Thank you. So all things considered the accusense DVR seems to be the slightly better of the two..?
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CCTV Camera System Recommendations?
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netstrider
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Feature-wise, yes.
Whether it's actually effective? I don't know.
Personally I'd go for the cheaper one.
Take the extra cash you save and get a surveillance HDD as opposed to a standard desktop drive rather - if you don't already have a surveillance drive.
Costwise they're exactly the same (from what I've seen).
Surveillance drive? Never heard of that before...
falcon786
Honorary Master
That is terrible advice,if you don't know you don't know.
Never bet against more accurate motion detection,there is nothing more worthless in this game than multiple false motion alerts(except for no motion alerts maybe).
The old school way of using CCTV for most old school installers is to capture sometimes worthless footage of your stuff getting stolen or your house getting burgled into.That is sometimes useful sometimes not.
With our fibre lines/LTE/5G high speed connections and tech these days the idea is to get alerts in real time so you can react and prevent it from happening or catch the perps immediately.
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netstrider
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Optimised for writing instead of reading.
netstrider
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If they are the same price then he may as well go with the "better" one.
From our experience selling various brands, Hikvision (not only them, it's a Chinese thing in general) always promises a lot of things and it hardly ever works as intended. Hundreds upon thousands of false alarms and hours spent tweaking only for the system to be thrown out for something that costs about 100 times more but works.
Therefore, for home, motion detection/line crossing should be fine.
falcon786
Honorary Master
Fair point,need to be sure it works in the first place before paying extra cash for chinese marketing BS.
But yes as you said if it's the same price he might as well go for the one with better claims.
furpile
Expert Member
Has anyone installed the Hikvision Acusense cameras yet? I was quoted on them instead of standard alarm system beams etc for outdoor, because of trees, dogs etc. Not sure how well they work as an alarm system and if you can integrate that into an existing alarm system?
Other option is to get standard cameras and use Blue Iris on a PC to do the AI bit? This has been mentioned before in this thread. I have an old i5 system that is running as Plex server, and I am starting to play around with a Home Assistant server on it as well. Will probably start with 4 cameras, max 8 in future maybe, so not a big system.
Other option is to get standard cameras and use Blue Iris on a PC to do the AI bit? This has been mentioned before in this thread. I have an old i5 system that is running as Plex server, and I am starting to play around with a Home Assistant server on it as well. Will probably start with 4 cameras, max 8 in future maybe, so not a big system.
falcon786
Honorary Master
That sounds interesting.Is acusense AI?
I've got the second option running,well....had, 2 cameras running on BI AI got knocked out by construction work a while back but it worked well for the time I had it.
Caught a guy breaking into our backyard at our business and surrounded the place with police to catch him.
furpile
Expert Member
Something the company didn't explain which I see now with the Acusense system, is that it only does 4 channel False Alarm filtering with the cheap cameras. You need the Acusense IP cameras to have more than 4 channels, which is what you would want for a security system.
securitynewsdesk.com
Four ways Hikvision can offer false alarm filter to SMB customers - Security News Desk UK
Hikvision allows businesses to enjoy the benefits of technology, while protecting their existing investment.
securitynewsdesk.com
furpile
Expert Member
Yes, it uses AI to detect people and cars.
Hikvision AcuSense
Hikvision AcuSense technology distinguishes people and vehicles from other moving targets. It takes alarm accuracy and search efficiency to a whole new level.
content.hikvision.com
I have talked a bit to CCTV Direct as well and did some reading. Seems you can do it cheap, which is the Acusense DVR and cheap cameras, then the DVR does the AI filtering but only on 4 channels. Or you can do it the expensive way, and use Acusense IP cameras that does the detection on camera. Much more expensive though.
Looking at costs, the basic system is roughly R7500 for a 8ch DVR and 4 cameras. Goes to R12500 for a 16ch and 8 cameras. But you still only have 4 "AI" channels so the rest are basically just normal cameras.
The IP system goes for R37k for an 8 camera system, and R25k for a 4 camera system (still 16ch DVR).
Going the Blue Iris route will cost R1500 for the software. Is the AI part extra cost? Can use any IP camera, so R1k to R2k per camera or fancy Hikvision IP cameras for R3k to R4k. Even Sonoff or other wifi cameras for non-critical areas. So say R8k for the cameras. Another R2k to R3k for a POE switch, that is roughly R13k for the system.
Roughly the same cost as the cheap 8 camera system. But could be better than the expensive system with the correct cameras? Am I missing something here?
falcon786
Honorary Master
Something the company didn't explain which I see now with the Acusense system, is that it only does 4 channel False Alarm filtering with the cheap cameras. You need the Acusense IP cameras to have more than 4 channels, which is what you would want for a security system.
Four ways Hikvision can offer false alarm filter to SMB customers - Security News Desk UK
Hikvision allows businesses to enjoy the benefits of technology, while protecting their existing investment.
That might just be enough actually,you don't actually need AI detection on all camera's for example indoor camera's at our business don't need them since there's rarely ever false alerts and we have indoor passives as redundancy and certain outside loading/storage areas where the camera's are used for staff monitoring are not in need of AI monitoring.
We needed them behind our business where there was a passage way that was always used as an attack vector and the gate/fence area at the front also where people could get in by jumping it from the front road,so 2 AI cams were enough in our case.
KevOfGoodHope
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The BlueIris route will definitely be the more flexible and "fun" option.
I got 9 POE cameras running (Dahua and HikVision) on my setup, no issues. Setting up the activation zones for motion detection requires more effort, but in the end it will be more flexible should you ever need to expand.
EDIT:
Cost for BlueIris is once-off as far as I could tell, I didn't have to fork out more for any extra features.
You mentioned that you are playing with Home Assistant, BlueIris actually supports MQTT, so you can setup BI to play along with HomeAssistant. It's quite awesome to see that motion detection alerts in your Home Assistant dashboard.
Another food for thought around the choice of camera. In my opinion, you don't need the super expensive 4K IP camera, anything more than Full-HD is sufficient, the important thing to check is stuff like WDR, Field-of-view (how wide does it see) and InfraRed/Low-light picture quality, i.e. number of InfraRed on the camera. The more it has the "brighter" the image in the dark would be. The point is to get a clear footage when it needs be, not to make a 4K movie
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falcon786
Honorary Master
Using their "Sentry" product would cost $5 per month for up to 5 camera's....that uploads motion detection to their cloud for processing which might not be to everyone liking ,we were fine with it since monitored area's were quite public anyway.....if you want local (on your pc) free AI processing then you'd have to mess with some deep stack AI processing tools which also work well apparently.
KevOfGoodHope
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I think Smart Sentry is not a BlueIris product offering, it's just that they support BlueIris as a feed for their "AI" processing for video footages.
Although I'm still on BlueIris V4, but I think V5 remains the same in terms or pricing strategy. It's an once-off charge for the license.
falcon786
Honorary Master
Blue Iris on it's own while being good won't eliminate false alerts to a point where they can replace an alarm beam or eliminate false alerts 90% of the time,for that you'd need AI post processing.Either through their Sentry option or via deep stack AI locally.
Another food for thought around the choice of camera. In my opinion, you don't need the super expensive 4K IP camera, anything more than Full-HD is sufficient, the important thing to check is stuff like WDR, Field-of-view (how wide does it see) and InfraRed/Low-light picture quality, i.e. number of InfraRed on the camera. The more it has the "brighter" the image in the dark would be. The point is to get a clear footage when it needs be, not to make a 4K movie
The best camera's these days have absolutely no infrared led's on them at all,instead they use Starlight low light sensors to give you 2 main advantages:
1.Full colour night vision.
2.They're not bug/insect magnets.
Also bear in mind that for areas like driveways especially or for anywhere you need to be able to identify faces or read number plates then a narrower field of view camera generally gives you better clarity if all other factors are equal,so that's the trade off and why you don't want a too wide field of view for your cam's,in generally anything around 90 degrees is reasonable.
KevOfGoodHope
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Can't debate on the false alerts from BlueIris... it is really frustrating when you have your camera checking over the front of your garage and every time a car passes by in the evening, you get an alert because of the frikken head lights!
I don't have camera with Starlight sensor, so can't really comment on the picture quality, but your comment on bug/insect magnet on the InfraRed led really got me laughing, so much truth!
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netstrider
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You could get 16 Channel Milestone for free.
Supports pretty much every camera manufacturer under the sun as well. Enterprise brand.
Hardware then is your own issue.
Pelco used to (maybe still have) DS Control point for 4 ch systems.
Axxonsoft also had (maybe still do) 16 channel free licenses.
Supports pretty much every camera manufacturer under the sun as well. Enterprise brand.
Hardware then is your own issue.
Pelco used to (maybe still have) DS Control point for 4 ch systems.
Axxonsoft also had (maybe still do) 16 channel free licenses.
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Anyone know where you can get those L-brackets to mount a camera onto? The ones that go up and out over your boundary wall in an “L” shape?
Obvious answer is to have one made, judging by how many are around I thought you could buy them off the shelf
Obvious answer is to have one made, judging by how many are around I thought you could buy them off the shelf
I thought so too but now I'm making my own.