CHANGE NEEDED: Start a career in PROGRAMMING.

maximus@123 said:
Hi Mike, thx for the advice. What would you recommend me doing. It really sounds like you know your programming!
Should I continue with my degree or focus on a specific programming language or course? I really want to start a career in programming as soon as possible and do not want to wait another 5 years until I finish my degree!

Any advice will be much apprciated.
Thanks.
Click to expand...

You have started your degree, so finish it. It WILL benefit you later in life. You can still learn to code while doing your degree and even get employed as a dev and complete your degree through unisa?
Depending on where you intend to go in life will depend on the path you choose.
As mentioned, if you want to climb into the senior ranks in business the degree will be vital. If you just want to code, not so much.

For example... I started coding at 15 (27 years ago) as a hobby. Only when I hit 24 did I realise that programming was something I could do as a job and generate an income from my hobby. I did not have a piece of paper to back up my knowledge so started a 3 year diploma in systems analysis and programming in C++ (this was my hobby language anyway). 4 months into the course I was offered employment and so began my career. I competed my diploma anyway (and in 14 months)!!

In 2004 I left permanent employment and became a contractor. I ran my own dev house for about 3 years and did not enjoy it as I don't like managing people and sitting in piles of meetings - I want to code. I have since remained an independent contractor and won't have it any other way. About the most senior I am interested in is team lead. I don't have a degree and no interest in one as management is just not something I am interested in.
You don't - repeat DON'T - have to get into senior management to earn good cash. If you focus on your development path and stay on top of new technologies related to your skill - you will earn good money.

Degrees are over rated now days IMO. It is often better to get into a specialised college that focuses on the skills you want to build on. Again - it depends on where you plan to be in 20 or 40 years.

A good way to learn is to copy other apps. Not to sell or anything, but to give yourself something to code. This is what I did before getting my diploma and getting employed as a dev. I would pick out an app I thought was pretty cool, and write a clone. It provokes thought like "How did they do that" and "what is the purpose of this functionality".

Related to your question on where to start.. I would say C# and MySQL or SQL Server. You will need to be equally skilled in a DBMS as this will serve as your backend data store for 99% of the projects you build in the business world (assuming this is where you want to go).
Java is also good, but not quite as good. C# has a lot of language constructs and features that I miss when I code in Java. Once you know C#, you will pick up on Java with no issue anyway.

Good luck with your new path. Coding is an extremely rewarding career. As my wife says - I don't work a day in my life. I still do my hobby, and generate an income from it. Not many people can say that!

Enough essay from a cellphone. Starting to ramble :)
 
solid advice from Mike, and I agree, C++ is a terrible language to start learning in 2013



except the "Java is also good, but not quite as good" part :p
 
maximus@123 said:
So, would you recommend continuing with the Informatics degree or do any or all of the below short courses:
Introduction to visual c sharp.net programming (76804)
C++ programming (70181)
Introduction to Java programming (70602)

As I really want to start my programming career ASAP.
Click to expand...
Finish the degree, always finish the degree. Most decent jobs require it as a prerequisite. Courses should only be taken to supplement your degree and expand in a particular field.

As for which language - mostly irrelevant. This is where a degree is more valuable in that it teaches you how to tackle problems and develop algorithms. Language is then mostly a matter of learning syntax.

Once you have that sorted, you can move on to which language you find interesting. I would suggest C# and Java as they're relatively simple to learn and are pretty similar syntactically, so switching between them should come easier.

Also, don't do it to chase the cash, you'll end up hating it when things don't go your way. You genuinely have to have a love for troubleshooting and debugging because you will run into frustration quite frequently.
 
Mike Smit said:
Degrees are over rated now days IMO. It is often better to get into a specialised college that focuses on the skills you want to build on. Again - it depends on where you plan to be in 20 or 40 years.
Click to expand...
Disagree on that point. If you don't have a natural talent for problem solving, and most people don't, then a degree is pretty important. You would know that it's not so much the ability to code that's important, as opposed to how you approach a problem.

I spent pretty much the whole of yesterday writing a 10 line script. This comprised about 15 minutes of actual coding, 45 minutes of testing and 6 hours of reading!
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
Disagree on that point. If you don't have a natural talent for problem solving, and most people don't, then a degree is pretty important. You would know that it's not so much the ability to code that's important, as opposed to how you approach a problem.

I spent pretty much the whole of yesterday writing a 10 line script. This comprised about 15 minutes of actual coding, 45 minutes of testing and 6 hours of reading!
Click to expand...

I don't have a degree so cannot argue your point. I have lead teams that consisted of degreed individuals that could not troubleshoot their way out of a wet paper bag though, so assumed troubleshooting was something you do or don't have.
 
francoisvr said:
A degree is merely a piece of paper that a prospective employer wants to see; I personally place no value on a degree.

Almost any skill can be mastered with enough practice.
Click to expand...

No, a degree program is an educational program that helps you to study and learn certain skills, specifically those skills that are generally more difficult to learn in isolation. That is why you should do a degree. A degree certificate is a piece of paper, much in the way that money is a piece of paper. Whether or not the individual actually internalized the information or gamed the exam, or if the degree program was of a poor standard, is a separate issue. The value of a relevant degree certificate, is that it tells the prospective employer, that you are more likely to have the relevant skills, not that you have them.

Mike Smit said:
As mentioned, if you want to climb into the senior ranks in business the degree will be vital. If you just want to code, not so much.

<...snip...>

I don't have a degree and no interest in one as management is just not something I am interested in.
You don't - repeat DON'T - have to get into senior management to earn good cash. If you focus on your development path and stay on top of new technologies related to your skill - you will earn good money.

Degrees are over rated now days IMO. It is often better to get into a specialised college that focuses on the skills you want to build on. Again - it depends on where you plan to be in 20 or 40 years.
Click to expand...

This really depends - if you are talking about informatics type degrees that do little but teach you how to program, and the basics of project management, then perhaps (not saying that the degree and contents aren't worthwhile, just that the contents are relatively easily to self learn by a motivated individual). To the OP, are these really the only courses taught? Or are these just the programming courses?

Introduction to programming 1 & 2
Visual Programming 1 & 2
Advanced Programming

The value of a degree usually comes from learning new skills that are much harder to learn by one's self. Such as maths, stats, finance, economics, theoretical computer science, computer architecture, engineering, physics, chemistry, biology, management theory, etc.

The point here, is that these courses (if internalized) help you become a better developer, who can take a scientific approach to solving problems, with the extensive scientific tools that have been developed over the centuries, and knows more about how things "work" (vs. the layer of "magic" that many developers program to), allowing you to solve harder problems. The fact that the qualification makes it easier to move into management is purely incidental.
 
Hi Guys

I'm also interested in changing careers to programming. I currently Manage all the servers for a big Corporate company, do you think I would be able to use my current skills in a programming related field?

Reason I want to change is I don't do enough troubleshooting or problem solving and a lot of the times when you do find faults you have to wait for some software company to fix it I can't just fix it myself.
 
The following is only the programming modules covered in the Informatics degree:
Introduction to programming 1 & 2
Visual Programming 1 & 2
Advanced Programming

The degree also consist of modules like accounting, Human Computer Interaction, Computer Science, Business etc.
Though I do not have an interest in going into management, I purely just want to develop...
That is why I am wondering if I should continue with the Informatics degree or start with self studying on purely programming and start off with something like C#...

But I am still unsure were to start or go next.
My degree will take me about 4-5 years to complete, but I want to start my programming career as soon as possible and want to make use of all my spare time just to do programming. I really do not have an interest of doing the accounting and business subjects that's included in the degree.

Any advice on what one of you will do get my programming career on course?

Thanks for all the advice/info.
 
I'm quite keen on this, too. Also currently grinding away in the support department, unhappy, and not earning a great salary. Time for a change. Thanks for the inspiration, OP!
 
maximus@123 said:
The following is only the programming modules covered in the Informatics degree:
Introduction to programming 1 & 2
Visual Programming 1 & 2
Advanced Programming

The degree also consist of modules like accounting, Human Computer Interaction, Computer Science, Business etc.
Though I do not have an interest in going into management, I purely just want to develop...
That is why I am wondering if I should continue with the Informatics degree or start with self studying on purely programming and start off with something like C#...

But I am still unsure were to start or go next.
My degree will take me about 4-5 years to complete, but I want to start my programming career as soon as possible and want to make use of all my spare time just to do programming. I really do not have an interest of doing the accounting and business subjects that's included in the degree.

Any advice on what one of you will do get my programming career on course?

Thanks for all the advice/info.
Click to expand...

Sounds good. I suggest buying a C# and/or Java book, continuing with the degree and starting work when you feel that you are familiar enough with the material. I suggest doing as many hobby projects as you can to get fully acquainted.
 
I am doing a second year bsc informatics and have learned that understanding all the concepts ,principles and methodologies will help
code faster and and learn different languages quickly.

Guys if anyone who is busy with side projects or a contractor needs an assistant during weekends .I want to learn more in this field so i am offering my services for free .Please keep it in mind that i am a learner not a professional
 
I've been a developer for going on 14 years. I'd recommend getting the degree, it is going to mean a hell of a lot once you become a senior. I went the short course route and I am now regretting not having an IT degree (I am now doing it). Many companies don't even consider non-graduates. It gives you a much better understanding and foundation. IT (and programming) is a complex field, you can't learn it in a few months. But, having said that, you could maybe do a certification course, and start working while you continue with your degree. Offer to do a free internship. Send your CV to every company you can, big or small.
 
Okay, but which certification course would you guys recommend me doing in the mean time while doing my degree? As there are so many of them...
 
Looks like you looking for a quick solution max.Everything is a risk.Deep down you know what to do.Quick success doesnt last.Theres a demand for developers with analytical skills.So i would say pay the price get a degree some of the modules can give you a credit towards a certificate("I think")
 
maximus@123 said:
Hi all,

I have been working in the desktop support environment for the past 4-5 years. I wish to make a career change to programming, as I know there are much better job opportunities and it is more of a specialised field. And I wan't to start do something that is a lot more challenging!

First, I need to get the difference between the programming languages. When doing some research, I found that C#, Java, C++ and Java Script are the most common...

As I understand, if you know the basic concepts of one programming language, you pretty much know about 50% (or about) of the other languages?


My questions:

1. Which one would you guys recommend to start of first?
2. At which institution would you do the course? Remembering that I would have to do this part-time.

I went onto UNISA's site and found the following courses;

1. Introduction to visual c sharp.net programming (76804)
2. Introduction to Visual Basic .Net Programming (70122)
3. C++ programming (70181)
4. Introduction to Java programming (70602)

Any help/info from current programmers or anyone with excellent knowledge of the above would be much appreciated.

Thank you.
Click to expand...

Lesson 1: Go easy on the caps :D
 
OP, if you want some reading material I have some oldish books you are welcome too. I buy all my books via Kindle now so no need for hard copies.
While they are a bit dated, everything you learn will be used today.

https://db.tt/fXus4qHU
 
Last edited:
Mike Smit said:
OP, if you want some reading material I have some oldish books you are welcome too. I buy all my books via Kindle now so no need for hard copies.
While they are a bit dated, everything you learn will be used today.

https://db.tt/fXus4qHU
Click to expand...

Are you giving them away mike if so can i also please have some also.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X