I'm two years out of school with no paper degree. Your argument is invalid.
The only side-effect of not having a formal degree is that concepts such as polymorphism will be harder to understand, but fear not, donkeys shall be stallions.
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CHANGE NEEDED: Start a career in PROGRAMMING.
- Thread starter maximus@123
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I'm two years out of school with no paper degree. Your argument is invalid.
The only side-effect of not having a formal degree is that concepts such as polymorphism will be harder to understand, but fear not, donkeys shall be stallions.
francoisvr
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Which part of my argument do you find invalid? If anything I would say we are in agreement on the value we place on a degree.
senyetse
Senior Member
Actually, you don't really need to do a course to do a certification. Get a good certification study guide for C# or Java or whatever cert you decide to do. Check out the certification paths to see what you would want to do and with which cert you have to start with. There are usually 4 or so "modules" per certification. Once you have worked through the book then pratice, practice and then practice some more - do as many exercises as you can (programming is about practice). Once you are confident you know it go write the certification exam. Doing this way is going to save you a ton of cash. But, having done a undergraduate course in the basics of programming languages, data structures, analysis and databases is going to make studying for the certification so much easier. Ideally, you should finish the degree first , then get practical experience in the language you want certification in before you do the certification. But at the very least, do the first year degree courses I've mentioned, then try the certification. But then again you may have an aptitude for programming and could start with the certification. It all depends on what you are capable of and how much work you want to put into it.
senyetse
Senior Member
I'm busy with the BSc Informatics, don't shoot it down too soon, it is a good all rounder course. There are also courses in this degree in networks, databases, database design, analysis and design, data structures, software project management that will give you an excellent foundation as a programmer. INtro to Programming 1, 2 and Advanced Programming are all C++. Visual Programming 1 and 2 are Delphi.
The management courses are going to be invaluable if later on when you move to senior level. DO NOT quit the degree, you are going to regret it .
PS Have you looked at the BSc Computing?
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maximus@123
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Hi Senyetse,
Are you talking about BSc Computer Science? "PS Have you looked at the BSc Computing?"
I went onto lgit's website (http://www.lgit.co.za/index.aspx) and found that they offer the following courses:
- MTA: Windows Development Fundamentals
- Programming in C#
- Essentials of Developing Windows Store Apps using C#
- Advanced Windows Store App Development using C#
Each of the following courses about 5 days (except for MTA - 3 days) and to be done in this sequence.
What are your opinion on the above courses?
Are you talking about BSc Computer Science? "PS Have you looked at the BSc Computing?"
I went onto lgit's website (http://www.lgit.co.za/index.aspx) and found that they offer the following courses:
- MTA: Windows Development Fundamentals
- Programming in C#
- Essentials of Developing Windows Store Apps using C#
- Advanced Windows Store App Development using C#
Each of the following courses about 5 days (except for MTA - 3 days) and to be done in this sequence.
What are your opinion on the above courses?
senyetse
Senior Member
The BSc Computing at UNISA - it is their computer science degree. Unfortunately the don't have the 2014 curriculum on their website yet, but in 2013 it has the programming courses of the BSc Informatics but also has Theoretical Computer Science, Calculus, Linear Algebra, Formal Logic, Numerical Methods, Artificial Intelligence, amongst others.
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maximus@123
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And what about the following short courses:
- MTA: Windows Development Fundamentals
- Programming in C#
- Essentials of Developing Windows Store Apps using C#
- Advanced Windows Store App Development using C#
Each of the following courses about 5 days (except for MTA - 3 days) and to be done in this sequence.
- MTA: Windows Development Fundamentals
- Programming in C#
- Essentials of Developing Windows Store Apps using C#
- Advanced Windows Store App Development using C#
Each of the following courses about 5 days (except for MTA - 3 days) and to be done in this sequence.
senyetse
Senior Member
Those are the modules for the Microsoft Visual C# certification - the Windows programming stream. You can also do a web programming stream. Do you want to do Windows application development or web development? They are the standard Microsoft courses so it is a good certification to have. You can get books that deal with those courses. Just search for the exam codes - one example is the MCSD Certification Toolkit. I have the Programming in C# one which covers exam 70-483. Check out the certification page on the Microsoft website.
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maximus@123
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I was thinking more of going into Windows application development. Isn't that what C# is basically used for?
senyetse
Senior Member
C# is also used for web development. Have a look here: http://www.microsoft.com/learning/en-us/certification-overview.aspx. The devloper link.
senyetse
Senior Member
killerbyte
Expert Member
I have also been looking at changing up my life. I was originally thinking of aiming for a position in Network Admin (I am currently doing a CompTia N+) but all this talk of programming makes me think that I should consider it. Got friends in the industry and they are doing well for themselves.
Re-quoted for people that might have missed it.
Hi There
I found myself in the exact same situation as yourself. I worked in desktop support for three years, three long years. I contemplated my next career move, and programming was my calling. While listening to 702 one morning, I heard that Van Zyl and Pritchard (Yes, the college of our forefathers) were offering a free Java course. I wrote the competency test and was accepted immediately into the program.
The downside was that it was a full time course. However, I was surprised to receive an allowance every month while studying that covered my basic expenses etc. I would highly recommend this course, their applications are now open for February 2014. I was placed immediately in a job, and although I studied Java, I am now working as a C++ developer (The course focuses heavily on OO concepts and I found it extremely easy to adapt. Keep in mind that I knew absolutely nothing about programming before I started the course). The course is intense though, 65% average needed or you're out the door, and an exam every Friday. This in my opinion is the best way to jumpstart a career in programming, because you need no prior knowledge of programming at all. I am also a UNISA Informatics student, and without somebody to guide you and get your mind tuned for programming techniques it would be a massive challenge to do it yourself. The VZAP course will teach you a fundamental understanding of OO concepts and at the end of the five months, you will be put into a group and required to write a fully working system (ours was a simple POS system), at which point companies like Microsoft, BBD, Accenture, IBM and the likes will be present in class for your project presentation.
At least half of the class were offered jobs by Accenture at the end of the course, and the rest of the class were immediately placed into jobs in other big companies, myself included.
Pros:
Training provided is world class
Programming is taught from the ground up, so you don't need any prior knowledge or skills
Environment is friendly, you always get assistance when needed
The course is fun! The lecturer and style of teaching is one of the best I have encountered
Cons:
Full Time (Although an allowance is provided , usually between R4000 -R6000, which isn't bad for a full time student)
Intense course. New topics covered every week, 65% average on each exam to pass or you are excluded from the course
You will miss being a student once the course is over
By the end of the course you will have the skills to write complete Java programs (Database access, network, TCP/IP, UDP servers, etc).
If you are interested, here are the details:
Contact: Susan De Wet
[email protected]
011 447 6620
You will need to book a competency test and pass to qualify. Try and do really well here to be considered for the study allowance (70% and up)
Good luck, if you need any more info, I will gladly assist.
PS: This is not an advert for Van Zyl and Pritchard. I am just a student that qualified in June and employed by one of SA's leading software development companies, which is why I highly recommend this course.
I found myself in the exact same situation as yourself. I worked in desktop support for three years, three long years. I contemplated my next career move, and programming was my calling. While listening to 702 one morning, I heard that Van Zyl and Pritchard (Yes, the college of our forefathers) were offering a free Java course. I wrote the competency test and was accepted immediately into the program.
The downside was that it was a full time course. However, I was surprised to receive an allowance every month while studying that covered my basic expenses etc. I would highly recommend this course, their applications are now open for February 2014. I was placed immediately in a job, and although I studied Java, I am now working as a C++ developer (The course focuses heavily on OO concepts and I found it extremely easy to adapt. Keep in mind that I knew absolutely nothing about programming before I started the course). The course is intense though, 65% average needed or you're out the door, and an exam every Friday. This in my opinion is the best way to jumpstart a career in programming, because you need no prior knowledge of programming at all. I am also a UNISA Informatics student, and without somebody to guide you and get your mind tuned for programming techniques it would be a massive challenge to do it yourself. The VZAP course will teach you a fundamental understanding of OO concepts and at the end of the five months, you will be put into a group and required to write a fully working system (ours was a simple POS system), at which point companies like Microsoft, BBD, Accenture, IBM and the likes will be present in class for your project presentation.
At least half of the class were offered jobs by Accenture at the end of the course, and the rest of the class were immediately placed into jobs in other big companies, myself included.
Pros:
Training provided is world class
Programming is taught from the ground up, so you don't need any prior knowledge or skills
Environment is friendly, you always get assistance when needed
The course is fun! The lecturer and style of teaching is one of the best I have encountered
Cons:
Full Time (Although an allowance is provided , usually between R4000 -R6000, which isn't bad for a full time student)
Intense course. New topics covered every week, 65% average on each exam to pass or you are excluded from the course
You will miss being a student once the course is over
By the end of the course you will have the skills to write complete Java programs (Database access, network, TCP/IP, UDP servers, etc).
If you are interested, here are the details:
Contact: Susan De Wet
[email protected]
011 447 6620
You will need to book a competency test and pass to qualify. Try and do really well here to be considered for the study allowance (70% and up)
Good luck, if you need any more info, I will gladly assist.
PS: This is not an advert for Van Zyl and Pritchard. I am just a student that qualified in June and employed by one of SA's leading software development companies, which is why I highly recommend this course.
Nice moe but most of these companies require a degree.Just wondering whats the catch?
Thats the thing. There isn't one. I think back from the early days VZAP was and still is recognised as one of the leading traning providers in IT. With that being said, the course started off with 24 people and only 19 graduated, as people were getting kicked off week by week (like survivor, I know). VZAP has good relationships with all of the above mentioned clients, and when you are employed by them, its usually on a mentorship programme to get you into the groove of things. So basically they offer you a one year or six month contract and evaluate your performance in the company, while still getting paid a market related salary. The chances of not being offered a full time job after that is minimal, and if not, you have one year experience as a developer at a big firm. Win win I say.
So to answer your question, I dont have a degree, neither did anybody in our class, but were still employed and are currently being trained in technologies such as .NET, Oracle, Java EE and a few other certifications at the respective companies where they are now employed. In short, your training doesn't stop at Van Zyl and Pritchard, but it is an excellent way to get your foot in the door and fast track your way into a career where top quality training is provided. Besides, learning is a lifelong process no?
So to answer your question, I dont have a degree, neither did anybody in our class, but were still employed and are currently being trained in technologies such as .NET, Oracle, Java EE and a few other certifications at the respective companies where they are now employed. In short, your training doesn't stop at Van Zyl and Pritchard, but it is an excellent way to get your foot in the door and fast track your way into a career where top quality training is provided. Besides, learning is a lifelong process no?
xera
Expert Member
Don't bother with any form of VB...
I suspect the catch is that the students need to "pull-finger" and demonstrate some intelligence
The job market is and always will be saturated. Employers can afford to be picky. The advantage to employers that organisations like vzap offer is that vzap has filtered out all those wannabe programmers who wanted to be programmers, but simply don't have the aptitude for it. Well, not the java bit anyway. Having said that, not making it in IT is not necessarily a bad thing. It just means that this type of work is not for a particular person. They are more likely to find success in another field.