choosing not to vote

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Sherbang

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A friend decided that since he can't find a single party whose policies he agrees with, or any candidates who he trusts and respects, that he will abstain from voting.
He will vote by not voting. When I mentioned this to friends last night I was basically told he was a traitor and blah blah blah. But surely it is not only my democratic right to not vote, but my duty to abstain when I find all the options to be insincere, untrustworthy and power hungry?
What do you think?
http://eatliver.com/i.php?n=2982
 
joelus said:
A friend decided that since he can't find a single party whose policies he agrees with, or any candidates who he trusts and respects, that he will abstain from voting.
He will vote by not voting. When I mentioned this to friends last night I was basically told he was a traitor and blah blah blah. But surely it is not only my democratic right to not vote, but my duty to abstain when I find all the options to be insincere, untrustworthy and power hungry?
What do you think?
http://eatliver.com/i.php?n=2982
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A friend of a friend of a friend :D
 
I believe you must choose the lesser of the evils.

Say a country has 10 voters and 2 parties. 8 People vote for the one and 2 for the other. That's 80% of the seats in parliament for the big party and 20% for the small party.

Say one voter that would have voted for the smaller party decides not to vote.

Now 9 people would have voted. 8 votes for the big party and 1 vote for the small party. But now the big party gets 89% of the seats in parliament and the small one just 11%.

That one idiot didn't just take away from the small party, he also gave a vote to the big party.
 
marine1 said:
I think rather go and spoil your ballot.
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Does a spoiled ballot count as a "vote"? In other words, would spoiled ballots count when calculating percentage votes won for a given party? Would I be able to show displeasure at my choices by spoiling the ballot while at the same time helping prevent a certain party from achieving two thirds majority?
 
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orin76 said:
Does a spoilt ballot count as a "vote"? In other words, would spoilt ballots count when calculating percentage votes won for a given party? Would I be able to show displeasure at my choices by spoiling the ballot while at the same time helping prevent a certain party from achieving two thirds majority?
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No.
 
Pitbull said:
A friend of a friend of a friend :D
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:D Well, it is a friend who is not going to vote, but he and I (and everyone else) have the same rights. So while I will most likely be voting for cope, though I'm still not sure, I still have the right to not vote just like he does!
 
joelus said:
:D Well, it is a friend who is not going to vote, but he and I (and everyone else) have the same rights. So while I will most likely be voting for cope, though I'm still not sure, I still have the right to not vote just like he does!
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I right implies that it is right for you to choose to not vote. I say it's wrong.
 
Picard said:
I believe you must choose the lesser of the evils.

Say a country has 10 voters and 2 parties. 8 People vote for the one and 2 for the other. That's 80% of the seats in parliament for the big party and 20% for the small party.

Say one voter that would have voted for the smaller party decides not to vote.

Now 9 people would have voted. 8 votes for the big party and 1 vote for the small party. But now the big party gets 89% of the seats in parliament and the small one just 11%.

That one idiot didn't just take away from the small party, he also gave a vote to the big party.
Click to expand...

Well yes, but if both parties are evil power hungry bastards does it make a difference who wins what, the outcome is the same, different face, same nonsense. Surely if 7 of the 10 chose not to vote at all it would send a much stronger message of what people actually think of the situation. Even if one party gets 3 votes and another party gets 0, if 70% of the people chose not to vote it would make the government illegitimate.
 
joelus said:
A friend decided that since he can't find a single party whose policies he agrees with, or any candidates who he trusts and respects, that he will abstain from voting.
He will vote by not voting. When I mentioned this to friends last night I was basically told he was a traitor and blah blah blah. But surely it is not only my democratic right to not vote, but my duty to abstain when I find all the options to be insincere, untrustworthy and power hungry?
What do you think?
http://eatliver.com/i.php?n=2982
Click to expand...

He obviously doesn't value democracy. Honestly if people voted only for parties they who's policies they totally agreed with nobody would ever vote . :rolleyes:
 
joelus said:
A friend decided that since he can't find a single party whose policies he agrees with, or any candidates who he trusts and respects, that he will abstain from voting.
He will vote by not voting. When I mentioned this to friends last night I was basically told he was a traitor and blah blah blah. But surely it is not only my democratic right to not vote, but my duty to abstain when I find all the options to be insincere, untrustworthy and power hungry?
What do you think?
http://eatliver.com/i.php?n=2982
Click to expand...

And if you a begger and someone offers you a steak, a pizza, and a ham burger, you have the right not to eat any of it cause it doesnt agree with you, but if you dont eat anything, you not any better off then when you started. Might as well pick the best of the lot and at least get somewhere.
 
joelus said:
Well yes, but if both parties are evil power hungry bastards does it make a difference who wins what, the outcome is the same, different face, same nonsense. Surely if 7 of the 10 chose not to vote at all it would send a much stronger message of what people actually think of the situation. Even if one party gets 3 votes and another party gets 0, if 70% of the people chose not to vote it would make the government illegitimate.
Click to expand...

I don't know what electoral law says about a minimum voter turn out, but which scenario do you think Zuma & co prefer:

1. Winning 10 million out of 16 million votes.

or

2. Winning 10 million out of 13 million votes.

Do you really think the ANC will lament the fact that 3 million people (most of whom would probably not have voted for them anyway) chose not to vote?? They'll probably thank you for handing them the ability to unilaterally change our constitution.
 
I think your friend is talking $%#*. Of course you can't agree with every policy, but jeese man, this isn't IdealWorld(TM). Get your friend to vote for the best of the worse then.

Just do his bit to stop these ANC crooks from dominating.
 
Get your friend to vote for the ANC it has the same effect and atleast he's not a looser.
Old granny's have bigger balls than him, they stand in the sun in long cues to go vote.
 
Exactly. One more vote against the ANC brings us closer to keeping them from having the two third's majority.
 
It is anyone's right not to vote as it is my right to vote for anyone in the elections.

I think in a young democracy it can be considered a civil duty to vote. If someone fails to vote I think they automatically exclude themselves from complaining.

Alternatively your "friend" could start their own political party with the policies s/he has in mind.
 
MSB said:
Exactly. One more vote against the ANC brings us closer to keeping them from having the two third's majority.
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Why vote against them? If you're a comrade just stay at home your work is done:D
 
Real politics isn't about voting for your ideal candidate. Like anything else in life, you probably aren't going to find an "ideal" candidate who suits your political viewpoint entirely.

The reality of this year's election is that the ANC is going to win. If you vote opposition - COPE, DA, ID, IFP, FF+ - it doesn't really matter - it is a vote to reduce the power of the future government to make policy decisions unilaterally.

If the ANC maintains its super-majority in the National Assembly, it has the power to rewrite the Constitution. The interests of the ruling party and the state will remain utterly entangled.
 
Gaz{M} said:
I think your friend is talking $%#*. Of course you can't agree with every policy, but jeese man, this isn't IdealWorld(TM). Get your friend to vote for the best of the worse then.

Just do his bit to stop these ANC crooks from dominating.
Click to expand...

I guess it just reflects his ambivalence towards the whole thing. To him it makes no difference if the crooks are ANC dominated, DA dominated or a mixture of the two, no one wins anything except the politicians...

subculture said:
x
I think in a young democracy it can be considered a civil duty to vote. If someone fails to vote I think they automatically exclude themselves from complaining.
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He said that if he doesn't vote then he can't be held responsible when the government of the day, whoever it is, messes up, cause he didn't take part in the system he doesn't approve of it. Once you vote, you have no more right to complain since by voting you are agreeing to the rules and are agreeing to live by the outcome of the elections whatever it is. If you vote DA and the ANC wins a majority you have to accept that as being fair and accept the ANC led government as representing the will of the people.
Only those who don't give their consent to the election (by not voting) have a right to complain about the outcome, especially since they will still be paying taxes to whoever wins. I guess he feels disillusioned with the system, and doesn't want to be 'represented' by politicians he doesn't trust and doesn't believe in.

(I'm arguing on his behalf here to play devils advocate, but we did have quite a long discussion about it)
 
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