Developer position at Amazon Web Services

Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
14
#82
Regarding the Amazon Leadership Principles, I notice stuff like "Leaders... are right, a lot" is one of them, but "Leaders... have integrity" is not. Can we conclude that being right is more highly valued by Amazon than having integrity?
If you read up on the definitions of
* Earn Trust
* Insist on the highest standards
* Customer Obsession
* Ownership

These all speak to a need for integrity, as you're not going to achieve these without integrity
 
Joined
Mar 13, 2019
Messages
14
#83
I just want to write code, I don't care about leadership. Will I waste my time applying?
No software developer writes code in a vacuum, you design, build and maintain systems and code bases. This will always entail more than just churning out lines of code.

If you're a good developer, you won't be wasting your time applying. You will at the very least learn something from the experience
 

ArtyLoop

Executive Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2017
Messages
6,120
#85
Just look at how wonderfully they treat their "ordinary" workers overseas. 'nuff said.
Yep.. my wife remains in contact with some of her shipmates there.
The info we get, every now and then, that is sent to her colleagues still working there, is quite shocking.
 

sjm

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2009
Messages
792
#86
A number of people in this thread seem to confuse call centre agents working for Amazon with developers working for AWS, it's almost the same as saying "I refuse to work in banking IT because I've heard horror stories about how tellers are treated".

I'm in banking IT and there is no relationship between dev working conditions and teller working conditions, so I would never use tales of one to decide upon the other
 

eg2505

Honorary Master
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
14,913
#87
A number of people in this thread seem to confuse call centre agents working for Amazon with developers working for AWS, it's almost the same as saying "I refuse to work in banking IT because I've heard horror stories about how tellers are treated".

I'm in banking IT and there is no relationship between dev working conditions and teller working conditions, so I would never use tales of one to decide upon the other
you right,
but amazon is different, how they treat their workers is universal across the board.
read lots of feedback on glassdoor and indeed and other sites how poorly they treat workers.

from the tech support, to the devs, to the admin to the pickers working on the warehouse floor,

everybody gets treated the same, badly, except the top of the top dogs.
sure @ArtyLoop wife will back me up here.
 

CamiKaze

Honorary Master
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
12,894
#88
everybody gets treated the same, badly, except the top of the top dogs.
It always looks look like that when looking up the ladder but it's not really the case. The top dogs go through shst as well, at any private company.
However, there are people that are luckier than others or find themselves in a good fit every now and then where others have to go through difficult times.
Either way, move for money or growth, I think that things only become sour after you have spent too much time at any one company.
 

ArtyLoop

Executive Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2017
Messages
6,120
#89
you right,
but amazon is different, how they treat their workers is universal across the board.
read lots of feedback on glassdoor and indeed and other sites how poorly they treat workers.

from the tech support, to the devs, to the admin to the pickers working on the warehouse floor,

everybody gets treated the same, badly, except the top of the top dogs.
sure @ArtyLoop wife will back me up here.
Yes, unless you're some high-up manager / top dog, you're snake shiiit in that company.
 

eg2505

Honorary Master
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
14,913
#90
It always looks look like that when looking up the ladder but it's not really the case. The top dogs go through shst as well, at any private company.
However, there are people that are luckier than others or find themselves in a good fit every now and then where others have to go through difficult times.
Either way, move for money or growth, I think that things only become sour after you have spent too much time at any one company.
100% agree, problem comes when from day 1 at Amazon,
your treated like cr@p, and it only goes and gets worse,

look, I myself went on the interview journey with them, flew me down to CPT and everything,
nice 4 star hotel all the stuff.

but from my meeting some of the guys interviewing me,
got the impression they hire and fire very quickly, and job security is non existent.
also seems like a very stressful environment, and not good stress from what it seemed.
they apparently treat tech support very bad from a few people I spoke to before going
they kept asking the exact same 4 questions, over and over, like expecting me to give different answers each time.

I mean how many times can you answer are you a chicken? before you go crazy,
or maybe thats the secret there, ask you the same question dozens of times, like your joining a cult or something.

sure some people like them, and sure it depends who is your line manager,
but when so many people around the world all say the same thing, word for world almost.
one has to put aside your doubts, and start seeing them for a meat grinder that chews up people.
and desperately trying to fill open slots from people that burned out, from the stress.

otherwise why advertise all the time, unless they hire/fire people so often that they have to keep spreading good publicity around.
so people don't get wise to their schemes.

ask yourself this, if they so good, why aren't people clamoring to get hired by them?
 

CamiKaze

Honorary Master
Joined
May 19, 2010
Messages
12,894
#91
ask yourself this, if they so good, why aren't people clamoring to get hired by them?
HR at AWS told me that it's usually the guys that come straight out of varsity that gets the job simply because the theoretical stuff is still fresh.
 

eg2505

Honorary Master
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
14,913
#92
HR at AWS told me that it's usually the guys that come straight out of varsity that gets the job simply because the theoretical stuff is still fresh.
or as they not been through a meat grinder yet, so aren't afraid of something they haven't experienced yet.
:laugh:
 

cguy

Expert Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2013
Messages
4,429
#93
100% agree, problem comes when from day 1 at Amazon,
your treated like cr@p, and it only goes and gets worse,

look, I myself went on the interview journey with them, flew me down to CPT and everything,
nice 4 star hotel all the stuff.

but from my meeting some of the guys interviewing me,
got the impression they hire and fire very quickly, and job security is non existent.
also seems like a very stressful environment, and not good stress from what it seemed.
they apparently treat tech support very bad from a few people I spoke to before going
they kept asking the exact same 4 questions, over and over, like expecting me to give different answers each time.

I mean how many times can you answer are you a chicken? before you go crazy,
or maybe thats the secret there, ask you the same question dozens of times, like your joining a cult or something.
Congrats. You have figured out that quickly hiring and firing people, in order to not keep talent or preserve knowledge, and repeatedly retraining new tech support in their uniquely massive and complex infrastructure is the secret to becoming one of the most successful tech companies in the world. You have realized that treating people like crap, so that they quit has been proven to be highly effective in growing a business. You have also figured out that a hiring process, consisting of being asked the exact same 4 questions again and again is the way to vet the kind of employee who will help a company grow to the biggest and most successful in the world.

sure some people like them, and sure it depends who is your line manager,
but when so many people around the world all say the same thing, word for world almost.
one has to put aside your doubts, and start seeing them for a meat grinder that chews up people.
and desperately trying to fill open slots from people that burned out, from the stress.
Indeed...

"Amazon has replaced Google as the best place to work in the US"

https://qz.com/work/1236944/linkedin-amazon-is-a-better-place-to-work-than-google-apple-or-tesla/
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/07/google-amazon-top-the-most-attractive-employers-of-2018.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshbersin/2018/07/13/is-facebook-really-the-best-employer-making-sense-of-best-place-to-work-lists/


otherwise why advertise all the time, unless they hire/fire people so often that they have to keep spreading good publicity around.
so people don't get wise to their schemes.
Seriously? Because they're doing really well and are growing very rapidly.




ask yourself this, if they so good, why aren't people clamoring to get hired by them?
Umm... They are...

https://medium.com/@BlindApp/seven-reasons-why-engineers-want-to-join-faang-ec4f93374384
 
Last edited:

sjm

Senior Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2009
Messages
792
#94
100% agree, problem comes when from day 1 at Amazon,
your treated like cr@p, and it only goes and gets worse,

look, I myself went on the interview journey with them, flew me down to CPT and everything,
nice 4 star hotel all the stuff.

but from my meeting some of the guys interviewing me,
got the impression they hire and fire very quickly, and job security is non existent.
also seems like a very stressful environment, and not good stress from what it seemed.
they apparently treat tech support very bad from a few people I spoke to before going
they kept asking the exact same 4 questions, over and over, like expecting me to give different answers each time.

I mean how many times can you answer are you a chicken? before you go crazy,
or maybe thats the secret there, ask you the same question dozens of times, like your joining a cult or something.

sure some people like them, and sure it depends who is your line manager,
but when so many people around the world all say the same thing, word for world almost.
one has to put aside your doubts, and start seeing them for a meat grinder that chews up people.
and desperately trying to fill open slots from people that burned out, from the stress.

otherwise why advertise all the time, unless they hire/fire people so often that they have to keep spreading good publicity around.
so people don't get wise to their schemes.

ask yourself this, if they so good, why aren't people clamoring to get hired by them?
Not to get personal, but from your tone it sounds like you interviewed there and didn't get the position and are somewhat bitter.
 

jsheed_sa

Executive Member
Joined
May 27, 2005
Messages
5,031
#95
you right,
but amazon is different, how they treat their workers is universal across the board.
read lots of feedback on glassdoor and indeed and other sites how poorly they treat workers.

from the tech support, to the devs, to the admin to the pickers working on the warehouse floor,

everybody gets treated the same, badly, except the top of the top dogs.
sure @ArtyLoop wife will back me up here.
I'm going to call this out as incorrect. I'm a current AWS tech employee and this is simply not the case.

Every company has it's problems, but you're attributing issues Amazon staff suffer to AWS, which is simply incorrect.
 
Last edited:

terencej

Expert Member
Joined
Jun 4, 2012
Messages
2,542
#96
Wouldn't mind working at AWS. But I am one of those self taught devs with no Uni degrees so this CS theory and Data structure questions might catch me out big-time in interviews.
That, and the fact that I have not been long with my current company.

Maybe by the end of the year I might try if they are still looking.
 
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