Do not type your PIN in reverse at an ATM

faniebraai said:
View attachment 422518
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backstreetboy said:
https://www.fnb.co.za/demos/view-your-pin-PC.html
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Interesting, I don't get those options on my login.
Question - anyone know which other banks store your PINs?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_identification_number
PIN validation

There are several main methods of validating PINs. The operations discussed below are usually performed within a hardware security module (HSM).
IBM 3624 method

One of the earliest ATM models was the IBM 3624, which used the IBM method to generate what is termed a natural PIN. The natural PIN is generated by encrypting the primary account number (PAN), using an encryption key generated specifically for the purpose.[8] This key is sometimes referred to as the PIN generation key (PGK). This PIN is directly related to the primary account number. To validate the PIN, the issuing bank regenerates the PIN using the above method, and compares this with the entered PIN.

Natural PINs can not be user selectable because they are derived from the PAN. If the card is reissued with a new PAN, a new PIN must be generated.

Natural PINs allow banks to issue PIN reminder letters as the PIN can be generated.
IBM 3624 + offset method

To allow user selectable PINs it is possible to store a PIN offset value. The offset is found by subtracting natural PIN from the customer selected PIN using modulo 10.[9] For example, if the natural PIN is 1234, and the user wishes to have a PIN of 2345, the offset is 1111.

The offset can be stored either on the card track data,[10] or in a database at the card issuer.

To validate the PIN, the issuing bank calculates the natural PIN as in the above method, then adds the offset and compares this value to the entered PIN.
VISA method
When using this credit card terminal, a VISA cardholder swipes or inserts their credit card, and enters their PIN on the keypad

The VISA method is used by many card schemes and is not VISA-specific. The VISA method generates a PIN verification value (PVV). Similar to the offset value, it can be stored on the card's track data, or in a database at the card issuer. This is called the reference PVV.

The VISA method takes the rightmost eleven digits of the PAN excluding the checksum value, a PIN validation key index (PVKI, chosen from one to six) and the required PIN value to make a 64 bit number, the PVKI selects a validation key (PVK, of 128 bits) to encrypt this number. From this encrypted value, the PVV is found.[11]

To validate the PIN, the issuing bank calculates a PVV value from the entered PIN and PAN and compares this value to the reference PVV. If the reference PVV and the calculated PVV match, the correct PIN was entered.

Unlike the IBM method, the VISA method doesn't derive a PIN. The PVV value is used to confirm the PIN entered at the terminal, was also used to generate the reference PVV. The PIN used to generate a PVV can be randomly generated or user selected or even derived using the IBM method.
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If I'm understanding correctly, there should be no need to store the pin and doing so would be a security risk.
 
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faniebraai said:
And parking machines are accepting cards now as well.
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Not where we stay an in any case I don't stick my cards into just anything. A parking machine will be the last on my list considering how unreliable most of them are anyway.
 
Geoff.D said:
Not where we stay an in any case I don't stick my cards into just anything. A parking machine will be the last on my list considering how unreliable most of them are anyway.
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I've seen this in Cape Town too.
 
faniebraai said:
And parking machines are accepting cards now as well.
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Some, unfortunately not all. It's a pain in the butt as I never have cash on my, and now you have to go to an ATM to pay R30 odd.
 
faniebraai said:
I've seen lots of them at shopping malls. You'll see the pay station has a Visa/Mastercard sign on them, you slide your card into the same slot as the parking ticket.
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In Cape Town I'm only aware of Canal Walk that has this.
 
Cr419 said:
Some, unfortunately not all. It's a pain in the butt as I never have cash on my, and now you have to go to an ATM to pay R30 odd.
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I was at a mall on Monday... R5. Looking for change... I only had R4, because 50c are not accepted. Just before I stripped my moer, I saw the Visa/MasterCard signs. :D
 
Cr419 said:
Just tried that, and yes, I can see my pin.
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Yoh... seriously... time for a new bank.
I think mine don't show because I cancelled my accounts (and yes, I can still access the UI and login to it!).
Talking of which, I see two cards listed there - a credit card and a petro card that aren't cancelled according to them. They are 'New' accounts'. I haven't even collected those cards.
I cancelled with FNB after hearing about fraud at a local branch... that and the crap online banking system that suggests you're getting a good deal when it offers you '3 months statements for free'. LOL
 
faniebraai said:
I was at a mall on Monday... R5. Looking for change... I only had R4, because 50c are not accepted. Just before I stripped my moer, I saw the Visa/MasterCard signs. :D
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HAHAHA.
Word for word how I discovered it :D
 
Heavyonthemagick said:
Yoh... seriously... time for a new bank.
I think mine don't show because I cancelled my accounts (and yes, I can still access the UI and login to it!).
Talking of which, I see two cards listed there - a credit card and a petro card that aren't cancelled according to them. They are 'New' accounts'. I haven't even collected those cards.
I cancelled with FNB after hearing about fraud at a local branch... that and the crap online banking system that suggests you're getting a good deal when it offers you '3 months statements for free'. LOL
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FNB has the best internet banking in the country. Fact.
 
faniebraai said:
FNB has the best internet banking in the country. Fact.
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Make is the definition of best?

What is my goal: I want to send my money from my account to your account for next to nothing.

Capitec does exactly that.

So what does FNB do? Do they send the money faster do they charge less?

What is the best?
 
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