DSTV price increase

How do you feel about these increases?

  • One too many for me, I will be canceling my subscription

    Votes: 74 30.6%
  • It is still better than having SABC

    Votes: 53 21.9%
  • I think I will have to download my series from now on

    Votes: 87 36.0%
  • I am not sure yet

    Votes: 24 9.9%
  • It is still cheap

    Votes: 4 1.7%

  • Total voters
    242
I'm a thief (according to you), remember! :D

Stealing IP by downloading it is still stealing. You can try justify it as much as you want to but it stays stealing. Maybe next time I refuse to pay for bandwidth I'll come park outside your house and leech off your wireless and we'll see how you like that.
 
Stealing IP by downloading it is still stealing. You can try justify it as much as you want to but it stays stealing. Maybe next time I refuse to pay for bandwidth I'll come park outside your house and leech off your wireless and we'll see how you like that.

Hmmm... here is that copyright act again.

http://www.buys.co.za/publications/cyberlaw/CopyrightAct.htm

please show me where the word stealing, or theft appears anywhere in that act.

I think what you are referring to is "unlicensed" use... and the act even makes exceptions for that in terms of personal use.

Here is a simple guide for you...

http://mybroadband.co.za/photos/data/500/piracy.jpg

and BTW, I don't use wireless at home. It is inherently unsecure. ;) But you are welcome to come inside and share my internet. You can check out my DVD collection at the same time then. :)
 
I'd like to join the small group of pariahs and say that the subscription increase is less than 7% - not unreasonable (inflation etc.). That being said, R500 is still a huge amount of money.

Yes, with inflation being higher than that - this is actually a 'decrease' in price, is it not?
 
Crowley : In this country downloading an episode for personal use is NOT classified as stealing, it is Fair Use.... Because you think its stealing, does not make it so...

And actually you'll find a large chunk of the "cost" of producing these programs is offset by product placements, so you're not costing anyone, other than the "distributors" money, which they possibly wouldn't have made anyway because you wouldn't have paid them for the program...

Brush up on the law IN THIS COUNTRY and then come back and try debate this issue....
 
Crowley : In this country downloading an episode for personal use is NOT classified as stealing, it is Fair Use.... Because you think its stealing, does not make it so...

And actually you'll find a large chunk of the "cost" of producing these programs is offset by product placements, so you're not costing anyone, other than the "distributors" money, which they possibly wouldn't have made anyway because you wouldn't have paid them for the program...

Brush up on the law IN THIS COUNTRY and then come back and try debate this issue....

Hear hear.
 
wow people may complain but they will still pay

anyone wanna trade series saves on downloading
 
Stealing IP by downloading it is still stealing. You can try justify it as much as you want to but it stays stealing. Maybe next time I refuse to pay for bandwidth I'll come park outside your house and leech off your wireless and we'll see how you like that.

Name me one (yes just one) case in SA where somebody has been prosecuted for this 'stealing'.
 
Thank you Multichoice, you have convinced me that upgrading & expanding our internet connnection & bandwidth, in stead of spending money on your lame bouquets, inc. repeats & ads is the way to go. An additional R500.00 rand per month will soon be available to spend on broadband.

(Well actually I must thank my super successful neighbour for this plan of action. She suggested the 'stuff Multichoice & upgrade internet' scenario. I have ignored her advice in the past & regretted it; not this time.)

PS. The 'Turner Classic Movies' radio ad sucs!
 
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I'll finish off with just one question since most of you can't grasp the concept that I am trying to get through to you.

If you make something that cost you a lot of money to make and that you expect to get paid for and somebody comes along and uses it without paying for it, would you see that as theft?
 
If you make something that cost you a lot of money to make and that you expect to get paid for and somebody comes along and uses it without paying for it, would you see that as theft?

Depends on what you are talking about. If it's a physical thing, like a car, then yes. If it's intangible things like software, then no.

Copyright infringement != theft.
 
Actually, how about this to screw you over a bit Crowley...

Software houses that write software don't own the IP or the Code if they didn't "develop" the idea for the software...

And software is ever so slightly different from a tv series in terms of IP and copyright law...

so fail on your part... try again.
 
Actually, how about this to screw you over a bit Crowley...

Software houses that write software don't own the IP or the Code if they didn't "develop" the idea for the software...

Where exactly did you dig up that gem? Read a bit more here.
By way of background, the intellectual property rights that apply to computer software are as follows.

* Trademarks protect the name of the software and prevent another party from commercialising software with the same name.

* Copyright protects the code, source code, screen layouts etc from unauthorised copying.

* Patents protect the underlying novel and inventive functionality of the software irrespective of the coding language.

And software is ever so slightly different from a tv series in terms of IP and copyright law...

If it's intangible things like software, then no.

See what I did there, I posted something in reply to somebody elses post. RTFP

so fail on your part... try again
I'm sure you can do better than that.
 
Regarding some of the off topic notes in this thread :

1) Rather downloading TV shows on a "normal" internet connection in South Africa most likely will be more expensive than any DSTV subscription @ ~R70/Gb :) Unless you have an uncapped connection... which brings us to...

2) People downloading their favourite shows on uncapped, pay their appropriate dues while waiting for a YouTube clip to load up @ ~192kbps or less after reaching their rolling 10 day threshold... :P

3)...
So pirating tv series and movies are fine but you throw your toys out of the cot over a R30 increase from Multichoice who has to pay the studios for those same shows? The studios probably put their prices up because of the amount of piracy going on so indirectly you are collectively probably responsible for the increases.

Good going.
While I am a big advocate of "open and free information", as the guys like Crowley rightly point out, technically it is illegal, if not always upholdable in a court of law...

So for my silly attempt at a counter-"case in point", I hope all the violent protesters for anti-piracy are not doing 130km/h on any national highways or 70km/h on any suburb roads... In these cases, the offenders should please all turn themselves in to the nearest JMPD officer (that is not striking, of course) at their earliest conveniece or STFU about IP piracy. Endangering lives is not "fair use" people... :P

I digress.
 
Crowley : Again, you need to reference law in this country.....

Here we go to help you on your way : http://www.mybroadband.co.za/nephp/?m=show&id=2877

See what I did there?.. I referenced something that is relevant to the country that we live in, rather than what I think or feel is the right way.... That is the law, that is what stands... whether we like it or not.
 
See what I did there?.. I referenced something that is relevant to the country that we live in, rather than what I think or feel is the right way.... That is the law, that is what stands... whether we like it or not.

If you bothered reading the other pages you would see that I did point out that it is the way that I feel. Not the laws of the country. I don't need a law to tell me when something is wrong, I can think for myself.
 
I'll finish off with just one question since most of you can't grasp the concept that I am trying to get through to you.

If you make something that cost you a lot of money to make and that you expect to get paid for and somebody comes along and uses it without paying for it, would you see that as theft?

no, that is what is called "unlicensed use" or a "bootleg copy" since it does not come from an "official" distribution channel as you call it. The "owner" would have a civil claim against the bootlegger (if he was distributing it for financial gain). He would have a VERY hard time proving a claim against a home user who could just log on to the TV station and watch that content for free anyway. He would also have a very hard time priving a criminal offence unless the bootlegger was selling his IP for profit. There is no profit in file-sharing so the courts have pretty much stayed away from the issue and left it in the "fair-use" (personal use) category. It is not theft because nothing has been removed from the possession of the owner. It is simply classed as "unlicensed use". Your use of the term "theft" would draw peals of laughter from a court of law. And your classing those who download episodes with other law-breakers is a favourite tactic of the MPAA/RIAA Mafia alliance.

The fact is, that the large majority of downloaders are consumers as well. They are buying bandwidth, they are buying DVDs and TVs, etc. They are not just free agents. They have simply chosen to spend their money in a different direction. By spending our money on bandwidth rather than DSTV, we are hoping that the content producers will notice where the money is being spent and move to adopt those new distribution channels. The problem is they are too slow and lethargic to do that.... so the consumers are exploiting the gap in the market.

One example. The producers of the hit TV show "Lost" have chosen to limit distribution to the USA only. Other countries in the world have to buy the show entire seasons at a time, typically up to a year behind schedule. This has caused Lost to become one of the most downloaded shows on the Internet. Now if they were to make the show available on their website either for a small charge or with attached commercials (my best suggestion), they could be making millions. But they choose to completely ignore this channel and thereby are losing millions of dollars in revenue. They are simply too bent on honoring their old distribution model. As a result I choose to download Lost from the internet rather and then wait until the DVDs are released to watch the special features. I have already bought all four released seasons so far (and I saved hundreds of Rands by waiting six months after the release date!) :) I am in the process of downloading season five. And you can bet when that is finished I will be adding that set to my collection of Buffy, Angel, Stargate, Prison Break, Hereos and other sets that I own. heck I saved over R10,000 in the last two years by giving up DSTV, that made room for me to buy a ton more DVDs and bandwidth.

I have no problem with doing it this way and obviously the law also has no problem with it. ;) so you can b1tch and whine all you want about poor DSTV losing its revenue, but I am still not going to pay their extortion prices. I have unlimited local bandwidth through M-Web for less than R300 a month. The other R200 a month gets me some nice DVDs.

I think a lot more people should consider adopting this model. Then DSTV will be forced to bring their pricing to a more sane level.... or might consider switching their distribution method to the internet :)
 
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