E-tolls will go ahead

SpiderMonkey said:
Regardless of the costs/tenders/etc, the problem with not getting e-Tag is this:

1) The total you will be charged will be a lot more. Something like 3 times the amount IIRC from the last time they gave figures.
2) You will not have the R550 cap.

Add those two together and you could end up with a hefty amount owing. It's easy to say that you are not going to pay. What happens when they take you to court? Still not going to pay? Someone who could owe R550 per month for 2 months could be in the hole for R20k after the higher rates and without the cap. That's enough money for SANRAL to go after you with a big stick. If they prosecute a few people to set an "example" then what will you do? By then it will be too late. You will already owe a chunk of cash. There are a lot of big companies that will be paying their tolls. They can't afford to get involved so you will probably find that SANRAL gets a sizable percentage out of the starting block from these guys. My guess is that these big companies will make up somewhere between 20% and 40% of the total toll revenue (trucks, rental cars, company vehicles, delivery vehicles, etc).

Me, I am not going to take any chances. Call me a sell out or whatever you want but I am definitely not going to take that sort of chance.
Click to expand...

Sell out!
 
SpiderMonkey said:
Regardless of the costs/tenders/etc, the problem with not getting e-Tag is this:

1) The total you will be charged will be a lot more. Something like 3 times the amount IIRC from the last time they gave figures.
2) You will not have the R550 cap.

Add those two together and you could end up with a hefty amount owing. It's easy to say that you are not going to pay. What happens when they take you to court? Still not going to pay? Someone who could owe R550 per month for 2 months could be in the hole for R20k after the higher rates and without the cap. That's enough money for SANRAL to go after you with a big stick. If they prosecute a few people to set an "example" then what will you do? By then it will be too late. You will already owe a chunk of cash. There are a lot of big companies that will be paying their tolls. They can't afford to get involved so you will probably find that SANRAL gets a sizable percentage out of the starting block from these guys. My guess is that these big companies will make up somewhere between 20% and 40% of the total toll revenue (trucks, rental cars, company vehicles, delivery vehicles, etc).

Me, I am not going to take any chances. Call me a sell out or whatever you want but I am definitely not going to take that sort of chance.
Click to expand...

If you are going to buy an etag, do not give SANRAL your bank account details, go for the prepaid option with no auto-topup, that should mean that what you "owe" in toll fees is capped and charged at the lower rate, query every single charge and delay paying any money into your prepaid etolly account.
 
SpiderMonkey said:
Regardless of the costs/tenders/etc, the problem with not getting e-Tag is this:

1) The total you will be charged will be a lot more. Something like 3 times the amount IIRC from the last time they gave figures.
2) You will not have the R550 cap.

Add those two together and you could end up with a hefty amount owing. It's easy to say that you are not going to pay. What happens when they take you to court? Still not going to pay? Someone who could owe R550 per month for 2 months could be in the hole for R20k after the higher rates and without the cap. That's enough money for SANRAL to go after you with a big stick. If they prosecute a few people to set an "example" then what will you do? By then it will be too late. You will already owe a chunk of cash. There are a lot of big companies that will be paying their tolls. They can't afford to get involved so you will probably find that SANRAL gets a sizable percentage out of the starting block from these guys. My guess is that these big companies will make up somewhere between 20% and 40% of the total toll revenue (trucks, rental cars, company vehicles, delivery vehicles, etc).

Me, I am not going to take any chances. Call me a sell out or whatever you want but I am definitely not going to take that sort of chance.
Click to expand...

This is another point of contention. How can you persecute someone based on their choice of payment?
 
People with paintball guns need to practice their skills on the gantries :D

Every night if need be ;)
 
j4ck455 said:
If you are going to buy an etag, do not give SANRAL your bank account details, go for the prepaid option with no auto-topup, that should mean that what you "owe" in toll fees is capped and charged at the lower rate, query every single charge and delay paying any money into your prepaid etolly account.
Click to expand...

That makes sense. What I think people are missing is the much higher rate that trucks and co pay. Each one of the trucks is probably worth 10 cars and there is no way big corporates will go into arrears. It's one thing for people to use civil disobedience but quite another for businesses. After that they just have to go after a couple of choice targets (high value) in order to set an example. It's not the public that will make or break this thing. It will only be won through legal channels because companies like the freight or shipping companies will not put themselves in the firing line and they will make up a sizable chunk of the money.
 
SpiderMonkey said:
Me, I am not going to take any chances. Call me a sell out or whatever you want but I am definitely not going to take that sort of chance.
Click to expand...

it's exactly this kind of thinking by the sheeple that is going to lead to any sort of boycott ending in failure, if we all stand together and give them the finger the system will crash, I think somebody mentioned in another thread that all it will take is 20% or something like that of non compliance and the system will be overloaded, they cannot take the entire population of Gauteng to court
 
Ol' Mean Bastid said:
it's exactly this kind of thinking by the sheeple that is going to lead to any sort of boycott ending in failure, if we all stand together and give them the finger the system will crash, I think somebody mentioned in another thread that all it will take is 20% or something like that of non compliance and the system will be overloaded, they cannot take the entire population of Gauteng to court
Click to expand...

I share your frustration, but sadly the world has many people that have no guts
 
Ol' Mean Bastid said:
it's exactly this kind of thinking by the sheeple that is going to lead to any sort of boycott ending in failure, if we all stand together and give them the finger the system will crash, I think somebody mentioned in another thread that all it will take is 20% or something like that of non compliance and the system will be overloaded, they cannot take the entire population of Gauteng to court
Click to expand...

How will the system fall down or become overloaded? It would already be able to handle the high volumes regardless of whether people pay or don't pay. The only part that can fall over is collection. The big problem is that it's not like a TV license where everyone pays the same amount. The only way that it will fail is if no one (including the companies) pays. The amounts will be different so it will be easy for SANRAL to chose who to go after first. Companies will pay out of the gate. They can't take a chance. So SANRAL will probably be getting in 20%-30% of their revenue to start off with. They just need to cherry pick who to go after. Small Businesses / Travelling Salesman / etc. They can pick those people with R50k+ in outstanding fees and go after them. It's worth taking those to court because of the huge amount of money at stake. Prosecute a few of those successfully and they will get a big chunk of settlements. People will be losing their cars/houses because they decided not to pay the R550 per month. SANRAL can next target the R40k-R50k people. The only way a boycott would work is if everyone was only in for a small amount (<R1000). The R550 limit and heavy penalties (without limit) when you don't pay is very clever (sneaky?) because when you don't pay, things can very quickly get out of hand.
 
SpiderMonkey said:
How will the system fall down or become overloaded? It would already be able to handle the high volumes regardless of whether people pay or don't pay. The only part that can fall over is collection. The big problem is that it's not like a TV license where everyone pays the same amount. The only way that it will fail is if no one (including the companies) pays. The amounts will be different so it will be easy for SANRAL to chose who to go after first. Companies will pay out of the gate. They can't take a chance. So SANRAL will probably be getting in 20%-30% of their revenue to start off with. They just need to cherry pick who to go after. Small Businesses / Travelling Salesman / etc. They can pick those people with R50k+ in outstanding fees and go after them. It's worth taking those to court because of the huge amount of money at stake. Prosecute a few of those successfully and they will get a big chunk of settlements. People will be losing their cars/houses because they decided not to pay the R550 per month. SANRAL can next target the R40k-R50k people. The only way a boycott would work is if everyone was only in for a small amount (<R1000). The R550 limit and heavy penalties (without limit) when you don't pay is very clever (sneaky?) because when you don't pay, things can very quickly get out of hand.
Click to expand...

can't remember the exact %, but according to Sanral ~87% of people will be below R100/mnth i.e. most
Wait till people claim they have to pay for duplicate plates and wait for the post office to handle the delivery of the accounts

Gonna be fun!
 
BS

Garyvdh said:
It is illegal to withhold your license disc even for outstanding fines, so what makes you think it would be legal to withhold it for a civil debt?
Click to expand...
I do not listen to you any more Gary -- you are just full of BS
Go blow up a pylon or two
and
I might find some respect for you
or
Perhaps take what you say with a bit more than a bag of salt !
 
b@nD said:
I do not listen to you any more Gary -- you are just full of BS
Go blow up a pylon or two
and
I might find some respect for you
or
Perhaps take what you say with a bit more than a bag of salt !
Click to expand...

Go blow a wistle. :whistle:

or a

vuvuzelas1.jpg
 
Fun Fun Fun - til the Gov takes your FREEDOM away !

Bundu said:
Wait till people claim they have to pay for duplicate plates and wait for the post office to handle the delivery of the accounts
Gonna be fun!
Click to expand...
Wait until the new microchip is linked to your bank account -- and EVERYTHING else !
NO choice about whether to pay or not
K@K en BETAAL dis die ou wet van Transvaal ! ( new law of the ANC )

I am really really suprised that you people ( that are bright and in IT ) are not getting the BIG picture YET ?
 
b@nD said:
Wait until the new microchip is linked to your bank account -- and EVERYTHING else !
NO choice about whether to pay or not
K@K en BETAAL dis die ou wet van Transvaal ! ( new law of the ANC )

I am really really suprised that you people ( that are bright and in IT ) are not getting the BIG picture YET ?
Click to expand...

are you senile?
Conspiracy much?
 
b@nD said:
Wait until the new microchip is linked to your bank account -- and EVERYTHING else !
NO choice about whether to pay or not
K@K en BETAAL dis die ou wet van Transvaal ! ( new law of the ANC )

I am really really suprised that you people ( that are bright and in IT ) are not getting the BIG picture YET ?
Click to expand...

I think you need to spend some time in empirex's threads.. you seem to be living in a similar reality.
 
AlphaBravo said:
Yep, maybe the rest of the country would like to get more involved at this stage and not only us gauties.
Click to expand...

marine1 said:
The rest of SA cannot understand why we are fighting this....wait until they bring this to your provinces. Its on the way
Click to expand...

I would like to just point out to both of you, that some people in the rest of SA have been fighting this with you guys, and should it come our way we will continue to fight.
 
b@nD said:
Wait until the new microchip is linked to your bank account -- and EVERYTHING else !
NO choice about whether to pay or not
K@K en BETAAL dis die ou wet van Transvaal ! ( new law of the ANC )

I am really really suprised that you people ( that are bright and in IT ) are not getting the BIG picture YET ?
Click to expand...

Further proof that you are the banned "Wizard" that casts conspiracy spells in "the witching hour".
 
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