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Jean Claude Vaaldamme
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F1 BREAKING NEWS: Mercedes caught cheating, Russell disqualified
George Russell has been disqualified from the result of the Belgian Grand Prix after his Mercedes was found to be underweight following the race, meaning that teammate Lewis Hamilton has been promoted to winner.
www.autoracing1.com
The report then reads: “The car was not fully drained according to the draining procedure submitted by the team in their legality documents as TR Article 6.5.2 is fulfilled.
“The car was weighed again on the FIA inside and outside scales and the weight was 796.5 kg. The calibration of the outside and inside scales was confirmed and witnessed by the competitor."
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Definitely going to be interesting to see why they were underweight."F1 BREAKING NEWS: Mercedes caught cheating, Russell disqualified
George Russell has been disqualified from the result of the Belgian Grand Prix after his Mercedes was found to be underweight following the race, meaning that teammate Lewis Hamilton has been promoted to winner.www.autoracing1.com
However, a Technical Delegate’s Report released after the race stated that, while the car had initially been found to be compliant with the minimum weight of 798kg, 2.8 liters of fuel were then removed.
The report then reads: “The car was not fully drained according to the draining procedure submitted by the team in their legality documents as TR Article 6.5.2 is fulfilled.
“The car was weighed again on the FIA inside and outside scales and the weight was 796.5 kg. The calibration of the outside and inside scales was confirmed and witnessed by the competitor."
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redspark
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An interesting bit of science there. I am assuming atmospheric pressure has some influence, esp. outdoors.
I.am.Sam
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apparently the tyres ....horny said it can add to over a kg
Jean Claude Vaaldamme
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Why. Do you think the atmospheric pressure inside your house is less than outside?
We should be discussing why Merc did not do the proper fuel drain procedure.
Only conclusion is they knew the car was underweight. Cheating, but I bet they will come up with some great excuse.
I know you're not a fan of Merc. However, are you happy that the race winner got disqualified? Or that there may be cheating?
Jean Claude Vaaldamme
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Deflection?
For the last 3 years we hear from Merc fans about other teams cheating. So that is the discussion now. Cheating.
What is your opinion on Merc not following the correct draining procedure?
So possibly because he 1 stopped he used more tyres and thus went under weight? Crazy if true
I saw a few comments about picking up marbles on the cooldown lap that adds weight.
but from what I understand the issue is actually a Fuel level issue, a mistake made by the team.
so they put too much fuel in, and because of that, ran it with not enough additional ballast weights.
so this was likely a mistake that happened in the pre race set up where it car was checked by the team, they made a calculation mistake.
remember, the Car and the Driver together must weigh in at 798 KG. that will be changed to 800KG next year for Driver health, as keeping the two tall drivers (Russel and Ocon at over 180cm that is tall for a driver) under the 80kg weight limit is not healthy. Yuki has a lot more ballast than Ocon has because he is so short.
I don't think the fact the car was lighter is an advantage for GR btw.
if the mistake the team made had not happened, then there would have been a small 1.5KG weight added as ballast and that does not slosh around like fuel does, giving the car overall better handling. they can also add the weights in different places, to help with handling.
Fuel will move in corners, making the handling different in different conditions. where the metal ballast is stable.
but from what I understand the issue is actually a Fuel level issue, a mistake made by the team.
so they put too much fuel in, and because of that, ran it with not enough additional ballast weights.
so this was likely a mistake that happened in the pre race set up where it car was checked by the team, they made a calculation mistake.
remember, the Car and the Driver together must weigh in at 798 KG. that will be changed to 800KG next year for Driver health, as keeping the two tall drivers (Russel and Ocon at over 180cm that is tall for a driver) under the 80kg weight limit is not healthy. Yuki has a lot more ballast than Ocon has because he is so short.
I don't think the fact the car was lighter is an advantage for GR btw.
if the mistake the team made had not happened, then there would have been a small 1.5KG weight added as ballast and that does not slosh around like fuel does, giving the car overall better handling. they can also add the weights in different places, to help with handling.
Fuel will move in corners, making the handling different in different conditions. where the metal ballast is stable.
There was no deflection, I asked you a straight question. You're very cynical it seems.
I don't know enough about the post race proceedings to have much of an informed opinion, though obviously if there's a standardized procedure, they should have followed that. Not sure why they didn't, seems odd, even suspicious.
not by 1.5KG if it was less than 500g then sure, driving and picking up marbles on the tyres could impact it but not by 1.5KG. that is ballast and fuel levels that Merc simply got wrong.
Jean Claude Vaaldamme
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So 0.3s per lap is not an advantage?
you do realize that he had more Fuel in his car than he was supposed to have right?
so his car while lighter in its "dry" weight than it should have been was not lighter than for example Yuki's car when it had its 1l of fuel removed.
in the FIA statement they say they removed the 1l they were supposed to remove and there was Fuel left. so that means there was more fuel in the car than there needed to be. and as pointed out, fuel being liquid is not as good as a metal ballast because it moves. so technically he was at a slight disadvantage.
but the fact remains, the team made a mistake, George got DQ'd and he lost the win.
he did not cross the line first because of the car being under weight, he crossed the line first because he made a 1 stop work, and that was a good strategic call he made, not the team, and that deserves praise.
so his car while lighter in its "dry" weight than it should have been was not lighter than for example Yuki's car when it had its 1l of fuel removed.
in the FIA statement they say they removed the 1l they were supposed to remove and there was Fuel left. so that means there was more fuel in the car than there needed to be. and as pointed out, fuel being liquid is not as good as a metal ballast because it moves. so technically he was at a slight disadvantage.
but the fact remains, the team made a mistake, George got DQ'd and he lost the win.
he did not cross the line first because of the car being under weight, he crossed the line first because he made a 1 stop work, and that was a good strategic call he made, not the team, and that deserves praise.
Jean Claude Vaaldamme
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So You think all the other cars drive on the limit and only have 1l of fuel left exactly? Bit high risk I would say. It they drive like that we would see disqualifications more often.
I do believe they Race it to the limit and only leave 1l of Fuel in at the end of the race.
and we have had examples of this happening before. Seb in his Aston got a DQ not too long ago for being under 1l of fuel....
and we have had examples of this happening before. Seb in his Aston got a DQ not too long ago for being under 1l of fuel....
Pretty much yes. As close as engineeringly possible.
I'm guessing DTS hasn't covered lift/coast and under fuelling strategy before?
With all the high tech F1 teams have at their disposal, it is very hard to argue that they didn't know. I am pretty sure they know at all times the levels of anything that is happening with their cars.
I think this was a fck up before the start and they never thought George was going to win and tried to "clean it up" after wards. It failed, they got klapped over the fingers with a DQ.. and that was that.
I don't think they were deliberatly trying to cheat, but they were being sus with trying to cover it up.
I am very sure of it that other teams have done similar things in the past and perhaps just gotten away with it.
There are so fine margins in this sport, all the teams are on the edge of legal things at all times. I just feel bad for Russel, he drove a really fine race yesterday.
I think this was a fck up before the start and they never thought George was going to win and tried to "clean it up" after wards. It failed, they got klapped over the fingers with a DQ.. and that was that.
I don't think they were deliberatly trying to cheat, but they were being sus with trying to cover it up.
I am very sure of it that other teams have done similar things in the past and perhaps just gotten away with it.
There are so fine margins in this sport, all the teams are on the edge of legal things at all times. I just feel bad for Russel, he drove a really fine race yesterday.
Jean Claude Vaaldamme
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Until you can come with exact facts I will take it with a pinch of salt. Margins are always build in.
I am still waiting for the DTS episode of all the Mercedes cheating. Did Toto not step down at once stage? 2020/2021?
Dave
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Was that on DTS?
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